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Unleash the Dogs of War!

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Unleash the Dogs of War!

Old 14th Sep 2018, 19:46
  #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 20
Unleash the Dogs of War!

I cannot believe what I am reading from CX!
Scarcely two days after a full-frontal attack on our profession, I am expected to immerse myself in the “Cathay spirit” and deliver the airline from the evil of an approaching mega-typhoon. Get real!
These so-called “masters of the the universe“ have completely screwed this airline, and yet they continue to expect us to roll over and keep submitting to the beatings ... don't they get it!?
And to those long-suffering pilots who simply say “Leave!“ I say “No!“. This is our airline, between us we have invested a thousand times the effort of their pathetic MBAs in the success of the group, and I'm damned if I'm going to stand by idly and watch them [email protected] my profession.
CoS18 is an insult that I am prepared to take personally, and I expect the AOA and DPA to follow suit with every means available.
Nothing less.
Karrupted is offline  
Old 14th Sep 2018, 22:37
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: uk
Posts: 365
It is truly amazing: RH in his typhoon speech thanked not only volunteers on their days off for willing to come in to help out but allegedly some offering to return from early from leave to do same. WTF?!

Have to say if I was in RH shoes, I would be questioning why we even give employees so much leave that they can afford to give some back. If they don’t want It all then let’s make it final and cut their COS too.
Starbear is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 01:33
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Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: china
Age: 51
Posts: 88
And we know there will be those who already have their bags packed, with their diversion kits at the ready, , just aching to help out.

I’m not personally bothered. Seems many ka pilots usually do the honarable thing and help out when called upon. They keep their phones on , at the ready. Then bitch when they are assigned airport standby all night.

I just don’t understand. Is it just me? ( rhetorical)
kahaha is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 05:45
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Hong kong
Posts: 98
Until. We start leaning on those errant crew members nothing will change
Tea time is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 06:26
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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Originally Posted by Tea time View Post
Until. We start leaning on those errant crew members nothing will change
Trying to get away to BKK for a few days before the storm hits tonight. I was on the bus this morning with 4 KA pilots. 2 about to do 6 hours airport reserve and 2 offering their services for free. With this kind of attitude the CX Group is laughing all the way to the bank. Do they know that the managers in IOC are all being paid overtime with rooms reserved in the Headland this weekend with all food and beverage paid for by the company !
unitedabx is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 07:48
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Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: All over
Posts: 627
We really are our own worst enemies with attitudes like that. Airport reserve?!?!? FFS!
b.
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Old 15th Sep 2018, 08:43
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: Asia
Posts: 537
The AOA thinks they are playing a game of cricket. A gentleman’s game with players dressed in white having a tea break.

Whilst Management is playing rugby like the Barbarians.
AQIS Boigu is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 08:50
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: No where
Posts: 891
DS, you need to declare that CX has violated GFB by obviously planning, publishing and announcing this new COS18. There is NOTHING further we as a pilot body should be doing to negotiate. We should simply be providing different scenarios to vote on, including a strike vote that coincides with Christmas/NY. If not, why not? Does anyone think there is a sliver of hope for this management to see reason, fairness and the necessary conditions for a CAREER? (instead of itinerant part time pilots looking for a few hours and then leaving?). Seriously, this airline is finished as a career airline, so why not at least go out in a blaze of glory (strike)?.
Air Profit is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 21:19
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: uk
Posts: 365
Is it just me that finds it astonishing that according to MH’s Typhoon update that ALL but 2 pilots licences would be affected if all of Sunday’s sim session were cancelled.

How in God’s good name can an airline of this magnitude run like this, with zero buffer or flexibility on expiry dates?

