Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Worldwide > Fragrant Harbour
Reload this Page >

Cathay Jackwagon

Fragrant Harbour A forum for the large number of pilots (expats and locals) based with the various airlines in Hong Kong. Air Traffic Controllers are also warmly welcomed into the forum.

Cathay Jackwagon

Old 22nd Nov 2010, 00:53
  #1 (permalink)  
quidquid excusatio prandium pro
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 351
Cathay Jackwagon

So there we were, dozens of airplanes westbound over the Midwest, Kansas controller sends a Cathay bomber down 2000 feet as opposed to sending two Airbus aircraft down due traffic conflict. Ten minutes max at lower altitude, but Cathay pilot, Oz by the sound of it, bitches like the stuck pig he is, long rangers must have priority over the US transcons, or didn't ya know?.

WTF, over? Since when does Jardine Swire, of late, and the RAAF own the skies over America?
bugg smasher is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 01:03
  #2 (permalink)  
Psychophysiological entity
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Tweet Rob_Benham Famous author. Well, slightly famous.
Age: 80
Posts: 4,856
Indignation rules. C'mon Bug Smasher, when all is said and done, controlling is all about pure logistical reasoning. Ah, knew there'd be a flaw in my argument.
Loose rivets is online now  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 01:35
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wingham NSW Australia
Age: 79
Posts: 1,349
International v's US Transcontinental Control

Bugg Smasher. Seems to me you have made a few assumptions there. Firstly, are you sure the CX guy was an Aussie? Secondly, how would you know whether or not he was an ex-RAAF pilot? Did he really "bitch like the stuck pig he really is"? or did he simply request an expedicious climb back to a higher level to get back to planned fuel burn. He was likely Hong Kong bound and wanting to avoid the fuel penalty of remaining below optimum level. Don't know what you fly but it is a bloody long way from the USA west-coast to HK and being kept low down can mean the difference between flying direct or having a diversion for fuel.
Old Fella is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 02:03
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: hkSAR
Posts: 5
cathay rules all...didn't you know that?
INDPEN is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 05:23
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,572
ATC could well have handled the malcontent CX flight the way Tehran handled Speedbird one night a few years ago...when complaining about the lower level and needing possibly to refuel, Tehran ATC issued the THR weather and the contract fuel price, issued descent clearance (when ready) and further stated...y'alls welcome, we can offer a quick turn...Speedbird clammed up.
Gotta put 'em in their place.
The Brits and the Aussies are 'complainers'...in
the extreme.
Having said this, the CX boys and girls are trying to squeeze more dough out of Swire and Company (they'll be lucky)...and are quite militant at the present time.
Actually, I wish the CX guys (and gals) good fortune, as CX is making millions (billions) presently.
IE: pay up or...else.
411A is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 05:39
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wingham NSW Australia
Age: 79
Posts: 1,349
Aussies & Brits are complainers in the extreme.

411A What a surprise to read your recent post. My first thought on reading the post from Bugg Smasher was that you had been cloned. Why don't you get a life and find someone else besides Brits, Aussies or anyone with anything to do with CX to bag? Many of my friends are your fellow countrymen and I am sure they would share my view of your attitude to anyone who does not share your view. A phone box would look empty if you held a party in it and invited your friends, I suspect.
Old Fella is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 06:02
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,572
...and find someone else besides Brits, Aussies or anyone with anything to do with CX to bag?
Because, Old Fella...the brits and aussies are such e-a-s-y targets.
Many of my comments are tongue in cheek...read between the lines.
411A is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 06:25
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Island Paradise
Posts: 109
At NRT I once heard a CX flight get some taxi delay when inbound to the stand. The response was the most arrogant and unprofessional outburst I ever heard on the radio starting with something about fuel cost and concluded with "I demand to know what's going on here". (Didn't help them to get to the gate any faster). You'd think the Skipper had to pay for the gas himself.
Koan is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 06:32
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Age: 43
Posts: 981
Westbound over Midwest USA, he was not going to HKG. Atlanta -ANC, Miami - ANC is all I can think of as don't know what the freighters do but for sure don't fly over midwest US to HKG.
SloppyJoe is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 08:25
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Wingham NSW Australia
Age: 79
Posts: 1,349
Paying for fuel himself.

