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DSS Resignation

Old 5th Feb 2019, 23:10
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1998
Posts: 751
Kitsune. In case you didn’t notice, there seems to be a hardening of attitudes towards this worthless management. People fo evidently learn to not repeat history. As for the 49er’s, I seriously doubt even this management would dare go there again, as they would lose a lot more 49 people when it was all said and done. This vote will prove a watershed in the history of this airline. It translates into one word : “enough “.
mngmt mole is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2019, 01:07
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 159
Originally Posted by mngmt mole View Post
Kitsune. In case you didn’t notice, there seems to be a hardening of attitudes towards this worthless management. People fo evidently learn to not repeat history. As for the 49er’s, I seriously doubt even this management would dare go there again, as they would lose a lot more 49 people when it was all said and done. This vote will prove a watershed in the history of this airline. It translates into one word : “enough “.
Mole, in case you didn’t get it the courts awarded zero to the 49ers, they won a pittance in defamation but that was it. Would be great if there was a hardening towards management but the reality is quite the opposite. Hence posters like you rubbishing the idea of unity and upping the cause. Keyboard warriors voted no to 1% and somehow think the company is going to come back with a way better offer.
On the basis of the slowly eroded CC/TB with everyone’s mates joining training, it won’t happen.
Laugh at being accused of being management when I suggest a vote for upping industrial action.
You scared because most will vote no or they’ll vote yes and then run and hide anyway?
morningcoffee is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2019, 02:06
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: www
Posts: 506
MC. Anyone who takes the time to collate and read some of your posts easily concludes that you are not a pilot, and are just some Swire office lackey desperately attempting to influence the debate in favour of the company. Only when you get called out do you then become "rambo" like in your frantic attempt to appear as one of the pilot fraternity. Seriously, give it up. Embarrassing.
Apple Tree Yard is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2019, 03:36
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: now a paxdoggiedog too...
Posts: 45
This vote will prove a watershed in the history of this airline. It translates into one word : “enough “.
I actually begin to believe this too. Once upon a time, back when a CX pilot’s package was the envy of the industry, when management shouted “jump” the only response was “how high?” But years of deceit and double-speak, a constant erosion of pay and T&Cs not to mention a growing proportion of the pilot body on inferior packages (HKPA instead of ARAPA and now POS 18, ever-increasing times to upgrade etc) mean a decreasing tolerance for this management style. With less and less to lose we move slowly but surely towards a cabin crew-like attitude.

One telling point was the vote for accepting positioning on the freighter a number of years back: despite the then-GMA’s fairly explicit threats the vote was a resounding “get stuffed”. He was later, ahem, removed from his post.

Let’s face it, a 78.6% NO when both management and the union’s own Chairman and GC begged us to vote yes is a very loud statement. Coupled with an ever increasing resignation rate, a barely static airline size in the face of increasing competition and fewer trainers than three years ago precisely when we need all training hands on deck for the POS 18 wave will certainly be causing some sleepless nights.

They may have draconian plans in place or they may have been bluffing, we shall soon see more of their hand. Then the “we should have accepted the few crumbs that were thrown at us” brigade will either be able to say they told us so, or else finally stop whingeing about the scraps they didn’t get to lap up.
freightdoggiedog is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2019, 04:10
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
Posts: 515
Originally Posted by freightdoggiedog View Post
I actually begin to believe this too. Once upon a time, back when a CX pilot’s package was the envy of the industry, when management shouted “jump” the only response was “how high?” But years of deceit and double-speak, a constant erosion of pay and T&Cs not to mention a growing proportion of the pilot body on inferior packages (HKPA instead of ARAPA and now POS 18, ever-increasing times to upgrade etc) mean a decreasing tolerance for this management style. With less and less to lose we move slowly but surely towards a cabin crew-like attitude.

One telling point was the vote for accepting positioning on the freighter a number of years back: despite the then-GMA’s fairly explicit threats the vote was a resounding “get stuffed”. He was later, ahem, removed from his post.

Let’s face it, a 78.6% NO when both management and the union’s own Chairman and GC begged us to vote yes is a very loud statement. Coupled with an ever increasing resignation rate, a barely static airline size in the face of increasing competition and fewer trainers than three years ago precisely when we need all training hands on deck for the POS 18 wave will certainly be causing some sleepless nights.

