CX to take whitetail A380s?
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CX to take whitetail A380s?
Skymark had to cancel the order because of problems including a flawed business plan and a shortage of pilots...erm I mean, a shortage of experienced pilots willing to work for their poor terms and conditions.
This wouldn't happen to Cathay Pacific...would it?
This wouldn't happen to Cathay Pacific...would it?
Last edited by Captain Dart; 31st Jul 2014 at 23:24.
When a supplier cancels an order like this, it normally means the customer has not met their contractual obligations. Reading between the lines, Skymark did not make the required substantial progress payment in April with the first flight milestone.
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On the contrary. Buying the A380 (/748) would allow for growth on several markets without adding superfluous frequencies, and thus carry more revenue with less crews/crewing costs/crewing constraints/layover costs/industrial tensions/recruiting issues/etc.
That is, of course, provided all of these were actually issues, which, visibly, they are not...
That is, of course, provided all of these were actually issues, which, visibly, they are not...
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I wish I was kidding. My preference would, of course, be for Intercontinentals. I'm told the Amadeus order combined with cancelled / deferred deliveries has dropped lease rates so low that even CX could not say no. Supposedly, they'll be be used on the "double frequencies" to LHR, LAX, and JFK. That'll free up some 77Ws for growth markets and earlier retirement of older aircraft (to include the regional 777s).
Don't believe me? Check Airbus' A380 order book. There are 10 for an undisclosed customer and two more from Skymark. The 10 are cancellations from (ironically) Hong Kong Airlines. The Virgin, Transaero, and Air Austral orders are also in serious jeopardy.
Don't believe me? Check Airbus' A380 order book. There are 10 for an undisclosed customer and two more from Skymark. The 10 are cancellations from (ironically) Hong Kong Airlines. The Virgin, Transaero, and Air Austral orders are also in serious jeopardy.
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cxorcist, you seem quite confident about your sources.
Yet, you take about lease rates (implying we'll lease them), immediately followed by sales data of 10 to an "undisclosed customer". If that customer was a leasing company, then surely they wouldn't be remaining anonymous, as they need to tell potential customers they're getting the airframes.
So, while I don't doubt your sincerity, can you please ask your "source" if these alleged 12 are to be bought, or leased. And if leased, either directly from Airbus, or from which leasing company?
Yet, you take about lease rates (implying we'll lease them), immediately followed by sales data of 10 to an "undisclosed customer". If that customer was a leasing company, then surely they wouldn't be remaining anonymous, as they need to tell potential customers they're getting the airframes.
So, while I don't doubt your sincerity, can you please ask your "source" if these alleged 12 are to be bought, or leased. And if leased, either directly from Airbus, or from which leasing company?
He is "yank"ing your chain.
Emirates is paying Doric US$1,260,341 and £360,136 per month for the first 10 years, and then US$432,749 and £455,058 for years 11&12. Doric purchased the A380s for US$245 million each, with a valuation at the end of the lease of US$139 million.
The public prospectus for the Doris issue are on the internet for anyone to see. http://www.dnairtwo.com/investors/DoricProspectus.pdf . These lease rates are comparable to the Ascend published numbers.
You can lease 12-15 744s for the same money.
Emirates is paying Doric US$1,260,341 and £360,136 per month for the first 10 years, and then US$432,749 and £455,058 for years 11&12. Doric purchased the A380s for US$245 million each, with a valuation at the end of the lease of US$139 million.
The public prospectus for the Doris issue are on the internet for anyone to see. http://www.dnairtwo.com/investors/DoricProspectus.pdf . These lease rates are comparable to the Ascend published numbers.
You can lease 12-15 744s for the same money.
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Hahaha, $139 million after twelve years. That's a good one. Is that pre-A380NEO or post-NEO. That number means F-all! I'd be surprised if a twelve year old A380 is worth half that much. Seriously. Take a look at resale values on the A340. There's your crystal ball... How much has Airbus lost on those A340 residual value guarantees? Right.
And please, stop comparing A380 to 744 (and A350-1000 to 77W for that matter). They are different generations of aircraft. I don't hear anyone comparing the 77X to the A340-600. Do you? Same difference.
And please, stop comparing A380 to 744 (and A350-1000 to 77W for that matter). They are different generations of aircraft. I don't hear anyone comparing the 77X to the A340-600. Do you? Same difference.
Originally Posted by clueless redneck
Hahaha, $139 million after twelve years.
Doric have A319, A320, A330, A340-600, A380, 777-200LR, and 777-300ERs on their books, all of those frames have updates coming. They even have 4 of the CX 777-300ERs on their books.
If you did the numbers, you would see that each 12 year lease to Emirates is worth around 370 million to Doric, on an asset purchased for 245 million.
Originally Posted by clueless redneck
Take a look at resale values on the A340.
I am surprised some Nigerian friend has not cleaned you out, you come across as one of these gullible idiots that believe everything they read on the internet.
BTW Ascend have the A340-300 about the same as the 777-200ER, and 747-400 less than the A340-600. Airbus just placed the A340-600s that came off lease with Virgin to another carrier.
Originally Posted by clueless redneck
And please, stop comparing A380 to 744 (and A350-1000 to 77W for that matter). They are different generations of aircraft. I don't hear anyone comparing the 77X to the A340-600. Do you? Same difference.
Singapore and British Airways compared the 744 to the A380, CX compared the A350-1000 to the 777-300ER, and I am sure of there is an airline replacing the A340-600 with 777X, they will have also made the comparison.
Originally Posted by SloppyJoe
Its official!!!!!
