Penny pinching...

[Alpor]

This does raise the question as to whether a crewmember who is not part of the operating crew (or because he is not qualified on the aircraft could not be part of the operating crew) can legally be included on the GD. As we all know this move came about to save airport taxes. But I'm sure the GMA has the answer.

[quacker]

Really? Name one airline that does that.

Virgin Atlantic

[SMOC]

I believe it's the HK CAD that requires crew to wear uniform. Years ago crews went base training in civvies. Today they barely look at your crew card It's the same CANNOT that stops crews from being able to use the freighter for staff travel. They cannot think outside the box!

[nitpicker330]

Probably the same idiots that won't let Crew change aircraft in HK by walking airside. Or the same idiots that won't let you into the departure area from the Aircraft.

[Brown Nose]

Easy, change into civvies on board then use HKID to go through electronic channel instead of crew channel

[Harbour Dweller]

Really? Name one airline that does that

Qantas

The Airlines that think outside the box are starting to add up.

[Gordomac]

Just retired & find all this a good read, particularly out of uniform & JD& coke at hand ! Everyone hates the "in the old days" stuff but I did work for the glorious Air Europe from '79 -'91. Long haul positioning was the best bit. Flt Deck went firm First. Cabin crew went firm Business but they were often upgraded & joined us in First. We were NOT to wear uniform & dress appropriately for the class of cabin. Full use of the lounges was made by all. There was never a case of anyone behaving outrageously. We were treated extremely well by the company & conducted ourselves, reasonably. And, yeah, in full uniform, in the crew bus, heading for the hotel in Bongo Bongo, or wherever, what fun to down the 'browncows' carefully made up by the number One for the journey ! How awful to read of the continued denegration within this once proud careeer. Not much of it sounds like fun anymore.

[Shot Nancy]

Really? Name one airline that does that?

QANTAS.
QANTAS paxing crew are issued with a boarding pass and are not on the GD.
Uniform is not required.

So let me get this straight - you are not type rated on the aircraft, you have no intention or qualification to fly that aircraft, yet you are to be "prosecuted" for an offence that in fact you cannot commit, albeit lawfully.

I agree it appears ridiculous Bob.

Paxed down to Miami with a boarding pass and had a few drinkies. Transferred to a company aircraft for flight down to South America, on the GD so uniform and no booze.

I wouldn't drink if I was on the GD.
Then again the airline I am with now doesn't have pax sectors.

[jonathon68]

PX is a duty, and Company policy has always been clear about drinking on duty.

The idea that not being rated on the aircraft type does not really cover all the possibilities either. I was DT (many years ago) on another type, from Europe when we diverted en-route with a medical emergency. I was quite busy sorting out issues for the operating crew.

Management are paranoid about legal liability. The NTC is just another example of CYA.

[treboryelk]

Bueno Hombre

Don't think!

[Flying Phoenix]

For crying out loud, can't anyone get through a PX sector without having a cocktail? Sure it's nice to quaff an ale during the flight (as I pax of course) but is it absolutely necessary to do so? You are on the GD in order that you don't have to stress about having to get visas for everywhere you travel. If you want to drink so badly, then perhaps the company you work for will insist that you take up the hassle of ensuring that you have the proper documentation to travel out of uniform. Thanks, but no thanks. I will have my beer in the comfort of my room.

[McGoonagall]

If you will excuse the intrusion can I put a point across that I think has not been mentioned, that of the public perception. I drive trains for a living and after 10hrs or so in the seat would love to just go and have a beer, but not in uniform. The vast majority of the public are ignorant to your and my working practices. All they see is a uniform, if that uniform is stood at a bar or in an cabin seat throwing a few tots down then their perception of us is not going to be too good. It does not matter if you are travelling PX or are off duty all they see is the uniform and draw their conclusions from that.

Another problem today is that nearly every man and his dog has a smart phone. Would you like your picture put up on a social networking site if you were having a beer in uniform along with inaccurate comments? People will always think the worst. Protect yourselves, never put yourselves in the position of having your professional integrity questioned.

[Iron Skillet]

We do not wear our uniform during the flight, only before and after the flight to get through immigration/security. In fact, we are obliged to remove our uniforms during the flight, or at least remove epaulettes, name tag, badges, etc. if the pilot does not change into another shirt once on the airplane.

[Baywatcher]

Full credit for PX flights then?!

[broadband circuit]

Member's Motion

Full credit for PX flights then?!

Put it up as a member's motion for an AOA EGM that the AOA enters contract compliance if the company does not offer an RP deal that includes full credit for PX.

I'll vote for it.

[Iron Skillet]

So will I.

[Sqwak7700]

McGoonagall, the argument has never been about wearing our uniform while drinking. No-one does this, don't need a rule for it because it should be common sense. But, as someone already pointed out, it is policy to remove uniform while PXing.

Flying Phoenix you have been at CX too long, or maybe it is the only airline you have worked for. Most airline's will get you the crew visa, that is why countries have it. Like most things, just a matter of Cathay wanting their cake for consumption as well.

And everyone, where the hell does it say that you can't have a drink if you are on the GD? I don't understand why one has to do with the other. The GD specifies that you are PXing, usually by showing you in the bottom and with a PX code next to your name. Obviously, you don't get ripped on the flight knowing that you will be walking around in uniform in the near future.

Oh well, I would not be surprised if some dooshebag abused this privilege and ruined it for all of us.

[Flying Phoenix]

This argument has been going on as long as I can remember - and with every airline I've worked for. It's pretty simple really. There are two scenarios where a pilot will find himself positioning for duty. The first (and more frequent) is when he/she is positioning in uniform and where said pilot may or may not have to operate a subsequent flight, either the same day, or perhaps even a day or two later. In this case, it's pretty clear. If the company puts you on the GD, then you must wear a uniform. In my opinion the drinking debate ends. I couldn't care less if you don't have to fly until the next day and you decide to dawn a t-shirt for the flight - you are prohibited from drinking. Take a moment to think about why it might not be such a good idea. Now the second scenario occurs when you might be positioning as a passenger to undertake simulator etc. in a foreign country. In this case, you are not required to travel in uniform as you not part of the GD - you are probably travelling on a confirmed space ID ticket. As a passenger on company business you may partake in a cocktail or two. But remember, you are still a representative of the company and must act accordingly. Don't get sloshed on the company's dime; it's not a good career move.

Finally, if these policies don't suite you, then try and have them changed by arguing the merits of why you need to have a a drink on a positioning flight. Perhaps you might convince your company to loosen it's drinking policy perhaps not, either way it won't kill you.