Not your Problem?
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,025
Likes: 1
From: The Global village
With the current oversupply of airline-experienced pilots available, Cathay "management" are probably feeling that the hundreds of millions of dollars they've allowed to be lost so far, instead of simply sitting down and talking WITH their pilots, might end up as an investment. Ansett, Australian, East-West, IPEC, Ansett New Zealand, Eastern, and Continental also conducted campaigns against their pilots using a similar mindset. ALL of those airlines are now defunct!
If CX "management" were to consider replacing some/most/all of their current pilots with new recruits - and certainly it IS possible - do they seriously believe that the SAME problems are not going to recur within a very short period of time?
It is possible, Wiz, that the HKAOA decided not to institute an upgrade ban to prevent CX management (in the short-medium term) from employing direct entry captains.
IMHO, the longer I see this Dispute continuing, the shorter I see CX's future!
If CX "management" were to consider replacing some/most/all of their current pilots with new recruits - and certainly it IS possible - do they seriously believe that the SAME problems are not going to recur within a very short period of time?
It is possible, Wiz, that the HKAOA decided not to institute an upgrade ban to prevent CX management (in the short-medium term) from employing direct entry captains.
IMHO, the longer I see this Dispute continuing, the shorter I see CX's future!
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
Hi Kaptin,
In the most part I agree with you (though I don't agree that the dispute was the root cause of the demise of the Australian operators listed. Don't want a great debate about it here, lets agree to differ!!), but what is the solution?
You may be right about the ban (Thought the only Cathay pilot who has had the decency to address it here has in essence said "It's to big a sacrifice to not take an upgrade, so we'll just let others stay unemployed to further our aims"), but what's the difference between banning direct entry captains and banning direct entry SOs and FOs?
As you know, the '89 dispute proved that an airline will ALWAYS find enough recruits. Hard as the AFAP fought the dispute, it didn't get you your job back. As I have said, the problem with this policy is it won't work.
And if the end result is that Cathay DOES go down, well, I've been there (quite recently!) and in that case EVERYONE loses!
In the most part I agree with you (though I don't agree that the dispute was the root cause of the demise of the Australian operators listed. Don't want a great debate about it here, lets agree to differ!!), but what is the solution?
You may be right about the ban (Thought the only Cathay pilot who has had the decency to address it here has in essence said "It's to big a sacrifice to not take an upgrade, so we'll just let others stay unemployed to further our aims"), but what's the difference between banning direct entry captains and banning direct entry SOs and FOs?
As you know, the '89 dispute proved that an airline will ALWAYS find enough recruits. Hard as the AFAP fought the dispute, it didn't get you your job back. As I have said, the problem with this policy is it won't work.
And if the end result is that Cathay DOES go down, well, I've been there (quite recently!) and in that case EVERYONE loses!
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,025
Likes: 1
From: The Global village
Yes, I was waiting for someone to pick up on Continental and of course it just HAD to be our resident Indonesian airline director and magnate, 411A 
Perhaps 411, when you have a minute to spare from the obviously onerous and demanding chores involved in getting your museum of aircraft airborne, you might like to publish here the number of Chapter 11's that Continental went through.
Before long, Australia will see Australian Airlines also (re)commence operations under the same owners - but it's not the same company that was conveniently incorporated into QANTAS for massive debt re-structuring following the prolonged dispute with its pilot workforce.
On a lighter note, "G'day Wiz!". The obvious solution is for Cathay management to REALISE that their pilots do have some GENUINE concerns, about which they feel strongly enough aggrieved to continue their industrial action in an attempt to bring the employer to talks.
I believe the term "responsible and accountable management" is the common factor that was MISSING from the list previously mentioned.
Perhaps 411, when you have a minute to spare from the obviously onerous and demanding chores involved in getting your museum of aircraft airborne, you might like to publish here the number of Chapter 11's that Continental went through. Before long, Australia will see Australian Airlines also (re)commence operations under the same owners - but it's not the same company that was conveniently incorporated into QANTAS for massive debt re-structuring following the prolonged dispute with its pilot workforce.
On a lighter note, "G'day Wiz!". The obvious solution is for Cathay management to REALISE that their pilots do have some GENUINE concerns, about which they feel strongly enough aggrieved to continue their industrial action in an attempt to bring the employer to talks.
I believe the term "responsible and accountable management" is the common factor that was MISSING from the list previously mentioned.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,025
Likes: 1
From: The Global village
Frankg, wrt the article you posted titled "Pilots for oneworld Alliance Airlines Call for Improved Industrial Relations and Working Conditions", please email me at [email protected] for further discussion. Cheers.
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 4,835
Likes: 85
From: Boldly going where no split infinitive has gone before..
Yo Kap,
NOW we are totally talking the same language.
Yes, Cathay mamagement waking up and smelling the S@@@ is what is desperatley required.
That makes the fact that the ban isn't going to work all the more critical. Would you agree that Cathay managment probably sees this as a golden opertunity to divide and concour by getting itself compliant, non unioun pilots?
NOW we are totally talking the same language.
Yes, Cathay mamagement waking up and smelling the S@@@ is what is desperatley required.
That makes the fact that the ban isn't going to work all the more critical. Would you agree that Cathay managment probably sees this as a golden opertunity to divide and concour by getting itself compliant, non unioun pilots?
