Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > Fragrant Harbour
Reload this Page >

Current Info on CX post-covid

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Current Info on CX post-covid

Old 22nd Jan 2023, 05:04
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Canada
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Current Info on CX post-covid

Hi All,

I fully understand condition is not what it once was but due to other personal reason a relocation to Asia is required.

Trying to find out information regarding to the current roster, pay(#of hour expected to fly a month), and upgrade timeline for a DEFO.

Heard senority is no longer important for upgrade, lots of spots that need to be back filled due to the exitous, and the process is no longer as punishing as it once was.

And info on CX, HKE, HKA, GreaterBay regarding roster, pay, and upgrade timeline would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Smallworld is offline  
Old 22nd Jan 2023, 11:51
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bottom of the Harbour
Posts: 365
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Smallworld View Post
Hi All,

I fully understand condition is not what it once was but due to other personal reason a relocation to Asia is required.

Trying to find out information regarding to the current roster, pay(#of hour expected to fly a month), and upgrade timeline for a DEFO.

Heard senority is no longer important for upgrade, lots of spots that need to be back filled due to the exitous, and the process is no longer as punishing as it once was.

And info on CX, HKE, HKA, GreaterBay regarding roster, pay, and upgrade timeline would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Go to HK and get the job, itís that simple.

No need to BS about need to go, the decision is made.

Take whatever crap offer is on offer, the punishing is not over and people like you are the reason whyÖ.and you come here for what reason?

I like guys like you, itís the reason we still have PPRuNe, the generation XYZ. This is the generation that shall see pilots forever live in poverty as they cannot weigh up self worth outside the industry.
KABOY is offline  
Old 22nd Jan 2023, 12:36
  #3 (permalink)  
Rie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Wan Chai
Posts: 367
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Smallworld View Post
Hi All,

I fully understand condition is not what it once was but due to other personal reason a relocation to Asia is required.

Trying to find out information regarding to the current roster, pay(#of hour expected to fly a month), and upgrade timeline for a DEFO.

Heard senority is no longer important for upgrade, lots of spots that need to be back filled due to the exitous, and the process is no longer as punishing as it once was.

And info on CX, HKE, HKA, GreaterBay regarding roster, pay, and upgrade timeline would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Upgrade timeline simplified. Get in and the more you ask the quicker youíll get it. Suck up to the right people and service them and I heard itís before the end of your line training. If they donít like you itíll be 11-13 years plus, I guess most of us arenít liked.

Pay wise: POS18, HKEunlivable23, gba. In that order. You wonít be paid well like pre pandemic times. better off in the desert or get that visa to America.
Current delta 767 command is 4 months.
Rie is online now  
Old 22nd Jan 2023, 21:08
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: somewhere
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Rie View Post
Upgrade timeline simplified. Get in and the more you ask the quicker youíll get it. Suck up to the right people and service them and I heard itís before the end of your line training. If they donít like you itíll be 11-13 years plus, I guess most of us arenít liked.

Pay wise: POS18, HKEunlivable23, gba. In that order. You wonít be paid well like pre pandemic times. better off in the desert or get that visa to America.
Current delta 767 command is 4 months.
Zero seniority, a constantly changing COS with variable monthly flying hours and pay, an ever growing Chinese presence on the way of life in HK, just a few diabolical reasons not to go.
11-13 years is a very optimistic estimate- likely to be much longer considering an FO upgrade even is 6-7.
nkand is offline  
Old 23rd Jan 2023, 01:53
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: hong kong
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
the salary on FO1 pay scale is only good for a single person. FO2 only after 4-5 years. Many options in the States and Middle East. If youíre under 30 with another 35 years to go Ö by all means give HK a goÖ. If you have experience and close to command in your home country Ö donít bother coming, Youíll be bottom of the pile and youíll be looking at least 10 years to command in a city that has lost its sparkle.

