I hate flying freight.
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Obviously, few people are paying attention to the problem. The F PX problem is not about having to make your own meal or get your own drink. People in HK still think a PX means a little ride to TPE to pick up a stranded jet when crew hours have run out, or when filling in for someone sick to end up riding back from EUR or somwhere.
Try endless months of PXing to ANC from NAM, the go back and forth twice to HKG but with another PX on one of those to keep the hours down, then after operating HKG-ANC and clearing customs, staying on the a/c (1-2 hrs of ground time) to PX to MIA and staying on the plane to PX (1.5-3 hrs of ground time) to PX to your base at LAX, covering 3 of the 4 corners of NAM after arriving from Asia, for 1 1/2 days in the plane, perhaps with a few others sharing that small space and the 1 remaining bunk, with no TV. Think I'm making this up? Then you're supposed to drive home, or show up at a terminal and use the 1 ZED partner still available to get home.
Or how about flying 2-man through the night (but not 2-6AM, of course, 205AM-10AM) only to spend another 1.5-3 hrs on the ground before continuing to PX to EUR via another stop, or VIA EUR and continue to PX back to India, or vice versa?
Or how about PXing to HKG only to go back where you came from the next day with the previous day's operating crew PXing you back to where you came from, 10 1/2 hours away, just so nobody gets 1 hour of EFP?
Try endless months of PXing to ANC from NAM, the go back and forth twice to HKG but with another PX on one of those to keep the hours down, then after operating HKG-ANC and clearing customs, staying on the a/c (1-2 hrs of ground time) to PX to MIA and staying on the plane to PX (1.5-3 hrs of ground time) to PX to your base at LAX, covering 3 of the 4 corners of NAM after arriving from Asia, for 1 1/2 days in the plane, perhaps with a few others sharing that small space and the 1 remaining bunk, with no TV. Think I'm making this up? Then you're supposed to drive home, or show up at a terminal and use the 1 ZED partner still available to get home.
Or how about flying 2-man through the night (but not 2-6AM, of course, 205AM-10AM) only to spend another 1.5-3 hrs on the ground before continuing to PX to EUR via another stop, or VIA EUR and continue to PX back to India, or vice versa?
Or how about PXing to HKG only to go back where you came from the next day with the previous day's operating crew PXing you back to where you came from, 10 1/2 hours away, just so nobody gets 1 hour of EFP?
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I can fart loudly and scratch my bollocks and walk around in just my shreddies and go for a piss when I want to. Not quite so good now without the FEs
Iron Skillet,
The PX abuses on the freighter are well known. The recent cases of 074 being rerouted to go ANC-MIA-LAX and having LAX guys ride the entire way from ANC is one of the worst. People need to refuse when this is assigned and take the hotel in ANC. Unfortunately, if the same pattern runs the next day they will try to force it again, and really there is no excuse for there not being a PT ticket to LAX.
The freighter PX works for a lot of us in NAM though, and it is the only way to get to our homes or preferred ports without much of a hassle. In my case I am based in LAX with a preferred port in MIA, and I live in Florida. A majority of my patterns include a PX to MIA from ANC at the end of a trip. If I were to refuse to PX on the freighter here is what would happen. I would never get a PT ticket to MIA because a ticket to LAX is much cheaper. Both cities require a hub stop most of the year, Alaska Airlines will have some LAX non-stops in the summer. The ticket will be in economy class in most cases, because in CX's world of warped definitions US domestic first class is somehow "better" than trans-pac business class. This of course is not the case, but trying to get them to accept that US domestic first class seats don't even have as much legroom as the seats in the back of the freighter seems to be impossible. So I would get to ANC, clear customs, go to the pax terminal, do the security thing, then sit and wait for a flight to LAX. My seat would be not of my choosing in the back, I would transit SEA, then in LAX I would either have to sit in a terminal some more or buy a hotel. Then I could ride the full fare ticket I have purchased to my home in Florida, because pass riding hasn't been possible since 2008 with reduced domestic capacity.
Compare this to how it works now. I clear customs, get back on the jet, have a meal, and crawl into a bunk for at least six hours and I'm in MIA by six AM, hopefully rested and partially adjusted to my home time zone. Rarely are there more than one of us on board PXing. This works for a lot of us. Yeah, DFW-ATL is a long PX after operating but would you rather have a wait and have an economy seat in the back of Delta for seven hours? That's one of the longer ones. For me its a no brainer, I don't want to PT/PD anywhere in the back of a US carrier these days if its more than about three hours. Especially after operating out of HKG and if a freighter gets me there in half the time.
The reason I put this out there is that there isn't one solution for everybody. For a lot of guys having the option to refuse to PX on the freighter as their Cos guarantees would improve lifestyle. In my case the back end of a lot of trips would cost a lot of money and time and would turn into hell. So it should be a choice. And of course turning sectors to PX to drop credit hours oughta be flat out banned. If its your sector you should only come off it as operating crew for limitations reasons.