They may have draconian plans in place or they may have been bluffing, we shall soon see more of their hand. Then the “we should have accepted the few crumbs that were thrown at us” brigade will either be able to say they told us so, or else finally stop whingeing about the scraps they didn’t get to lap up.
Well said. The facts are the company has no Plan B. DS had promised to deliver a yes vote and failed. He is toast now in the AOA, the company and amongst his fellow pilots ( now former colleagues ). He faces a very lonely career ( a bit like Phil W when he left his GMA job and nobody spoke to him for 10 years, except to read the checklist ). So leave DS out of it. If he resigns good, if he doesn't ,so what he has ZERO credibility now and staying on only displays his arrogance and stupidity.
You must all sit on your hands and see what the company dreams up next. With no Plan B they face the problem of announcing massive profits in March and then having to justify their 1% offer to the public. Theresights are now firmly on KA and the DPA and those poor buggars face a very torrid couple of months. Of course a joining of forces would be the sensible solution but the KA borthers made it very clear in December 2017 that they had no appetite for that.
Sit on your hands and watch the circus come to town. Expect outrageous threats and promises but remember the managers have to face the shareholders soon. The profit will soften the blow but the investors will want to know what is Plan B. There isn't one. Enjoy the show.
unitedabx is offline  
Old 6th Feb 2019, 04:13
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
Posts: 515
No resignation yet ? Time to kick DS and the GC out today.
unitedabx is offline  
Old 7th Feb 2019, 23:01
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 159
Originally Posted by unitedabx View Post
Well said. The facts are the company has no Plan B. DS had promised to deliver a yes vote and failed. He is toast now in the AOA, the company and amongst his fellow pilots ( now former colleagues ). He faces a very lonely career ( a bit like Phil W when he left his GMA job and nobody spoke to him for 10 years, except to read the checklist ). So leave DS out of it. If he resigns good, if he doesn't ,so what he has ZERO credibility now and staying on only displays his arrogance and stupidity.
You must all sit on your hands and see what the company dreams up next. With no Plan B they face the problem of announcing massive profits in March and then having to justify their 1% offer to the public. Theresights are now firmly on KA and the DPA and those poor buggars face a very torrid couple of months. Of course a joining of forces would be the sensible solution but the KA borthers made it very clear in December 2017 that they had no appetite for that.
Sit on your hands and watch the circus come to town. Expect outrageous threats and promises but remember the managers have to face the shareholders soon. The profit will soften the blow but the investors will want to know what is Plan B. There isn't one. Enjoy the show.
Possibly the dumbest post yet. The share has a buy rating with every fund manager out there. Anywhere between $14.5 and $15.8 The public doesn’t give a rats ass about the pilots, the no vote put the share price up, just like TA16 it saves CX money when we don’t take more off them.
Every poster on here regurgitates reasons why we’re going to get lots by doing nothing, like the NC should have got 10% and it’s their fault.
Everyones leaving
No-ones joining
CC is killing them
The TB is stifling growth
The AOA is a conspiracy
They’re all just bullsh*t excuses to do nothing while expecting more. Take what they offer, and 1% is all the pilot body is currently worth. Like it or not.

Where are all the losers who were on here years back saying there’s a way better offer than TA16 just around the corner.

morningcoffee is offline  
Old 7th Feb 2019, 23:11
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Bouvet Island
Posts: 112
Originally Posted by morningcoffee View Post

Possibly the dumbest post yet. The share has a buy rating with every fund manager out there. Anywhere between $14.5 and $15.8 The public doesn’t give a rats ass about the pilots, the no vote put the share price up, just like TA16 it saves CX money when we don’t take more off them.
Every poster on here regurgitates reasons why we’re going to get lots by doing nothing, like the NC should have got 10% and it’s their fault.
Everyones leaving
No-ones joining
CC is killing them
The TB is stifling growth
The AOA is a conspiracy
They’re all just bullsh*t excuses to do nothing while expecting more. Take what they offer, and 1% is all the pilot body is currently worth. Like it or not.

