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Cathay Pacific ‘to axe 6,000 staff and Dragon brand’ in bid to stay afloat

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Cathay Pacific ‘to axe 6,000 staff and Dragon brand’ in bid to stay afloat

Old 26th Oct 2020, 06:04
  #161 (permalink)  
 
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me too... that would allow KA pilots to come back in. Don’t sign fellas. If you don’t want the job... someone else will take it. Supply and demand. CX knows it. Nothing new.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 06:37
  #162 (permalink)  
 
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Non PR now on borrowed time.

The company will want to re-employ all those expensively trained locals from KA as soon as they can in preference to keeping expats who will now have difficulty in getting their visas renewed.
HKA, AHK and HKE too will no longer be able to recruit or extend expats as there is now a pool of locals qualified to do the job.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 06:51
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Curry, unfortunately you will find most of those guys in the pit are unemployed so the comparison is of limited value.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 07:11
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Not true. The guys in QR are working their asses off.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 11:56
  #165 (permalink)  
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Has the DF0 gone onto COS 18? Asking for a friend !!
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 12:02
  #166 (permalink)  
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SOPS just have a look at the comment in another thread about training gentlemen getting a wee bit extra onto of their housing allowance... Pretty sure he'll end up on A-Scale topped up with a few bonuses after getting everyone to sign across to POS18.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 17:03
  #167 (permalink)  
 
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Cathay's Motto -"Never let a good crisis go to waste!"
And they done just that again by enforcing a Permanent subscale contract, not offering but forcing! The new cos18 rev1 contract; SO earns less than ISM. Think about that for a minute, a pilot earning less than flight attendant in one of the biggest airlines in the world, in the most expensive city in the world!
Our only leverage in this matter is Unity. They are bluffing with the "sign or be fired" tactic. Scaremongering threats which they have done for years. The last time did this, was back with the 49ers, even then they lost in court and had to $Millions in compensation for loss in earning and defamation.

cathaypilotsunion.org/generaldocs/The49ersStory.htm
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 19:01
  #168 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Dragon Pacific View Post
The company will want to re-employ all those expensively trained locals from KA as soon as they can in preference to keeping expats who will now have difficulty in getting their visas renewed.
HKA, AHK and HKE too will no longer be able to recruit or extend expats as there is now a pool of locals qualified to do the job.
I believe KA cadets are all on MPLs ...which cannot be transferred to another airline.
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 20:26
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Originally Posted by Rie View Post
FO friends in the desert are on base of about 30,000aed++. So 63k HKD and if they are lucky to fly maybe some extra money on the side. Housing is no longer a cash hand out. Even singles have been forced into villas. That is more like JFO pay on COS18.
I believe it’s the equivalent of HKD 63K basic + around HKD 10K flight pay (if you’re on the Barbie Jet) + HKD 32K housing (either cash or value of a 4.5 bed villa, all utilities paid) = HKD 105K (take home) no tax. Certainly a much better deal than the new LCC contract here at Cafay Paciic
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Old 26th Oct 2020, 22:21
  #170 (permalink)  
 
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MPL might be transferable, subject to CAD approval of the training program. There is a precedent for this:

https://www.flightglobal.com/mpl-stu...114911.article

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Old 26th Oct 2020, 23:31
  #171 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WeelardPassord View Post
I believe KA cadets are all on MPLs ...which cannot be transferred to another airline.
Very few were MPL. Only one or two courses at most.
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Old 27th Oct 2020, 00:30
  #172 (permalink)  
 
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THE MPL guys all hv full ATPLs now (P1 rated from the get go) They hadn’t run an MPL course for ages
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Old 27th Oct 2020, 08:10
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CX has played a dangerous hand with the severing of the KA limb, this shutdown was more about contracts and bringing 3000 pilots into compliance. LIFO posed too many problems across airlines for the training and possible bargaining required to down train, change fleet. In order to tackle this they found the smallest workforce and severed it, leaving a trial of blood that would would send fear into 3000 other pilots and force them over onto new contracts.

This was the first bloodletting and in hindsight their most expensive.

The remaining cuts are going to get cheaper and cheaper, now we shall see a bounce in the share price as CX move onto KA routes and start to increase flight numbers and passenger carriage. They will become stock market darlings as analysts put a buy recommendation on the airline. Destroy one brand that cost 6 billion, but watch the value of Swire's holding exceed that in the next 12-24 moths.

The government will see a return on their investment as their holding becomes more valuable and the reset on labour force contracts will put CX ahead of ANY airline in the region. Watch a privately held business get the HKSAR government lobbying for access back onto the valuable KA routes. Appointing a local CEO will become less significant when you have the HKSAR CE on your board.

The airbus fleet will be the big winner within CX as all the KA routes will be filled with this type. Statistics will be skewed, showing higher utilisation rates with the aircraft not stored. Stored aircraft are effectively wiped from fleet numbers. After several months the next round of bloodletting commences, targeting fleets, not seats.

This is the new dawn for CX and their industrial relations, employee engagement is just a buzz word used by consultants.

The only value they see is in the number 293, HK stock quote.

Truly a sad ending.

Last edited by KABOY; 27th Oct 2020 at 08:58.
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Old 27th Oct 2020, 11:11
  #174 (permalink)  
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Now, the government has revealed plans to allow Hong Kong residents to return from mainland China, subject to a restricted quota and tests, without the need to quarantine at all. Two border checkpoints will reopen to carry this out: the Hong Kong-Zhuhai-Macau Bridge and Shenzhen Bay.
This might help the return of flights to the mainland at least. Once they open the borders through the checkpoints the next move will be the airport. I can't see it working as far as keeping the number of cases down. It is still better than a complete lockout of all resulting in no flying at all.
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Old 27th Oct 2020, 20:41
  #175 (permalink)  
 
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Kaboy, no one will shed a tear for ka on here, or if they do its just idle platitudes. Most @ cx are so relieved that they are still employed, receiving a decent ( but reduced) salary. A contract they’ve queued up to sign, I kid you not. Cos they know the consequences.
No chance of a 49ers action anymore at cx, the pilots are a real bunch of hot aired wusses.

Once the psychological impact of cos20 has been negated by a return to some form of flying, most in cx don’t give two figs about the fate of ka.

Dog eat dog in the world of expats, middle east, far east, all same lah

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Old 27th Oct 2020, 20:46
  #176 (permalink)  
 
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Do you feel better now Kahaha...? I'm sure you do.
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Old 27th Oct 2020, 23:01
  #177 (permalink)  
 
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he’s right
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Old 28th Oct 2020, 01:01
  #178 (permalink)  
 
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Hardly fair Mole. I have enough KA mates to lament their passing, and I for one will miss them.
Dog eat dog ? It was ever thus. Not just in the expat world.
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Old 28th Oct 2020, 01:20
  #179 (permalink)  
 
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I take exception to his comment "no one will shed a tear for KA on here". I do, and I know many of my colleagues do. The fact that the entire airline was executed, coldly and suddenly, means CX management can deal with each of us remaining in the same manner. What has happened to KA has sickened me. So yes, my comment was fair.
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Old 28th Oct 2020, 08:26
  #180 (permalink)  
 
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KABOY

If one truly has balls: Shove the entire MPF/ORSO + Goodwill severance into HK.293. You simply can not lose any more. The old Dragon has been executed, the CX guys are signing across and politically the decision has been made that CX will survive whatever it takes, except at a much lower cost base. At a stock price that is beyond annihilated at the moment, the upside potential it has is truly staggering in the coming 5 years or so. Who is feeling lucky, gents?
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