Koan, he was in a sense. CX have a "profit share" scheme as an incentive to save fuel as well as minimize other costs. That said, your story would be the exception rather than the rule and is not restricted to CX crews. Sloppy Joe, Bugg Smasher said "There we were". Maybe CX was crossing or opposite direction, I don't know nor do you. CX do operate JFK-HKG pax flights direct, but I am not sure of the route. They also fly JFK-YVR-HKG pax services. 411A, wish I could believe your comments are "tongue in cheek".
Old Fella is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 09:58
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Island Paradise
Posts: 109
Koan, he was in a sense. CX have a "profit share" scheme as an incentive to save fuel as well as minimize other costs.

I'm also sure it was an exception. We of course have profit share and the same professional obligation to operate efficiently as well, and our fair share of wackos, but this was really outrageous. Absolutely laughed our aXXes of in the cockpit thinking what a drag it would be to fly with such a tosser. And yelling at the Japanese in particular is a very poor way to motivate them.

Last edited by Koan; 24th Nov 2010 at 03:21.
Koan is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 10:08
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US
Posts: 285
"The response was the most arrogant and unprofessional outburst I ever heard on the radio......"

He was possibly unsuited to live or operate outside his native surroundings.

I thought all the hoops etc., CX are renowned for, were supposed to weed out the sort of person who may exhibited this sort of tantrum. The crew are representing an employer. Would this behaviour be representative of company culture, one may indeed ask?
weido_salt is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 11:55
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Age: 43
Posts: 981
Old Fella,

OK my US geography may not be as good as your but how can a CX aircraft be over the midwest, going in ANY direction ,on its way to or from HKG. JFK to HKG goes pretty close to the north pole. JFK to YVR maybe had to go round a lot of weather? Yes I don't know but you know even less apparently. May have been a freighter that had fuel as its freight but other than that I doubt he was going to or from HKG.
SloppyJoe is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 12:10
  #14 (permalink)  
quidquid excusatio prandium pro
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: New York
Posts: 351
Old Fella,

He was instructed to descend 2000 feet for traffic conflict. He demanded to know the reason, the controller politely explained the options; either CX would have to descend, or two other aircraft would.

The CX pilot then demanded to know what the other two aircraft types were. On being told Airbus, he then asked their destinations, US west coast, and then gave the controller a mini-lecture on 'big' aircraft vs 'little' aircraft fuel burrns.

Arrogant and condescending in the extreme.

As informed, he was brought back up to his original level ten minutes later.
bugg smasher is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 12:13
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Nomadic
Posts: 240
Jeez! Who cares where it was going? So the guy got pissed off on the radio....yeah, unprofessional. Whoopy doo. It happens, and Cathay don't have a monopoly on it. Never heard US pilots get pissed? Or the usual suspects, KLM?
Can't believe this non event has already generated such a long and pointless thread!
The Wraith is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 12:20
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Asia
Posts: 382
Trouble is everyone sounds like a stuck pig over US airspace these days. Must be the new scrotum squeezers deployed in Atlanta or Dallas who squeezed the residual good humour out of the boys on CX091
Traffic is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 14:03
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Not over the Rockies anymore.
Posts: 241
bugsmasher,

I kinda have to agree with the CX crew--Airbi should always have to make way for Boeings...........

Old Fella,

my geography of the US is pretty good, and I can tell you, that "the middle of Kansas" is nowhere near being on the way to HKG.
unless of course your departing from the middle of Kansas!!
act700 is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 16:35
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: I don't really hate them...I just miss flight attendants.
Posts: 129
Haven't y'all heard about the big boom in asian freight? Must have been the new Wichita-HKG route for the -8 they were testing out.
FR8R H8R is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 16:37
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: I don't really hate them...I just miss flight attendants.
Posts: 129
By the way, what the hell is a "jackwagon"? Please elaborate for those of us who don't speak american.
FR8R H8R is offline  
Old 22nd Nov 2010, 23:18
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: hong kong
Posts: 137
And American ATC are "the most professional".......(that's tongue in cheek for those of you who have trouble)
4 driver is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.