What will it take?
HA !
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
The problem is there ARE people heeding the ban, thus being terribly disadvantaged for doing what the AOA ask, while sufficient numbers ignore it to fill the courses.
Thus it is "Throw away your future as a futile gesture, or come and be labelled a scab!"
I asked this question previously:-
Will ANY AOA member come on here and state they think the ban will get the 49ers their jobs back?
If the answer is no, will ANY please explain what they hope it will now achieve?
Thus it is "Throw away your future as a futile gesture, or come and be labelled a scab!"
I asked this question previously:-
Will ANY AOA member come on here and state they think the ban will get the 49ers their jobs back?
If the answer is no, will ANY please explain what they hope it will now achieve?
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Wizofoz,
I'm not an AOA member and not a fan of the ban...however..
Perhaps not quite the statement you seek.. the ban as part of a wider strategy could, stress could, get some, stress some, of the 49ers their jobs back. Further, the ban, as part of a wider strategy, has prevented further 49ers.
One statement which you or anyone else can disagree with; doing nothing will result in no reinstatements and leaves the door wide open to further intimidation.
I'm not an AOA member and not a fan of the ban...however..
Perhaps not quite the statement you seek.. the ban as part of a wider strategy could, stress could, get some, stress some, of the 49ers their jobs back. Further, the ban, as part of a wider strategy, has prevented further 49ers.
One statement which you or anyone else can disagree with; doing nothing will result in no reinstatements and leaves the door wide open to further intimidation.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
G'day Liam, (I think you're a better musician than Noel by the way!)
Doing nothing results in no re-instatements- correct.
Taking completely ineffective action which divides your workplace and punishes innocents by either denying them an opportunity or branding them a blackleg- no reinstatements PLUS a negative result for ALL pilots involved. A classic lose-lose.
A wider strategy? The ban is over twelve months old. It must be VERY wide!!
The idea that any action is better than none is simplistic and foolish. Action that doesn't work, well, doesn't work!! And IF you show that you're reaction to an act of bastardry like the sacking of the 49 is to do ****** all whilst BELIEVING you're taking action, you've set a WORSE precedent than no action. They now know what you're response threshold is, and that the response will be pathetic!!
Doing nothing results in no re-instatements- correct.
Taking completely ineffective action which divides your workplace and punishes innocents by either denying them an opportunity or branding them a blackleg- no reinstatements PLUS a negative result for ALL pilots involved. A classic lose-lose.
A wider strategy? The ban is over twelve months old. It must be VERY wide!!
The idea that any action is better than none is simplistic and foolish. Action that doesn't work, well, doesn't work!! And IF you show that you're reaction to an act of bastardry like the sacking of the 49 is to do ****** all whilst BELIEVING you're taking action, you've set a WORSE precedent than no action. They now know what you're response threshold is, and that the response will be pathetic!!
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
Flex,
Because I've had friends adversely affected by the ban due to both the scenarios listed above.
Is the idea that the AOA should blunder on and not have its shortcomings even commented on?
Because I've had friends adversely affected by the ban due to both the scenarios listed above.
Is the idea that the AOA should blunder on and not have its shortcomings even commented on?
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 1,124
Likes: 16
From: GC Paradise
Wiz,
I've also had friends adversely affected who have not and will not join during the ban.
But more importantly, I have 49 friends adversely affected to the extreme by those who choose to take advantage of the plight of the same 49 and join during the ban.
We Professional Pilots had better learn to look after ourselves and our Profession because you can be damn sure managements around the OneWorld will not.
Look after your crew and friends on the ground as you do in the air, to ensure a safe and sucessful outcome to every endevour.
Merry Christmas
I've also had friends adversely affected who have not and will not join during the ban.
But more importantly, I have 49 friends adversely affected to the extreme by those who choose to take advantage of the plight of the same 49 and join during the ban.
We Professional Pilots had better learn to look after ourselves and our Profession because you can be damn sure managements around the OneWorld will not.
Look after your crew and friends on the ground as you do in the air, to ensure a safe and sucessful outcome to every endevour.
Merry Christmas
Guest
Posts: n/a
If the aim of the AOA is to get the 49' ers their jobs back, a Recruitment Ban (from an observers point of view) seems like a fairly weak gesture. Why isn't/wasn't the AOA more firm or stonger in the resolve to gain the positions back for those who lost their jobs? Surely their were stonger options available. It is hard to see a positive result from the current actions taken by the AOA. BTW did any Second Officers lose their jobs?
It seems rather unfair to expect newcomers to give up a job whilst they watch First Officer and Command Upgrades go ahead.
It seems rather unfair to expect newcomers to give up a job whilst they watch First Officer and Command Upgrades go ahead.
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 99
Likes: 0
From: Cloud Cuckoo Land
Anyone know how many of the so-called 49ers actually want or are available to have their jobs back?
I mean they've hardly all spent the last year swinging the lead down at the Beer Bay p1ssing up their colleagues union dues!
I mean they've hardly all spent the last year swinging the lead down at the Beer Bay p1ssing up their colleagues union dues!
Props are for boats!
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 994
Likes: 0
From: An Asian Hub
Well I concurr with 411a on this one, instead of a ban, why dont you go on strike. Thats how real unions get things done, thats how Australia ended with 35-40 hr week and 4 weeks holiday a year and 17.5 loading, 3 months long service etc. etc.
My Dad was a member of the FEDFA, a very strong union in the sixties and seventies, striking got results , not punitative bans.
Intestinal fortitude Sir is required, not a ban that requires no work from its working members, and compulsory cooperation from its pending members. Seems unrealistic to me. Put your money where your mouth is, if you want it, go get it, dont p#ss in the wind.
The responses in this forum, and others, surely justify something more than what your doing. No Guts no Glory I say, get on with, bring it on.
If you do, it will prove your unity to your fraternity and justify what your doing for the beginners.
May I ask what other measures, are the union taking?
From the outside seems to be a real stalemate at the moment.
Too me it sounds like 49 of your troops are down, but your staying in the trenches, no one wants to go over the top so to speak
Or are the conditions really not that bad
My Dad was a member of the FEDFA, a very strong union in the sixties and seventies, striking got results , not punitative bans.
Intestinal fortitude Sir is required, not a ban that requires no work from its working members, and compulsory cooperation from its pending members. Seems unrealistic to me. Put your money where your mouth is, if you want it, go get it, dont p#ss in the wind.
The responses in this forum, and others, surely justify something more than what your doing. No Guts no Glory I say, get on with, bring it on.
If you do, it will prove your unity to your fraternity and justify what your doing for the beginners.
May I ask what other measures, are the union taking?
From the outside seems to be a real stalemate at the moment.
Too me it sounds like 49 of your troops are down, but your staying in the trenches, no one wants to go over the top so to speak
Or are the conditions really not that bad
Last edited by Sheep Guts; 27th December 2002 at 04:10.
