Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Motive

Old 12th May 2019, 13:34
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: FUMOD
Posts: 45
Motive

What is the point of CC and the TB at the present time?
Nobody seems to know!
Hugo Peroni the V is offline  
Old 12th May 2019, 13:42
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Age: 50
Posts: 209
To move beyond
RAT Management is offline  
Old 12th May 2019, 14:44
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The sky
Posts: 30
What is wrong with you? Hold the line and keep it together. So what a few weak guys crossed the line. Retirements and medical outs will continue, they will break sooner than later.
Natca is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 00:16
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Hong Kong, SAR.
Posts: 32
Anyone knows there is no being forced into training. Those who start the training are breaking the ban.
Pathetic to think they thought we would fall for this little charade.

Oasis is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 01:39
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by Oasis View Post
Anyone knows there is no being forced into training. Those who start the training are breaking the ban.
Pathetic to think they thought we would fall for this little charade.
Exactly correct. Please know that nobody is fooled if you become a trainer.
cxorcist is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 02:17
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 416
There is no more ban, Dan. It's been well and truly broken. And I've been in CC longer than most of the seniority list have been in CX. Hugo has it right: name your goal. And how many times has this forum laughed at people repeating the same action expecting different results? GC, meet mirror.
OK4Wire is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 11:53
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Greener Pastures
Posts: 56
There is no point to either.

Membership is too dysfunctional/selfish to affect change.

If I still worked at CX (fortunately I escaped to greener pastures), I would quit the waste of time HKAOA, and simply do what suited me. If I wanted to work on a G then I would, if I wanted to call in sick I would. The simple fact is that no one apart from YOU will spare a second thought for you. You have one life so I would suggest do as you please.

The chest thumping that goes on here about 'not flying with so and so because they're a scab' is all hot air.

Just do whatever you like and make your own life enjoyable!
Roy De Kantzow is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 13:32
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Hong Kong, SAR.
Posts: 32
Originally Posted by Roy De Kantzow View Post
There is no point to either.

Membership is too dysfunctional/selfish to affect change.

If I still worked at CX (fortunately I escaped to greener pastures), I would quit the waste of time HKAOA, and simply do what suited me. If I wanted to work on a G then I would, if I wanted to call in sick I would. The simple fact is that no one apart from YOU will spare a second thought for you. You have one life so I would suggest do as you please.

The chest thumping that goes on here about 'not flying with so and so because they're a scab' is all hot air.

Just do whatever you like and make your own life enjoyable!
So you were in the union, and you still worked g days?
Nice... oh well as long as you are happy, right?
Why bother paying the dues I wonder.
Oasis is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 16:28
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: somewhere in the outback
Posts: 3
Originally Posted by Paul852 View Post
English obviously isn't your strong point is it, Oasis?

Roy de Kantzow is using something called the "counterfactual conditional" tense. He doesn't still work at CX, but he is making the hypothetical point that if he did he would not be in the HKAOA, and so on.

I guess that only comes up in ICAO Level 5 or 6 though.
I was gonna say just give this kid a break, weíve had enough of that attitude from TCs already.

Then I read your 2nd paragraph. Well...at least you are teaching something useful. Not just telling him to go home and read up Vol. 4
autobabysit is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 16:32
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Greener Pastures
Posts: 56
Originally Posted by Paul852 View Post
English obviously isn't your strong point is it, Oasis?

Roy de Kantzow is using something called the "counterfactual conditional" tense. He doesn't still work at CX, but he is making the hypothetical point that if he did he would not be in the HKAOA, and so on.

I guess that only comes up in ICAO Level 5 or 6 though.
Thank you, Paul. You're absolutely correct... I was beginning to think I had lost the knack of the English language... however, my faith is restored. It turns out I am able to make a reasonable point through the medium of typing. And for Oasis - I never worked a single G-Day during my entire time at CX, either as a union member or otherwise, or during CC or otherwise. Hope that's clear...?
Roy De Kantzow is offline  
Old 13th May 2019, 22:55
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Hong Kong, SAR.
Posts: 32
Apologies Roy, thatís what you get when you post too late at night.
Reading you post a second time made it clear what you meant to say.
Oasis is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 06:23
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
Posts: 562
I donít agree with the sentiment expressed by some here. Giving up because itís all too hard, our colleagues are too selfish, the ban is broken etc. means becoming part of the problem, not the solution. It makes a union pointless and weakens all of us in the long run just for the sake of some short-term gain.

What youíre saying is that you give up because we havenít succeeded yet so weíll never win. I say we havenít tried hard enough. Change our tactics, perhaps, but surrender? No. Harden up gents, itís not like itís a real war or anything, all one has to do is bloody well not answer the phone and not go into training, is that really too hard?
main_dog is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 08:45
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: FL370
Posts: 42
Main Dog gets it.

Do we give up CC/TB etc and take the selfish route of doing what's best for the individual because the union is dysfunctional, useless, a waste of money etc.

OR

Is the union dysfunctional, useless, a waste of money etc, because of too may individuals giving up CC/TB, being selfish and only doing what's best for them?
gretzky99 is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 09:55
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: everywhere
Posts: 503
The union is dysfunctional because of the membership. When only 30% decide to vote in AOA motions then you get the GC that you deserve. FFS we had the chance to vote out the current GC including one member of the GC who tried to sue a fellow member for exercising his membership rights, has now quit the association and run off to do training.

We deserve everything we get.
flyhardmo is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 14:53
  #15 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: FUMOD
Posts: 45
Maybe better worded...what does anyone expect to achieve by CC and the TB beyond pointless trips to CX?
Hugo Peroni the V is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 16:10
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Greener Pastures
Posts: 56
Originally Posted by gretzky99 View Post
Main Dog gets it.

Is the union dysfunctional, useless, a waste of money etc, because of too may individuals giving up CC/TB, being selfish and only doing what's best for them?
The union is dysfunctional, useless and a waste of money because of the APPALLING leadership that has been displayed by the previous chairman and the GC. That is the real reason people get fed up and become selfish.

It's all very well being noble and 'towing the line' etc etc, but when time after time after time, the HKAOA is caught like a deer in the headlights every time the company does something one has to wonder, 'what is the point'?

Hugo - in my view CC has long since stopped being effective. The company simply roster more defensively.

TB is effective in putting pressure on the company, however the reason people are joining training is probably because they are totally fed up of the lack of effectiveness the union shows. You end up in ever decreasing circles. Not everyone agreed with him, but Rod took the correct view, and fought the company. It is the only language they understand.

Roy De Kantzow is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 16:32
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: hong kong
Posts: 139
How can one find out who the new training Captains are?
4 driver is offline  
Old 14th May 2019, 22:42
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: hong kong
Posts: 103
Look at the rosters , but once they are known name and shame , having said that they obviously have no shame
cannot is offline  
Old 15th May 2019, 00:29
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: in denial
Posts: 245
Exactly, Dan. I read that thread on Yammer and cringe.
Veruka Salt is offline  
Old 15th May 2019, 01:15
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Asia
Posts: 130
Originally Posted by Veruka Salt View Post
Exactly, Dan. I read that thread on Yammer and cringe.
Why are you reading Yammer?
Dilbert68 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.