Bragon Air: Out of Control
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Bragon Air: Out of Control
Soooo, GMO Cpt Bi-Polar is cracking a hissy fit at Bragon Air cause Cpt Toss and others have struck a nerve...
One question for the scared girls on level 2:
Why is it hitting such a raw nerve? Gee, could it be we are talking the TRUTH?
Oh yeah, we're onto your little scam...
And while you try to search for my IP Cpt Bi...let's be serious, after knowing how you operate, do do you really think I'm that stupid to not hide it!
Enjoy the video and see the delusion that is Bragon Air
http://youtu.be/2wiKPhIJ1z8
One question for the scared girls on level 2:
Why is it hitting such a raw nerve? Gee, could it be we are talking the TRUTH?
Oh yeah, we're onto your little scam...
And while you try to search for my IP Cpt Bi...let's be serious, after knowing how you operate, do do you really think I'm that stupid to not hide it!
Enjoy the video and see the delusion that is Bragon Air
http://youtu.be/2wiKPhIJ1z8
Last edited by CptWhistleblower; 28th Apr 2011 at 08:29. Reason: Better You Tube link
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Every other industry in the world is subject to harsh criticism in the form of blogging and forums etc. The reason the KA club have their knickers in a knot is because they have been immune to it for so long and now people are willing to speak their mind. CX are used to it it's like water off a ducks back for them they have been tyrants for eons!
What they forget it is although the criticisms were harsh like most tabloids or blogs, but the words alleged and rumored are often used that doesn't imply 100% guilt.
The other thing is from a management perspective they also have a right of reply and the right to use this forum and counter the allegations posted here. In the end this is also about free speech the truth and a just system.
IP addresses can not be handed out willy nilly, it's against the law and you need a court order. If pprune give out peoples addresses without the order they are liable.
The other thread was deleted obviously BUT it did touch on some issues that are bothering the crews at the moment - if the management could pull their heads in for one minute they may want to address the issues rather than resort to their usual bullish tactics of LETS STAMP THESE GUYS OUT.
KA the guys are pissed and you need to resolve your internal issues.
That said if there is something fundamentally wrong with the system then you should speak your mind and air your grievances - the industry is going to **** and we cop enough crap already.
What they forget it is although the criticisms were harsh like most tabloids or blogs, but the words alleged and rumored are often used that doesn't imply 100% guilt.
The other thing is from a management perspective they also have a right of reply and the right to use this forum and counter the allegations posted here. In the end this is also about free speech the truth and a just system.
IP addresses can not be handed out willy nilly, it's against the law and you need a court order. If pprune give out peoples addresses without the order they are liable.
The other thread was deleted obviously BUT it did touch on some issues that are bothering the crews at the moment - if the management could pull their heads in for one minute they may want to address the issues rather than resort to their usual bullish tactics of LETS STAMP THESE GUYS OUT.
KA the guys are pissed and you need to resolve your internal issues.
That said if there is something fundamentally wrong with the system then you should speak your mind and air your grievances - the industry is going to **** and we cop enough crap already.
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PPRUNE is owned by big business in the USA the law suit capital of the world you cant give out peoples IP until their is a court order through a criminal investigation.
People in high profile places are open for criticism and allegations, they also have the right of response if they chose to exercise ..... I mean Berlosconi has flat out denied ... what about you muppets? How about a response?
That saying if it takes to go to court to uncover weather or not these guys have been abusing their power then I feel it's worth it. Especially when it's been alleged that they have been continuing to try and ruin peoples careers even after they have left the company.
Through data access request from solicitors and the labour department the "real references" are able to be uncovered and they will be. Despite the fact that I advised the DPA of this and they never replied - MAN UP DPA
Yawn .... my coffee is going cold.
People in high profile places are open for criticism and allegations, they also have the right of response if they chose to exercise ..... I mean Berlosconi has flat out denied ... what about you muppets? How about a response?
That saying if it takes to go to court to uncover weather or not these guys have been abusing their power then I feel it's worth it. Especially when it's been alleged that they have been continuing to try and ruin peoples careers even after they have left the company.
