Hong Kong Airlines Aircraft orders
Guest
Posts: n/a
Hong Kong Airlines Aircraft orders
6 777300er's PAX birds.
Plus they ordered 747 8 Is.
I think CX needs to take them seriously.
Hong Kong Airlines - PILOT CAREER CENTER
Plus they ordered 747 8 Is.
I think CX needs to take them seriously.
Hong Kong Airlines - PILOT CAREER CENTER
You have to remeber tha HKA is used as a source of aircraft for the Hainan group which uses the airline to get round the Chinese Government restrictions on importing aircraft and tax. How many 737s have been delivered compared to what they are operating now. Not sure, but I seem to remeber they kept ordering the things and they are currently operating less than ten. The rest have all be transferred to other Hainan operators.
Join Date: Jan 1999
Posts: 275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I half believed that theory Dan, until the Mainlanders "blocked" the HKA A380 order at Paris this year (in protest against EU Carbon Tariffs).
So it appears the Mainlanders are no mugs, and well able to manipulate HKA's order book when they see fit.
So, which is it?
Mainlander regs on imports can be circumvented via HKA order book,
or
Mainland Government has ultimate control of HKA order books?
The former assertion is pure innuendo - the latter is proven fact!
So it appears the Mainlanders are no mugs, and well able to manipulate HKA's order book when they see fit.
So, which is it?
Mainlander regs on imports can be circumvented via HKA order book,
or
Mainland Government has ultimate control of HKA order books?
The former assertion is pure innuendo - the latter is proven fact!
Algol
HKA isn’t used to circumvent centralised aircraft orders. It is used to circumvent mainland tax on the importation of new aircraft. Just as so many mainland business jets are kept in Hong Kong. That is a FACT.
HKA isn’t used to circumvent centralised aircraft orders. It is used to circumvent mainland tax on the importation of new aircraft. Just as so many mainland business jets are kept in Hong Kong. That is a FACT.
Join Date: Jan 1999
Posts: 275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Maybe so, but whatever the motive, the evident FACT remains - that nothing HKA does goes by without Beijings approval.
It would thus seem rather odd that Beijing would tolerate the use of the company as nothing but a massive tax evasion scam. Remember, the inference being bandied about is that HKA exists for no other purpose!
Credible?
I think not.
It would thus seem rather odd that Beijing would tolerate the use of the company as nothing but a massive tax evasion scam. Remember, the inference being bandied about is that HKA exists for no other purpose!
Credible?
I think not.
Algol
A simple aircraft serial number search would indicate that most of the aircraft ordered over the last 5 years by HKA are now with HNA. I would class that as credible evidence HKA has and is being used as a legal tax minimisation vehicle. How much Beijing tolerates this and for that matter most of the mainland companies that import business jets into China through the use of HK listed companies is open to debate but it is evident from their behaviour to date they don’t have an issue with it.
A simple aircraft serial number search would indicate that most of the aircraft ordered over the last 5 years by HKA are now with HNA. I would class that as credible evidence HKA has and is being used as a legal tax minimisation vehicle. How much Beijing tolerates this and for that matter most of the mainland companies that import business jets into China through the use of HK listed companies is open to debate but it is evident from their behaviour to date they don’t have an issue with it.
Join Date: Jan 1999
Posts: 275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A simple aircraft serial number search....
....would indicate that most of the aircraft ordered over the last 5 years by HKA are now with HNA.
Or lumping them together?
I would class that as credible evidence HKA has and is being used as a legal tax minimisation vehicle.
They've gone from a single A330 in June 2010 to ten A330's today. Pilot numbers have doubled in the last 12 months. Their plans are already well set for delivery of 5 more A330's and a new fleet of 8 A320's in the next 12 months.
As to B777's or A380's, you may be right - I personally don't see the need for those A380's - but who cares, they're just a political football now anyhow. The rest of those deliveries represent massive expansion. That is great news for pilot employment prospects and should be welcomed - I'm sure you'd agree.
I guess only time will tell who is right.
But we won't have to wait long to find out - the next A330 comes in Feb, and the first A320 is due in a matter of weeks.
Last edited by Algol; 27th Dec 2011 at 17:36.
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: LHS
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hong Kong Airlines confirms order for 10 A380s By: Mavis Toh Singapore
03:39 9 Jan 2012
Source:
Hong Kong Airlines has confirmed an order for 10 Airbus A380 aircraft at a list price of $3.8 billion.
The airline signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) with Airbus for the aircraft at the Paris Air Show in June 2011, but the deal was only confirmed last month, said a spokeswoman.
With the new aircraft, due to be delivered from 2015, the carrier will introduce long-haul services to destinations including Paris, London and Sydney, she added.
Airbus said at the Paris Air Show it signed a tentative agreement for 10 A380s with an undisclosed customer.
Industry sources told Flightglobal Pro in November 2011 that Hong Kong Airlines was discussing with Airbus to take over the A380 slots that were previously filled by Australia's Qantas Airways.
Qantas has deferred the delivery of six A380s, which it was due to receive in 2014.
