Visa Denied
 

Just heard the first couple of visa rejection letters are out. Wishing all the guys, all the best, hell maybe it's a blessing in disguise. Good luck boys.

Not only visa rejections, renewal rejections too. The six month grace period is about to expire and word is no more extensions, no more visas, no more jobs! What a bloody mess.

Massive blessing in disguise for the based pilots. Hopefully CX will get their comeuppance and go under. Utter :mad:

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....62fb43def.jpeg

Oh wow. Really, really didn’t see this coming. What utter shock.

Folks, it's been happening in other industries already (F&B being an obvious one) - they don't need no damn foreigners coming here...

Surely at some stage they will. How many visa holders have to leave to reach that point?

Load Toad

F&B? Food and Beverage or Finance and Banking? Either way HKG produces plenty of people suitable for these industries and I have no issue with localization. HKG Aviation is a little different as there is no local educator of pilots.

The best cadet pilots are those locals who attended a foreign university and started off flying on their own initiative. They are in many respects 'foreigners'. The worst are the 100% locals who get taken off the street by CX and are sent off to Aussie and turned into 'pilots'.

Perhaps this is all coming from PEK. Downsize CX to make it easier for GBA.

https://viewfromthewing.com/new-airl...-in-hong-kong/

GBA has plenty of “foreigners” working for them…(with PR)

I wonder if there is any other airline in the world where on one hand pilots seem to really really hate every moment, and on the other fight so hard to keep their job.

PS 25ish PR pilots from Canada alone chose to move their family over and continue to work for Cx..
( but of course vivaciously hate it here.

Bloody hell, I was starting to think you walked into the sunset and silently moved on, but it appears you have some new found “energy” to defend this poor excuse of a company and its management.
Could it be people hate working here, but currently have very little choice?
So at the same time they would be happy to continue fighting for improved conditions and a fairer distribution of wealth?
Nah, that can’t be it.

"Continue fighting for improved conditions"
😂

and "fairer distribution of wealth", would that be more $$$ for pilots?

hahahaha, Piet, you are unbeatable. Comedy Gold! For this alone it was worth posting.

I understand this sounds hilarious to a defeatist like yourself.
You bought into this “there’s no more money for payincrease” well before covid and cowered at the first intimidation tactic from management many moons ago.
And yet, lo and behold, even after 2 years of grounding almost the entire fleet, there is still money to keep guys sitting at home.

You know what’s Comedy Gold?
Watching this trainwreck with you in it from my hammock. That and your abundant use of emojis (and capital letters) to hide your pain.

Better abandon the AOA guys; STW guarantees there is no more money for pilots.
Again.
Even laughs at the idea.

He was wrong then and he is wrong now.
He will never see it, let alone admit it.
I get it. It’s pretty hard to see the state of aviation from his position of wealth and privilege.
He can’t see the situation he has left behind for you peasants.

Yes, STW: YOU did that, because you and your ilk never had the guts to stand up for what was right.
There are many who fall into your category, but not many who defend that lack of courage with the bravado that you do.

AQIS Boigu

Yeah, but the point I was trying to make was that by not renewing visas the HKG government (a puppet of PEK), is drastically reducing the ability of CX to ramp up once the borders open. CX has been hanging on to a lot of pilots who aren't working with the hope to cream it again soon (and the soon keeps on being delayed - by PEK). Without visas about 1/3 (?) of the pilots are gone. It takes a long time for retentive outfits like CX to recruit and process a pilot.

It will be interesting to see how things pan out for PR pilots in HKG. There finally could be some competition for their skills.

Wtf are you on about?

Cathay knew the permts would not be renewed, and they never had a choice. Otherwise, they would simply reopen the bases.

​​​​​Arrogant Gweilos have no place in China

controlledrest

I think uou are over thinkibg it .

Whatever F&B you care it to mean there are people in those industries who will use the exact same argument that you are using about piltots - and I'm not arguing with you at all on your comparision.

- Yes I also agree - directives are from PEK and no one dare or can disagree.

AQIS Boigu

Not all have PR. A dependant visa works too.

If somebody's PR has expired I understand it 'downgrades' to Right-to-Land. This, along with Dependant visas allows the Right to Live and Work in Hong Kong. Are any of the based pilots that want to return to CX in Hong Kong in this situation? Just curious, no skin in the game.

There has never been a requirement to have PR to return from a base or be employed with Cathay Pacific in Hong. The requirement is simply that you are legally authorised to perform employment and legally authorised to stay in Hong Kong, something that previously the Company sponsored and took care of. The sponsorship is no longer available, how you go about obtaining the right to live and work in Hong Kong doesn't matter be it right to land, dependents visa or something else.

New employment visas and renewals of employment visas going forward through sponsorship from the company are no longer an option.

When can you go back to old Contract ? After Visa problem solved ?

Rumors are that something similar will happen in Singapore, with the foreign pilots who were laid off in the big cull 12 months ago taking second place to unemployed and underemployed locals when hiring resumes.

Quite a few Singaporean pilots lost their overseas jobs and are back home twiddling their thumbs, in addition to SQ A380 drivers whose fleet had a 30% chop in aircraft numbers.

I wouldn't be surprised if every airline on the 9V register had to advertise locally and show that no suitable candidates were available before an employment visa could be issued to a foreigner.

Which is normal in any country, including yours. If there are sufficient locals to fill the spot, why the necessity to hire expats?

No government/management conspiracy here. Just good old fashioned incompetence by individuals well out of their depth. Have a look at the list of changing stories and arguments.