Through data access request from solicitors and the labour department the "real references" are able to be uncovered and they will be. Despite the fact that I advised the DPA of this and they never replied - MAN UP DPA
Yawn .... my coffee is going cold.
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DPA man up?
Good one Toss...these babies running the show at the moment, are wanting to get into management. Like the video says...no backbone in any of them!
They are perfect for level 2.
Numero uno at the DPA will be all upset now that someone has spoken out against him.
Well instead of crying about it...do something, actually fight for your colleagues. Speak up about the low life's running the circus and their intimidation tactics over the crews...
When was the last time the DPA did any sort of reasonable job at that?
Good one Toss...these babies running the show at the moment, are wanting to get into management. Like the video says...no backbone in any of them!
They are perfect for level 2.
Numero uno at the DPA will be all upset now that someone has spoken out against him.
Well instead of crying about it...do something, actually fight for your colleagues. Speak up about the low life's running the circus and their intimidation tactics over the crews...
When was the last time the DPA did any sort of reasonable job at that?
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Boo Yahh, if you think any of the Dpa committee have a remit to alter or comment on Ka management behaviour on anything other than industrial issues you are sadly mistaken.
Clearly level 2's behaviour has set a new low, remarkable given their predecessors. Previously they've stayed just above the ethical line while still being less than average peformers. I'd really like to know how you think the Dpa can address this.
Clearly level 2's behaviour has set a new low, remarkable given their predecessors. Previously they've stayed just above the ethical line while still being less than average peformers. I'd really like to know how you think the Dpa can address this.
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They should get their lawyers and the labour department to thoroughly probe the allegations that senior management are vindictively destroying their ex employee's future job prospects by slandering them on the phone when called by potential employers ie: TAG Aviation in Hong Kong.
They should also get their lawyers to probe the FACT that despite the numbers not adding up on various housing allowances some pilots were allowed to stay and others were fired.
They should also get their lawyers & CEO to probe the allegations that senior management (may have) breached the housing contract.
Guilty until proven innocent it's the CX KA way!
Why else pay all these sups for all these years and when it's crunch time they sit back like a bunch of spineless bitches and do nothing ... man up DPA
They should also get their lawyers to probe the FACT that despite the numbers not adding up on various housing allowances some pilots were allowed to stay and others were fired.
They should also get their lawyers & CEO to probe the allegations that senior management (may have) breached the housing contract.
Guilty until proven innocent it's the CX KA way!
Why else pay all these sups for all these years and when it's crunch time they sit back like a bunch of spineless bitches and do nothing ... man up DPA
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They should also get their lawyers & CEO to probe the allegations that senior management (may have) breached the housing contract.
I thought you were certain Toss? Aren't you defaming people?
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Last thread got deleted 
Need to play by the rules I guess ... I got carried away and was using the standard Fragrant Management Rule of : Guilty Until Proven Innocent
Shame on me ... I'll use standard tabloid wording from here on in
"May Have ... Alleged .... Rumored .... a source close to ... anonymous insider" .... Ohh that's right it's a RUMOUR NETWORK
Ok we'll get average lawyers instead unless you're in the Sh%t and then I bet you'll want a decent one ....
Need to play by the rules I guess ... I got carried away and was using the standard Fragrant Management Rule of : Guilty Until Proven Innocent
Shame on me ... I'll use standard tabloid wording from here on in
"May Have ... Alleged .... Rumored .... a source close to ... anonymous insider" .... Ohh that's right it's a RUMOUR NETWORK
Ok we'll get average lawyers instead unless you're in the Sh%t and then I bet you'll want a decent one ....
Last edited by Capt Toss Parker; 31st Mar 2011 at 09:19.
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Outie...Cpt Toss is on the mark...there is your answer.
You guys have a chance to get this place under some sort of order, and yet you sit by and let it happen.
Clear the cupboard and get rid of the cancer that is on level 2.
Make the company something, Bragon once was one of the most desirable airlines to work for in the world. Now it nothing more than a cheap hooker from the streets on crack.
What a legacy these pricks have created, they should be ashamed!
You guys have a chance to get this place under some sort of order, and yet you sit by and let it happen.