Last edited by Gaisha; 23rd Jan 2023 at 08:07.
Gaisha is offline  
Old 23rd Jan 2023, 02:55
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2022
Location: UK
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
With their new contracts and contract-extentions, US major carriers Delta, Jetblue, United etc. are making nearly $400 an hour flying NARROWBODY. Not to mention 18% 401K contribution and amazing work rules. Why would you come here to HK? Go get that work visa!
FUPM102 is offline  
Old 23rd Jan 2023, 06:27
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: The Poorhouse
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
FO1 take home pay is around $60K-$70 HKD per month before tax. Do not expect to earn any significant extra flying hours as this is inconsistent and the roster is not stable. If you have a family, or want to have a family, expect your monthly rent to be 40%- 50% of your monthly salary. Schools fee's at most international schools are around $185K -$250 per year, per child (not including extra curricular). Cost of living is quite high, but its on par with other expensive cities. Public transport is cheap and you don't really need a car in most areas. If you do need a car, its expensive. Your spouse or partner will need to work and if you have a family, you will need a domestic helper unless you have family in town to help.

If you are young and don't have (or want) kids; or you do have kids but don't have a brain then its worth a go if there is literally nothing else.

A lot of people have left Cathay because they could no longer afford it, but there are those who have soldiered on and have been able to stay on this poor contract by supplementing their income with Uber driving, doing Deliveroo or starting an OnlyFans.
ZootBoot is offline  
Old 23rd Jan 2023, 15:32
  #8 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Canada
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks

Thank you all for the info.

Just curious about if the option of having a ultra compact roster is still offered.
​​​​​
​​​​​​Seems like the consensus is that upgrade is 10+ years. Coming in as a DEFO still would mean needing to wait in senority for all the SO above to upgrade before one is able to bid for the command course.

Does anyone know if the pilot pool has stabilized since the reopening, or are they still bleeding more pilots then they recruit fast enough. Which may affect the timeline further down the road.

And does anyone have HKE info on upgrade timeline? If one is willing to make a parallel move?

​​​​​​​Thanks
Smallworld is offline  
Old 23rd Jan 2023, 15:50
  #9 (permalink)  
swh

Eidolon
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Some hole
Posts: 2,130
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Rosters are great, only 55 logbook hours over 22 days (and get this, only have to spend 175 hours at work to do that !!!, it is SOOOOOO good), it is very posh, new shiny jets, big airports, fancy uniform.

Dont worry about the pay, after 23 years (not 2 to 3), you will actually make enough to save maybe HKD$1000 a week, that is MASSIVE.

There have been a spate of recent failures, YouTube how to stretch your hamstring muscles a number of new recruits were unable to bend over and touch their toes and say goodbye.
swh is offline  
Old 24th Jan 2023, 20:24
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Asia
Age: 42
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Donít do it

I relocated to the US about a year ago and didnít realise how truly awful CX/HKG was until I left.

The people here are so damn nice and Iíll be making more than a CX captain on second year FO pay.
OneBarWonder is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 03:39
  #11 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Canada
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by OneBarWonder View Post
I relocated to the US about a year ago and didnít realise how truly awful CX/HKG was until I left.

The people here are so damn nice and Iíll be making more than a CX captain on second year FO pay.
We all know the US market is the place to be the next decade. But not everyone has the right to work there!

Places like Asia n the sandbox don't need right to work for one to work there.
Smallworld is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 04:53
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 352
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Smallworld View Post
Thank you all for the info.

Just curious about if the option of having a ultra compact roster is still offered. No. Also remember don't believe anything the company tells you. They might say you can commute, that we have the latest rostering system letting you control your life, but it is all bullshit. They cherry pick what suits them. Our rostering system is broken, everything is done to suit the company.

We don't have an employment contract. Everything is company policy, which they can alter without notice whenever it suits them. The main reason all the bases were closed is that COS18 wouldn't be remotely legal anywhere but HKG.