* Management arguing that work visa holder renewals for foreigners are necessary for the future of the company.
* Immigration Department initially disagreeing then ultimately agreeing with this argument.
* Management arguing that due to reduced workload there is no necessity for Hong Kong citizens and permanent residents to remain in the company beyond an arbitrary age.
* Forcefully “retired” Hong Kong citizens informing the immigration department of their availability to the Hong Kong aviation community.
* Management hiring pilots they don’t require to satisfy an Immigration Department requirement.
* Immigration department not seeing a reduction in locals who are qualified to perform the work due to management setting up
a revolving door by putting local pilots involuntarily back into the community.
* Management arguing that previously based crew should be issued with work visas as a necessity for the future of the company.
* Immigration Department rejecting that argument despite a work visa renewal having to meet the same criteria as a work visa initial issue. (Somehow the ID argue that a P1 rated captain can be readily replaced within the Hong Kong community but a P2X rated SO can’t be).


If anyone can see a conspiracy here by PEK/HK/CX/Swire then you’ve more imagination than me. I just see a continuation of decades of incompetence supported by differing stories depending on who’s arguing what to whom.

Whoever is last to leave, please remember to turn off all the lights. It shouldn't be long now.......

Indeed PW.

The sheer incompetence of Cathay management, and utter arrogance, is something for the aviation history books. They are complete criminal buffoons and we all hope they rot in hell. They get away with it here, and that's why London ships them over for a bit of a leg stretch.

Best to just knock it on the head and avoid the place.

There will be plenty of clowns and misfits who pitch up thinking the numbers look good, live with a family of 4 in a miserable shoe box, and good luck to them.

But there is a reason CX has avoided foolish applicants in the past, and yes, fools cause accidents, but the management don't care as they're on a revolving door policy, and the airline has got insurance (for now).

My prediction - CX is aviation history in 2 or so years.

I would agree but I think 2 years is optimistic. The powers up north are playing the slow game but the writing is on the wall, good luck to all of you. A bit of short term pain but ultimately most will look back as the day they left as a blessing.

All wrong.

In 2-3 years HKIA will have three runways and booming. The aviation market in Asia and China will continue to outgrow all other markets for as long as we live.

Hong Kong will be the financial centre of the greater bay area with 70 million people. It will still be the regional HQ of thousands of international companies and attracting hordes of expats from all over the world.

In 2035 the Greater Bay Area will be the biggest metropoly in the world, united with 8 other cities, offering the entire spectrum from production, design, finance and innovation within a 50 min train ride.

Cathay and Hong Kong will have a great future, with or without us, owned by Swire or China or both.

This is just the beginning. This is Asia's century.

Cadets who have known nothing but CX say the strangest things :rolleyes:

You just don't get it do you.

The plan all along is to shut down the White Man's airline.

Reverse the situation and have a Chinese airline with a HQ in London and calling themselves UK's airline. Can that work?

Sam Ting Wong

Oh my!! 😂

You have to hand it to STW - it's dead on topic.
Everyone whose visa is denied must be asking themselves why they applied in the first place.

CodyBlade

Facts help.

Beijing owns more CPA shares than London.
All of the company directors are Hong Kong residents except the 3 who are based in Beijing.
The airline’s headquarters are in Hong Kong.
The transport department has awarded the airline all the routes it bid for.
The Hong Kong government has used 27 billion dollars of taxpayer money to prop up a company that is only worth 40 billion.
The Hong Kong immigration department continues to renew work visas for foreign pilots.
The airline continues to pay those foreigners using taxpayer money.

The airline’s future is bleak but that’s due to a combination of mismanagement and circumstances. It was bleak long before COVID was ever heard of.
I appreciate its comforting for control freak pilots to believe they are the victims of a sinister plot rather than just being random small time participants in a very random world. If it helps you to sleep easier believing you’re the victim of competence then don’t let me stop you. It’s just I believe the opposite.

That's hilarious STW! I spat out my coffee everywhere and need to get another one now, thanks!

Good luck to you, and your beloved cesspit.

Where in my post does it say I love the place? Nothing could be further from the truth.

I am just not so conceited to believe my personal destiny makes any difference.

Just because we are not part of that future doesn't mean there isn't a future for the city and the locals.

There is no conspiracy against "the white man" or any other such phantasy, neither are there any safety issues, all that talk is just borne out of frustration. The market conditions have changed, that is all.

You guys will see, this place is and will be right in the centre of Asian's growth. It will strive, like it or not.

And Flying Clog, the only difference for you will be instead of flying the Chinese exports to the rest of the world, in the future you will deliver them by road. That and about 100k a year.

I'm going to miss

Just imagine what would happen if places like Australia, U.K., US, Canada, and Europe denied business/study visas for future cadets to train.

Sure we will issue a business/student visas for unqualified cadets after those displaced qualified people have been issued work permits and compensation.

Memorylapse

I need some of that Kool-aid. Maybe my attitude will get better. The visa denials are not going to affect anything short term. It'll just remove some of the 2016/2018 iCadets and DEFO's from the gene pool. If or when any bounce back happens these are the same people they will be able to pluck off the street in Downtown South East Asia. Or they can just go on Instagram... Maybe find a up an coming SO to join the two on the 74 for the clout....

Indeed, I'll have some of the Kool-Aid STW seems to be knocking back.

On second thought, no, I think I'll get the hell out of it before HKG implodes. Back to civilisation for me.

I'm with STW. The airline which occupys the kitty city of the future will once again prosper, but not until Swire have packed their bags. With mainland management, the gweilo pilots will be pushed out, replaced by cadets from a significantly larger school in Aus, and Chinese ex-military pilots.
Sorry for those wanting to return to HK with no visa, but I think they'll look back on it as a good time to depart (and receive a payout).
Will there be any US base to close? Surely you're all leaving anyway, or are you waiting for a redundancy payout?