Clear the cupboard and get rid of the cancer that is on level 2.
Make the company something, Bragon once was one of the most desirable airlines to work for in the world. Now it nothing more than a cheap hooker from the streets on crack.
What a legacy these pricks have created, they should be ashamed!
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And Then...need to read up on defamation. Firstly, no one has been named outright. Secondly, defamation is not recognised in HK.
How could the DPA address this...wellll:
- They could actually make their voice heard, instead of sitting back and cowering to gross management tactics.
- They could be investigating why pilots are flying around at KA with threats over their heads from mgt. You think this is safe?
What happens when one of these threats from mgt affects a guy on the line and something does go wrong? Mgt will hide and all fingers will point at the pilot. But forget even those 2 points above...where will Bragon be then? How safe do you think your cozy little position is then?
Think about the big picture...these crap intimidation tactics will affect each and every pilot within Bragon if something does go wrong...and how close did it come with a Training Captain in the 320 approach and landing recently? The closest that Bragon has probably ever had to a major!
- Guys livelihoods threathened after they leave Bragon because of childish (and it is nothing more than that) antics from mgt, that I think most parents would not allow their kids to behave as such.
Double standards in housing allowances...some booted, some asked to pay back. Where was the DPA on those?
- More coming to the surface soon, but one said individual from level 2 may have only been collecting housing for a short time while getting renovations...but it was wrong he was even collecting at all! Anybody else was sacked.
- And then we have more individuals (connected to level 2 of course)that were getting renos and had been claiming for considerable more time...yes, we do know about that too
So with just some of these issues above, where was the DPA's voice? They should be hanging these pricks on level 2 out to dry.
And as these things come to the surface, Cpt Bi-Polar aka Brutus is going psycho wanting IP addresses, etc...does that not say something to you in a very clear way? GUILTY! He is running scared and he damn well should be, he has lots to be afraid of, and no one has pushed him into this position, he has done it all with his own devices!
But then the DPA will probably say nothing can be done and take similar tactics that mgt has and get up any member who dares to question anything against what the DPA wants, never mind the members should be voting on these things...NOT told what to do!
How could the DPA address this...wellll:
- They could actually make their voice heard, instead of sitting back and cowering to gross management tactics.
- They could be investigating why pilots are flying around at KA with threats over their heads from mgt. You think this is safe?
What happens when one of these threats from mgt affects a guy on the line and something does go wrong? Mgt will hide and all fingers will point at the pilot. But forget even those 2 points above...where will Bragon be then? How safe do you think your cozy little position is then?
Think about the big picture...these crap intimidation tactics will affect each and every pilot within Bragon if something does go wrong...and how close did it come with a Training Captain in the 320 approach and landing recently? The closest that Bragon has probably ever had to a major!
- Guys livelihoods threathened after they leave Bragon because of childish (and it is nothing more than that) antics from mgt, that I think most parents would not allow their kids to behave as such.
Double standards in housing allowances...some booted, some asked to pay back. Where was the DPA on those?
- More coming to the surface soon, but one said individual from level 2 may have only been collecting housing for a short time while getting renovations...but it was wrong he was even collecting at all! Anybody else was sacked.
- And then we have more individuals (connected to level 2 of course)that were getting renos and had been claiming for considerable more time...yes, we do know about that too
So with just some of these issues above, where was the DPA's voice? They should be hanging these pricks on level 2 out to dry.
And as these things come to the surface, Cpt Bi-Polar aka Brutus is going psycho wanting IP addresses, etc...does that not say something to you in a very clear way? GUILTY! He is running scared and he damn well should be, he has lots to be afraid of, and no one has pushed him into this position, he has done it all with his own devices!
But then the DPA will probably say nothing can be done and take similar tactics that mgt has and get up any member who dares to question anything against what the DPA wants, never mind the members should be voting on these things...NOT told what to do!
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DPA
I've just e-mailed the DPA highlighting these issues and I've asked for a written response as to how they will investigate these problems.
If they don't reply I'll be on the phone hammering them. I'll also be taking stock on the DPA if they fail to follow up this up.