03:39 9 Jan 2012
Source:
Hong Kong Airlines has confirmed an order for 10 Airbus A380 aircraft at a list price of $3.8 billion.
The airline signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) with Airbus for the aircraft at the Paris Air Show in June 2011, but the deal was only confirmed last month, said a spokeswoman.
With the new aircraft, due to be delivered from 2015, the carrier will introduce long-haul services to destinations including Paris, London and Sydney, she added.
Airbus said at the Paris Air Show it signed a tentative agreement for 10 A380s with an undisclosed customer.
Industry sources told Flightglobal Pro in November 2011 that Hong Kong Airlines was discussing with Airbus to take over the A380 slots that were previously filled by Australia's Qantas Airways.
Qantas has deferred the delivery of six A380s, which it was due to receive in 2014.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To me, this news serves to reinforce the CX market strategy of beating them with frequency and product. You will not beat HKA A380s on seat economics (even if we buy A380s ourselves), but you can keep the product offering superior in terms of passenger experience, convenient connections, and frequency for time sensitive travellers. That combined with a cargo hold full of revenue should enable CX to remain competitive in response to this challenge. Reference our competitive position on the DXB route against Emirates' A380s.
The worst thing CX could do would be to run a parallel A380 on the same routes as HKA. We would do so at a cost disadvantage, flood the market with seats, and simultaneously destroy cargo revenue and frequency for our business pax. How would that make any sense?
Stay quick, nimble, and better than the adversary. Don't stoop to their level! Now let the floggings begin...
The worst thing CX could do would be to run a parallel A380 on the same routes as HKA. We would do so at a cost disadvantage, flood the market with seats, and simultaneously destroy cargo revenue and frequency for our business pax. How would that make any sense?
Stay quick, nimble, and better than the adversary. Don't stoop to their level! Now let the floggings begin...
All very well, but when HKG becomes 'slot limited', which I understand will happen in 2015, it's gonna be about size, as it will be the only variable left. Junior FO's and iCadets note; promotion will be 'dead men's shoes'.
The third runway, whenever that is built, will have little effect until the cousins up north open up their airspace and remove the 'glass wall', whenever that may be.
Nowhere else to go except the -380; but wait a minute...haven't our competitors booked up the production slots
...looks like it will be the smaller warmed-over Boeing.
Maybe David Downturn's vision of a 'boutique airline' was prescient after all, as the mainlanders swamp the China routes with A380's out of Guangzhou, Shenzhen etc.
The third runway, whenever that is built, will have little effect until the cousins up north open up their airspace and remove the 'glass wall', whenever that may be.
Nowhere else to go except the -380; but wait a minute...haven't our competitors booked up the production slots
...looks like it will be the smaller warmed-over Boeing.Maybe David Downturn's vision of a 'boutique airline' was prescient after all, as the mainlanders swamp the China routes with A380's out of Guangzhou, Shenzhen etc.
Last edited by Captain Dart; 16th Jan 2012 at 22:08.
Join Date: Jan 1999
Posts: 275
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hong Kong Airlines has become (25-Jan-2012) a new operator of Airbus single aisle aircraft, following the delivery of its first A320. The aircraft is the first of 30 A320s ordered by the airline and is powered by CFM International's CFM56 engines. Seating 152 passengers in two classes, the A320s will be operated across the carrier’s regional network, linking Hong Kong with destinations in mainland China, and North and South East Asia.
Hong Kong Airlines has also taken delivery of its latest A330-200, featuring a new all-premium class layout configured with 116 seats. The aircraft will be used to launch new non-stop services to London. The delivery increases the carrier’s in-service widebody fleet to 10 aircraft, comprising seven A330-200 passenger aircraft and three A330-200Fs. [more - CAPA Analysis]
Hong Kong Airlines takes delivery of its first A320; A330-200 added to fleet | CAPA
Hong Kong Airlines has also taken delivery of its latest A330-200, featuring a new all-premium class layout configured with 116 seats. The aircraft will be used to launch new non-stop services to London. The delivery increases the carrier’s in-service widebody fleet to 10 aircraft, comprising seven A330-200 passenger aircraft and three A330-200Fs. [more - CAPA Analysis]
Hong Kong Airlines takes delivery of its first A320; A330-200 added to fleet | CAPA
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 672
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I think there are quite a few production slots of the 380 available and given the opportunity by Airbus, there are a few airlines out there who would happily delay theirs further. More interest from airlines and of course Airbus can simply increase production rates, although obviously not just for an order from a single airline.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Polar Route
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
geh065,
From what I hear, Airbus is nowhere close to being able to increase production on the 380 line. Happy to be corrected if that is no longer the case. In the case of airlines willing to delay delivery, I'm sure that is true. However, what does that say about the airplane as a money maker?
From what I hear, Airbus is nowhere close to being able to increase production on the 380 line. Happy to be corrected if that is no longer the case. In the case of airlines willing to delay delivery, I'm sure that is true. However, what does that say about the airplane as a money maker?
