Face facts: CX is now basically a LCC in all but name. The morale is equivalent to the worst of the LCC world, and so are the relative pay and benefits. People are barely on the line 6 months and are already looking for better opportunities. Long term FO's (10-11 yr) are resigning and starting over at their home carriers. Sickness levels are at industry highs, and so on and so on. The game is over at CX. It's a "job", but not much else anymore. There is really no career left here, and certainly there is little hope of a financially rewarding one. If you have a family, you will barely be at subsistence levels. CX is now only a name, and the substance and uniqueness that once marked the airline as a special career opportunity is long gone. If you value your career, your health, your family's happiness, then the sooner you are with an established carrier back home the sooner life will settle down and you can start living again. Not many of us left at CX can say we are actually "living"....just lurching from one unsatisfying and fatiguing roster to the next.

That's what you got out of the whole post?

Let me help you: whatever is happening in the heads of those who are breaking the training ban is for their own reconciliation, and reputations. Of course it doesn't help that some have chosen to do this, but the end game isn't materially affected as the package on offer now is so bad that market forces will make even that selfish act irrelevant. We are running out of pilots because the current money and career prospects are so rubbish that even with the new trainers, there aren't the resources to replace the hundreds that are waiting for start dates or retiring.

Lastly, you wont get a pay rise or better conditions for the rest of your time with this company. I think that is the "idea" most have, which is why they ARE leaving.

Spot on! Plus one from me.

You're full of BS. I've seen the figures and there ain't that many leaving. Even a monkey can read the seniority list and figure that out. Wish more would leave, then the company would be enthusiastic about extending the guys on RA55. If you wanted an obvious example of how the factual turnover isn't high, they're happy to let guys with a lot of experience head out the door at 55 because not many are actually quitting before then.

Pickup...I take it you are on 55 ? :rolleyes: As for your "there ain't that many leaving" comment, I guess that's the reason i'm on overtime every month, I keep getting called out as relief when on reserve, and my emails to and from colleagues that have all left in the past 24 months or so are just a figment of my imagination. And yes, as Cxerocst says above, what unpaid leave/seats/fleets??

Had a chat with a colleague who works "upstairs". The ULV is not due to an "excess" of aircrew, it's due to CX's usual incompetence that has resulted in a misallocation of aircrew on the wrong fleets. The true measure of aircrew levels is whether or not all allowed leave is allocated across the airline. In fact, they barely allocated little more than half this years leave (doubt that, go and have a look at available slots vs number of crew in each position and base).

Really?
 

Or everyone is approaching 900 hours. Why pay crews to sit at home when you can have them do it for free

If guys on bases in EASA territories are not getting their leave entitlement I suggest they report this to EASA, who will take immediate action...

Guys on bases especially in Europe will not report it. They are too afraid Cathay will just shut the base like they did in Paris Manchester etc

Plot
 

What, you mean that plot that started in 1994 !!! Anybody that didn't see it coming had their FU**ING eyes wide shut just like winner STW does today. By the time he finishes he'll be living offshore in Davao on POS 25 still trying to save up for that 850 sq/ft North facing public flat for his wife and child...

#AOA is 100% useless

CX is toast..

#CXit

Right, but it's ok for Flight Crew to continually bend over and let inept "leaders" abuse the crap out of us ??

#Delirious

#CXit.

Find an SO that's been here for about 2 years and ask them how many seniority numbers they've moved in that time. Last one I spoke to had moved up at a rate indicating about 5% attrition over 18 months.

Sure, i'll run that by the 6 Canadian FO's all joining Air Canada next week (787 in Vancouver or Toronto).....and the many more currently in the pipeline awaiting course dates.

Btw, 5% over 18 months....?, yet the time to upgrade is now starting to stretch out to between 5 and 6 years. You see the problem with your statement don't you?

Sorry. Meant to say 5% per annum. A fairly hefty rate for any airline. Would suggest that time to command blow out is due lack of training resources (until now) and the company shrinking the airline to avoid having to actually deal.

With Dragon Air, HK Express and HK Airlines, believe me, CX is never going to grow again. I have it on good authority that indeed that is the plan going forward. Expand the lower cost companies, and basically keep CX static. There is no career left at CX. It's toast.

Done Deal !!
 

Exactly MM.
All those SO's or DEFO's joined within the last few years your history is already written ! Plus it's not hard to see the progression chart wrote large on the wall 6 > 8 years SO before upgrade then, FO HK Express etc etc....

Surprise,THIS is how CX leadership works !!

Enjoy ;-)

#CXit

That would be the one they made up last month, ink still wet. Let's see if this version lasts until the next Swire posting cycle or if economic reality forces another change to that rule of law.

30 RA65s currently going per year for the next 3 to 4 and an increase after that. RA55 increasing as of now with estimates of 4 to 500 on that list over the next 10 years, peak in 2 years from now with the bulge of captains in their early 50s. No chance in hell? Parked aircraft affect short term bonuses.

Did you hear the people volunteering to be forced into training were automatically given top cover courtesy of the company plus instant cos 08 RA65 benefits.

Who is going to challenge this legally? You would run out of money and need retirement age 75 by the time the case is finished!

The extended retirement age for trainers precedence had been set before. Any challenge won't stand up. It's a seperate contact open to you as well if you want to jump in.

Well we all know who they are. They will have some lonely layovers and a lonely retirement as well. They made their choice

Well things can always get worse. Those that have been working for CX for more than a decade probably know what is coming:

1. Hong Kong, China and possibly entire world economy slowing and in recession by Q4 2019 or Q1 2020.
2. CX forward bookings crater and management begins to panic about looming losses.
3. Aircraft deliveries deferred and accelerated return of aircraft as leases expire.
4. This equals too many pilots and staff in general.
5. LWOP 2019/2020.

And how many of those 400/500 COS99 Pilots, many of whom are Captains, are going to "volunteer" for LWOP unless their retirement age is extended to 65 on full benefits? Particularly as they watch the value of their PFunds and property sink with retirement looming in less than 10 years.

Only in CX would you have a bunch of guys fighting over a vastly inferior contract just to hang around the place. You are all pathetic losers. How do you look yourselves in the mirror you spineless cowards?

Get a life.

Dilbert, I hope you feel better now that you've had the opportunity to vent. Take the rest of the day off....

Dan,

"Pretty sure giving RA65 to a very select group of employees would be seen as discriminatory in a Court of Law in this day in age."

RA 65 wasn't 'given' to anybody! We were all offered it and some, shortsightedly, chose not to take it. Case closed.