Everyone please e-mail the DPA with your concerns and raise these issues.
They obviously need some encouragement
If they don't reply I'll be on the phone hammering them. I'll also be taking stock on the DPA if they fail to follow up this up.
Everyone please e-mail the DPA with your concerns and raise these issues.
They obviously need some encouragement
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Stick to polite language guys. With the other thread you allowed the mods every excuse to pull it. The emotive language in this thread is going to make them pull this one as well.
I think you will find the sacked pilots were read a letter that just told them they were being terminated with no reason. In Hong Kong an employer can terminate an employee with no reason as long as they receive their full notice package, unless the law has changed since my time.
Jumping up and down and getting all excited will not help. Putting pressure on them where it hurts them will help and is the only way forward with this.
I think you will find the sacked pilots were read a letter that just told them they were being terminated with no reason. In Hong Kong an employer can terminate an employee with no reason as long as they receive their full notice package, unless the law has changed since my time.
Jumping up and down and getting all excited will not help. Putting pressure on them where it hurts them will help and is the only way forward with this.
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Cpt Whistleblower I was not referring to a legal defamation but a moral one. Some of the accusations against Level 2 are simply not true. This is a smear campaign that has become distasteful. Even to people like myself who have serious issues as to the conduct of some from KA management.
This could have been a clever tactic but credibility has been lost.
Turning on the DPA was another cowardly swipe. What did you guys ask for in your unsolicited and no doubt anonymous emails to the DPA? It would need to be better than some of the crap commanded in the above.
This could have been a clever tactic but credibility has been lost.
Turning on the DPA was another cowardly swipe. What did you guys ask for in your unsolicited and no doubt anonymous emails to the DPA? It would need to be better than some of the crap commanded in the above.
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And Then...
It's not a smear campaign, it is fact. Are you denying that guys have been threatened with their last chance, etc?
- Just go back to a certain 330 flying over a large expanse of water...that Cpt was given a direct threat.
- The 320 doing a radical approach...deny it all you want, but a Training Manager was at the helm, funny how all talk about that 'incident' went quiet when it was found out that it was someone from training.
- Aircraft flying over the straits on one engine...gee that went quiet too when certain facts came out about the captain. Double standards and you are trying to stick up for it!
- Housing...why is it when any Level2 joker is talked about, that its simply not true? Don't worry, we know about a certain individual claiming while home was getting renovated, and then there were the others living 'on campus' shall we say.
Trying to pose as somebody against mgt and then sticking up for these kinds of tactics? You are pathetic.
Tell me why it has hit such a nerve with 'Brutus'...if it was 'simply not true' or anything else, he shouldn't have a worry, it is only prune after all. When things have been said about the big green, they let it pass...but 'Brutus' is running scared, he has been called out for his pathetic mgt style and letting all this crap happen right under his nose....and he is endorsing this behaviour from his troops.
He is a coward...he tries to be seen as the guy who gets along with everyone, be peoples buddy (it was Brutus' buddy that was claiming housing while flying for a certain Chinese carrier while on leave...what happened? nothing)...but he is so busy getting the little tin soldiers to do his dirty work, he has turned into a dictator with scant regard for livelihoods or anything else from the pilots. One thing runs 'Brutus' these days...his bonus check.
To try and say that we requested any crap from the DPA...you are dreaming...the DPA is getting paid good dues to represent the pilot body, not be on their knees asking for forgiveness from mgt. They came in with all guns blazing and burning the previous DPA committee...so what have they done? They started dictating that this 11% pay rise over 3years as the best deal the pilots will get. $1 billion in profit and they get a raise that doesn't keep up with the rising costs of living....mmm, good one!
So who are you really And Then...
I really hope And Then you're not the Level 2 guy from NZ that always has a 'love on' for those in positions like CP...you were after all, the one sticking up for the CP stand-in at Bragon Air and said his decision to let that aircraft fly back from NZ after a tail strike was well justified.....talk about mis-guided.
Or maybe And Then, you are the one making the threats to the pilots...he has been sitting on Prune and the DPA website 24/7 keeping an eye on everyone. What are you going to do, threaten anybody who makes a post? Is this really what your life has become?