It really beggars belief. Oh wait a minute, no it doesn’t because he also finds it hugely disappointing that a crew member declared unfit and so thwarting their clever plans. Best just ignore why they were unfit of course.
Starbear is offline  
Old 15th Sep 2018, 23:38
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Rabbit Hutch
Posts: 161
He really should read the Labour Dept’s latest guidance on working in Typhoons.
https://www.labour.gov.hk/eng/public/wcp/Rainstorm.pdf
All KA’s sims today are cancelled by the way.
Dragon Pacific is offline  
Old 16th Sep 2018, 06:01
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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Originally Posted by Frank W. Abagnale View Post
The dogs of war, which the AOA possesses, are a couple of Chihuahuas.
With rubber teeth !
unitedabx is offline  
Old 16th Sep 2018, 13:00
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: somewhere above the sea
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At least we’re good at the ‘cry havoc’ bit
ron burgandy is offline  
Old 17th Sep 2018, 00:06
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: CLK
Posts: 371
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank W. Abagnale
The dogs of war, which the AOA possesses, are a couple of Chihuahuas.
“With rubber teeth !”

So that’s where the infamous “rubber dogshit out of Hong Kong” comes from!
Farman Biplane is offline  
Old 17th Sep 2018, 07:20
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Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: hk
Posts: 7
For those who have yet to apply, I'm sure you have now seen what conditions CX/KA is going to give you, and I'm sure you will make the right decision.
But for those who are currently in training, what they feel is simply betrayal. Doesn't matter what the terms are in their sponsorship contract, the condition COS18 gives is simply not what they expected, when they started to invest in their time and effort for, and give up any other career opportunities to pursue their passion. There are already too many risks between the time they start their training and joining the company. The last thing they want is to see a career, and job security degradation when they are just months off end of their training. Does the higher management really want to let their new joiners feel gutted, cheated and betrayal, even before Day 1 they join the company?
Not sure what move CX/KA is going for, but this betrayal will only give extreme disappointment to their new "brushwingers", and, you expect them to "boost productivity" for you?

Last edited by Cant_Believe_it; 18th Sep 2018 at 10:15.
Cant_Believe_it is offline  
Old 18th Sep 2018, 03:32
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Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: HKG
Posts: 328
It used to take 2 - 3 years for a new joiner to hate the management. Now it is normal for them to hate the management even before they leave the School. Little wonder they are leaving in such numbers.
controlledrest is offline  
Old 18th Sep 2018, 06:03
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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Originally Posted by Cant_Believe_it View Post
For those who have yet to apply, I'm sure you have now seen what conditions CX/KA is going to give you, and I'm sure you will make the right decision.
But for those who are currently in training, what they feel is simply betrayal. Doesn't matter what the terms are in their sponsorship contract, the condition COS18 gives is simply not what they expected, when they started to invest in their time and effort for, and give up any other career opportunities to pursue their passion. There are already too many risks between the time they start their training and joining the company. The last thing they want is to see a career, and job security degradation when they are just months off their training. Does the higher management really want to let their new joiners feel gutted, cheated and betrayal, even before Day 1 they join the company?
Not sure what move CX/KA is going for, but this betrayal will only give extreme disappointment to their new "brushwingers", and, you expect them to "boost productivity" for you?
And to date not a single cadet has resigned or taken the option to complete the training then leave. The company know this and will capitalise on it. They can say they pitched the new COS at market levels and it is working.
unitedabx is offline  
Old 18th Sep 2018, 08:16
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 17
That’s correct. They generally wait 4-5 years until they have some experience and then leave. Though I dare say the reality of living on COS 18 will have them out the door sooner.
Clear_sky is offline  
Old 18th Sep 2018, 08:42
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Join Date: Sep 2018
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Originally Posted by unitedabx View Post
And to date not a single cadet has resigned or taken the option to complete the training then leave. The company know this and will capitalise on it. They can say they pitched the new COS at market levels and it is working.
Because if you do so the company will ask you to pay back the training cost.
Cant_Believe_it is offline  
Old 18th Sep 2018, 09:47
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: uk
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Originally Posted by Clear_sky View Post
That’s correct. They generally wait 4-5 years until they have some experience and then leave. Though I dare say the reality of living on COS 18 will have them out the door sooner.
Xiamen Airlines will offer them P1 ratings and convert theirHKG CPL's for free. Why would they stay 4-5 years as bum warmers when they can operate RHS ?
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