Where are all the losers who were on here years back saying there’s a way better offer than TA16 just around the corner.

There is something beyond the limited scope of your vision that you just don’t understand. 1% might be all that the company wants to pay us, that isn’t even what they think we’re worth. They don’t have a value for us, they just don’t think we’re valuable.

However self-respect and having principles is something very different, something you MC don’t understand. We’re professional pilots and we know we’re valuable. That’s what 79% of us said to the company. That we’re worth more, and we won’t concede to a +12% pay cut over the last 4 years without properly being recognized for our worth. Not any monkey can fly a plane.

And yes, pilots are LEAVING.

Can someone say “head in the sand?”
plainpilot11 is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2019, 07:13
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Krug departure, Merlot transition
Posts: 536
To be fair it has nothing to do with what we think (or what the company thinks) we are worth, and all to do with how little they think they can get away with giving us, and with how much leverage we can bring to bear. Speaking of “the shareholders” is meaningless as the majority shareholder are Swire and they call the shots. Private shareholders are a small minority.

MC, as many here have tried to explain the offer was deemed to be worth peanuts (for many it actually would have meant a financial loss) and came at a high cost, one which was judged too expensive to be worth it.

If the company does in fact have a retention and training problem then it’s up to them to fix the offer, not us. If not, so be it, but at least I won’t have to wake up in the morning and know that I voluntarily signed up for “ST19”.
main_dog is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2019, 12:23
  #50 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Honky
Posts: 169
People need to stop with the whole “it’s about getting treated with respect, I don’t care if I get a 100% payrise, I’m a professional airline pilot, blah blah blah”
Xwindldg is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2019, 12:49
  #51 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: HKG
Age: 49
Posts: 215
MC. Your ignorance is impressive.

Did you ever consider that the share price has risen because of the exceptionally large code share agreement between qf and cx. This will equal a huge boost to revenue.

The pilot agreement or lack there of would have no effect what do ever to CX share price.

You total f_ing moron!
RAT Management is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2019, 14:14
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: All over
Posts: 182
Originally Posted by morningcoffee View Post

Possibly the dumbest post yet. The share has a buy rating with every fund manager out there. Anywhere between $14.5 and $15.8 The public doesn’t give a rats ass about the pilots, the no vote put the share price up, just like TA16 it saves CX money when we don’t take more off them.
Every poster on here regurgitates reasons why we’re going to get lots by doing nothing, like the NC should have got 10% and it’s their fault.
Everyones leaving
No-ones joining
CC is killing them
The TB is stifling growth
The AOA is a conspiracy
They’re all just bullsh*t excuses to do nothing while expecting more. Take what they offer, and 1% is all the pilot body is currently worth. Like it or not.

Where are all the losers who were on here years back saying there’s a way better offer than TA16 just around the corner.


Actually, I think the public very much DOES give a rats ass about the pilots. I doubt they much get into the weeds with pay or hours, conditions, etc -- but when anything at all is happening or they don't know where to go I'm always the guy they walk up to and ask (not that I'll know but there is the perception of this). So I think they would be pretty distressed when the pilots are unhappy, distracted, tired, or in poor health. Like it or not we are the folks who are considered SMEs and inspire image and confidence (as do the cabin crew in the back although their role is usually more service oriented and the public sees more of them; hence the drive to keep THEM happy).

Or lack thereof.

In fact, I've never met anyone who does NOT want their pilots well paid and happy (this is a small fraction of overall costs anyway). And it surprises (and distresses) some of my friends when they find out how little regional pilots ARE paid--not that they or I can do much about it.

Anyway, it's worth remembering that when it comes to life these years ARE your golden years. And time is your most precious asset. Spend your time wisely. If you aren't happy (or can't figure a way to make yourself happy, etc.) pi$$ing away your life being miserable (or trying to love something that won't love you back) is no way to live. Sometimes a fight is time well worth spent; caving and cowering is usually looked on in hindsight as a dark time in ones' life. As can be clinging on with the expectation of a better environment down the road (and effectively pi$$ing away your todays in the process). Pile up enough tomorrows and all you wind up with is a bunch of empty yesterdays. So it may well be time to step things up and get on with it. Probably worth some thought as how to best do this. If the membership isn't up to this it well may be time to move on.
Slasher1 is online now  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 08:53
  #53 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Eagles Nest
Posts: 446
Toruk Macto is online now  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 09:19
  #54 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
Posts: 515
Originally Posted by morningcoffee View Post