If it isn't you, then get on the DPA site, 9am...5pm...anytime you see fit and gee, who is always there? watching you and anything you post, his name is there in pretty font for all to see and he's always watching...why do the DPA let's these mgt scum even on the DPA website?
It's not a smear campaign, it is fact. Are you denying that guys have been threatened with their last chance, etc?
- Just go back to a certain 330 flying over a large expanse of water...that Cpt was given a direct threat.
- The 320 doing a radical approach...deny it all you want, but a Training Manager was at the helm, funny how all talk about that 'incident' went quiet when it was found out that it was someone from training.
- Aircraft flying over the straits on one engine...gee that went quiet too when certain facts came out about the captain. Double standards and you are trying to stick up for it!
- Housing...why is it when any Level2 joker is talked about, that its simply not true? Don't worry, we know about a certain individual claiming while home was getting renovated, and then there were the others living 'on campus' shall we say.
Trying to pose as somebody against mgt and then sticking up for these kinds of tactics? You are pathetic.
Tell me why it has hit such a nerve with 'Brutus'...if it was 'simply not true' or anything else, he shouldn't have a worry, it is only prune after all. When things have been said about the big green, they let it pass...but 'Brutus' is running scared, he has been called out for his pathetic mgt style and letting all this crap happen right under his nose....and he is endorsing this behaviour from his troops.
He is a coward...he tries to be seen as the guy who gets along with everyone, be peoples buddy (it was Brutus' buddy that was claiming housing while flying for a certain Chinese carrier while on leave...what happened? nothing)...but he is so busy getting the little tin soldiers to do his dirty work, he has turned into a dictator with scant regard for livelihoods or anything else from the pilots. One thing runs 'Brutus' these days...his bonus check.
To try and say that we requested any crap from the DPA...you are dreaming...the DPA is getting paid good dues to represent the pilot body, not be on their knees asking for forgiveness from mgt. They came in with all guns blazing and burning the previous DPA committee...so what have they done? They started dictating that this 11% pay rise over 3years as the best deal the pilots will get. $1 billion in profit and they get a raise that doesn't keep up with the rising costs of living....mmm, good one!
So who are you really And Then...
I really hope And Then you're not the Level 2 guy from NZ that always has a 'love on' for those in positions like CP...you were after all, the one sticking up for the CP stand-in at Bragon Air and said his decision to let that aircraft fly back from NZ after a tail strike was well justified.....talk about mis-guided.
Or maybe And Then, you are the one making the threats to the pilots...he has been sitting on Prune and the DPA website 24/7 keeping an eye on everyone. What are you going to do, threaten anybody who makes a post? Is this really what your life has become?
If it isn't you, then get on the DPA site, 9am...5pm...anytime you see fit and gee, who is always there? watching you and anything you post, his name is there in pretty font for all to see and he's always watching...why do the DPA let's these mgt scum even on the DPA website?
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What's wrong with having your house renovated while claiming housing? It's at no extra cost to the company (if you are paying for it) and it's a common thing to do in HK prior to moving into a new flat to make it more efficient/personal.
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Cpt Whistleblower
That is nothing short of a spray of paranoia. Relax a bit. I am getting schizophrenic trying to work out who you think I am.
Radical approach? Wow. You should be a journo! Training Manager at the helm? C'mon. I have heard the rumors but that is just another smear at Level 2. Capt given a direct threat flying over a large expanse of water? What are you talking about. Slow down. Take a breath!
There maybe a lot in what you say. You need to learn how to say it. Please stop taking swipes at your colleagues too.
That is nothing short of a spray of paranoia. Relax a bit. I am getting schizophrenic trying to work out who you think I am.
Radical approach? Wow. You should be a journo! Training Manager at the helm? C'mon. I have heard the rumors but that is just another smear at Level 2. Capt given a direct threat flying over a large expanse of water? What are you talking about. Slow down. Take a breath!
There maybe a lot in what you say. You need to learn how to say it. Please stop taking swipes at your colleagues too.
Last edited by And Then; 3rd Apr 2011 at 02:52.