​​​​​​Seems like the consensus is that upgrade is 10+ years. Coming in as a DEFO still would mean needing to wait in senority for all the SO above to upgrade before one is able to bid for the command course. In the past the company has chosen not to evaluate the SOs, so they weren't eligible for upgrade, thus enabling direct entry FOs in front of them. Some very experienced SOs were shafted yet again.

Does anyone know if the pilot pool has stabilized since the reopening, or are they still bleeding more pilots then they recruit fast enough. Which may affect the timeline further down the road. I'm still moving up the list at a good rate, the bleeding hasn't stopped.

And does anyone have HKE info on upgrade timeline? If one is willing to make a parallel move?

​​​​​​​Thanks
It is impossible for an outsider to understand just how toxic CX is as a company.
controlledrest is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 12:32
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by controlledrest View Post
It is impossible for an outsider to understand just how toxic CX is as a company.
Some insiders don't seem to understand it either.
Busbuoy is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 12:59
  #14 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 3,679
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
CathayÖ..30 years ago it was a pilots dream to get a job with them. What the fxxxk has happened?
SOPS is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 13:02
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2020
Location: The Poorhouse
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by controlledrest View Post
We don't have an employment contract. Everything is company policy, which they can alter without notice whenever it suits them. The main reason all the bases were closed is that COS18 wouldn't be remotely legal anywhere but HKG.
This is the biggest issue for anyone coming here and the main reason many of us are queuing up at other opportunities.

2023 saw a pay cut to the conditions of 2022. It is well documented on this forum that COS18 cost people a reduction in earnings of anywhere from 30-60%, depending on their existing contract pre-COVID. Since COS18 was forced upon me, I personally have had a reduction in salary each subsequent year due to the policies. There is zero financial security. Base salary may go up, but productivity goes up further resulting in a net loss overall.

Not to mention the financial penalty of calling in sick, which actually encourages people to take risk in order to pay their rent or feed their family. There is also a financial penalty for being a good pilot. If you are efficient at work getting shortcuts, better levels etc you are rewarded with less pay.

Requests are luck of the draw. I have no idea how the system actually works as it does not do anything like advertised. Even when you get something you asked for, the roster changes and you lose it.
ZootBoot is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 15:03
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 166
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by controlledrest View Post
It is impossible for an outsider to understand just how toxic CX is as a company.
Yet, from the looks you're still there? Another one putting others off whilst you stay. I bet you have a thousand reasons why you can't leave :-)
Fac6 is offline  
Old 25th Jan 2023, 22:41
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 352
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Fac6 View Post
Yet, from the looks you're still there? Another one putting others off whilst you stay. I bet you have a thousand reasons why you can't leave :-)
No ********, only one. At the moment due to my passport and conditions in my home country CX is the best job I can currently get, but I am actively working on my exit.
controlledrest is offline  
Old 26th Jan 2023, 00:40
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Gerloz
Posts: 813
Received 7 Likes on 4 Posts
Originally Posted by controlledrest View Post
No ********, only one. At the moment due to my passport and conditions in my home country CX is the best job I can currently get, but I am actively working on my exit.
Marry a septic. Or a kiwi.
MENELAUS is online now  
Old 26th Jan 2023, 03:30
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2022
Location: Cern
Posts: 51
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Not one lie has been said about COS18 and rostering on this thread!

Pre-covid, a person was able to to do back to back long hauls and is able to swing 8- 10 days off afterwards, now min days off with multiple EXB down route and NB days. Obviously all legal according to the company.

Leave will be used as recovery days too, so good luck trying to take a holiday and recover at the same time.

In saying all the above I implore you to join! Why? Because we need as many pilots as possible to help this s**thole of a company take some burden off other crew.
Babyjet_dododo is offline  
Old 26th Jan 2023, 10:40
  #20 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Canada
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
So if CX is so short of crew, then shouldn't everyone be working to their max? 80h+? ​​​​How come there ar people still making minimum guarantee 50h?

How inefficient is the scheduling at CX?

And is there any choice of fleet? If not when at the hiring /gs process do you find out which fleet?
Smallworld is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.