Possibly the dumbest post yet. The share has a buy rating with every fund manager out there. Anywhere between $14.5 and $15.8 The public doesn’t give a rats ass about the pilots, the no vote put the share price up, just like TA16 it saves CX money when we don’t take more off them.
Every poster on here regurgitates reasons why we’re going to get lots by doing nothing, like the NC should have got 10% and it’s their fault.
Everyones leaving
No-ones joining
CC is killing them
The TB is stifling growth
The AOA is a conspiracy
They’re all just bullsh*t excuses to do nothing while expecting more. Take what they offer, and 1% is all the pilot body is currently worth. Like it or not.

Where are all the losers who were on here years back saying there’s a way better offer than TA16 just around the corner.

MC you're history mate. Suck it up.
unitedabx is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 12:20
  #55 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Hong kong
Posts: 103
Strange , but if you look back to 2011 the share price was $23.68 then a steady decline to $10 before recovering somewhat to $12.04 today . So it’s share value has halved , despite being in a service industry the company has had lousy industrial relations with all of its staff , and the analysts are claiming its a buy can I sell you a very nice bridge .
Tea time is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 15:14
  #56 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 1998
Posts: 751
Originally Posted by morningcoffee View Post

Possibly the dumbest post yet. The share has a buy rating with every fund manager out there. Anywhere between $14.5 and $15.8 The public doesn’t give a rats ass about the pilots, the no vote put the share price up, just like TA16 it saves CX money when we don’t take more off them.
Every poster on here regurgitates reasons why we’re going to get lots by doing nothing, like the NC should have got 10% and it’s their fault.
Everyones leaving
No-ones joining
CC is killing them
The TB is stifling growth
The AOA is a conspiracy
They’re all just bullsh*t excuses to do nothing while expecting more. Take what they offer, and 1% is all the pilot body is currently worth. Like it or not.

Where are all the losers who were on here years back saying there’s a way better offer than TA16 just around the corner.


MC, once again you display your abject stupidity, arrogance and ignorance. You have the nerve to "crow" about fund managers predicting that CX stock is valued between $14.5 and $15.8.....!??? . Almost TWENTY YEARS ago that was the stock price. Tell me, what supposed "blue chip" company has a stock price that is not even where it was 20 years ago...?? Most blue chip corporations have seen a X3 of X4 valuation rise in that time period. The fact that CX stock isn't even where it was two decades ago is SOLELY down to the effect that managers like you and the rest of the Swire buffoons have had on the company and it's destiny. You should hang your head in shame that the stock price is where it is. You and the rest of the Swire's are nothing more than an arrogant tool of destruction, to your airline, your employees and your own self respect. You and and the rest of them are a sick joke, nothing more.
mngmt mole is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 17:43
  #57 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 1,934
MC hasn’t had his morning coffee yet. Perhaps silence. Is all we will get.

Fwiw, airline stocks are never investments, just trades.
cxorcist is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 19:30
  #58 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: nfa
Posts: 122
CX stock has always been a joke. One step from junk bonds.

CX $1.50usd

UA $88.00usd
AA $36.00usd
SW $57.60usd
DL $50.00usd
WJ $16.00usd
AC $23.60usd
bm330 is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 21:06
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 1,934
Originally Posted by bm330 View Post
CX stock has always been a joke. One step from junk bonds.

CX $1.50usd

UA $88.00usd
AA $36.00usd
SW $57.60usd
DL $50.00usd
WJ $16.00usd
AC $23.60usd
Aren’t those all the airlines CX managers liked to talk trash about ten years ago? The tables have surely turned. That’s what happens when CX Swire geniuses clean $3B+ in cash off the balance sheet with reckless (and perhaps fraudulent) fuel hedges.
cxorcist is offline  
Old 9th Feb 2019, 22:57
  #60 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Hong kong
Posts: 103
I would still love to know who was on the other side of the fuel hedge
Tea time is offline  

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