The PX abuses on the freighter are well known. The recent cases of 074 being rerouted to go ANC-MIA-LAX and having LAX guys ride the entire way from ANC is one of the worst. People need to refuse when this is assigned and take the hotel in ANC. Unfortunately, if the same pattern runs the next day they will try to force it again, and really there is no excuse for there not being a PT ticket to LAX.
The freighter PX works for a lot of us in NAM though, and it is the only way to get to our homes or preferred ports without much of a hassle. In my case I am based in LAX with a preferred port in MIA, and I live in Florida. A majority of my patterns include a PX to MIA from ANC at the end of a trip. If I were to refuse to PX on the freighter here is what would happen. I would never get a PT ticket to MIA because a ticket to LAX is much cheaper. Both cities require a hub stop most of the year, Alaska Airlines will have some LAX non-stops in the summer. The ticket will be in economy class in most cases, because in CX's world of warped definitions US domestic first class is somehow "better" than trans-pac business class. This of course is not the case, but trying to get them to accept that US domestic first class seats don't even have as much legroom as the seats in the back of the freighter seems to be impossible. So I would get to ANC, clear customs, go to the pax terminal, do the security thing, then sit and wait for a flight to LAX. My seat would be not of my choosing in the back, I would transit SEA, then in LAX I would either have to sit in a terminal some more or buy a hotel. Then I could ride the full fare ticket I have purchased to my home in Florida, because pass riding hasn't been possible since 2008 with reduced domestic capacity.
Compare this to how it works now. I clear customs, get back on the jet, have a meal, and crawl into a bunk for at least six hours and I'm in MIA by six AM, hopefully rested and partially adjusted to my home time zone. Rarely are there more than one of us on board PXing. This works for a lot of us. Yeah, DFW-ATL is a long PX after operating but would you rather have a wait and have an economy seat in the back of Delta for seven hours? That's one of the longer ones. For me its a no brainer, I don't want to PT/PD anywhere in the back of a US carrier these days if its more than about three hours. Especially after operating out of HKG and if a freighter gets me there in half the time.
The reason I put this out there is that there isn't one solution for everybody. For a lot of guys having the option to refuse to PX on the freighter as their Cos guarantees would improve lifestyle. In my case the back end of a lot of trips would cost a lot of money and time and would turn into hell. So it should be a choice. And of course turning sectors to PX to drop credit hours oughta be flat out banned. If its your sector you should only come off it as operating crew for limitations reasons.
Last edited by 8driver; 23rd Feb 2012 at 19:48. Reason: word order
Join Date: Nov 2000
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I hate flying.
Bloody 'ell, sounds like the makings of the lyrics to a new "Coldplay" song. 
Music to slash your wrists to.
On the beach
P.S. Perhaps half an hour in the hold listening to "James Blunt" will cheer you up?
P.P.S. How are you guys on Mondays?
(rhetorical question, I've heard you!) 
Music to slash your wrists to.
On the beach
P.S. Perhaps half an hour in the hold listening to "James Blunt" will cheer you up?
P.P.S. How are you guys on Mondays?
(rhetorical question, I've heard you!)
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Regarding farting loudly when px ing on the freighter, did a DAC - HAN px sector where the riding engineer was so shameless when doing it I thought he was constantly ****ting himself!!!
Personally I have no real problem with positioning on the freighter. It is the half credit for positioning that I have a major problem with as it makes the rosters so inflexible. My 9 pX sectors next month are testament to this.
The Cav
Personally I have no real problem with positioning on the freighter. It is the half credit for positioning that I have a major problem with as it makes the rosters so inflexible. My 9 pX sectors next month are testament to this.
The Cav
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8Driver, no argument, it should be a choice, but right now it's their choice, against our COS, and because it suits some, many others suffer.
The solution is simple: We all agree (and it seems the company finally does too) that the COS does not allow it, but we all agree to give into the company's desire to keep using F PX when the rostering of PX follows certain rules that suit us. Win-win: They save money some or most of the time, and we get what we want (either PX or no PX depending on the situation).
But that would make everyone happy through compromise.
The solution is simple: We all agree (and it seems the company finally does too) that the COS does not allow it, but we all agree to give into the company's desire to keep using F PX when the rostering of PX follows certain rules that suit us. Win-win: They save money some or most of the time, and we get what we want (either PX or no PX depending on the situation).
But that would make everyone happy through compromise.
Last edited by Iron Skillet; 26th Feb 2012 at 04:20.
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I was Px'ing on a pax flight the other day, I was sound asleep only to be rudely poked in the arm and woken by a CC because my seat was not upright. When I moved the seat it moved just under 2 inches! iRobots!
On the Freighter you don't have the joys of that or of the CC storming up to you and demanding you turn your iPad off at 19,999ft!
On the Freighter you don't have the joys of that or of the CC storming up to you and demanding you turn your iPad off at 19,999ft!
