Cabin Crew Shafted
Join Date: Sep 2003
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Gee, I wish I could swap away all of my flying so that I could work 30 hours and get paid for 70. Most CC did not abuse the system, but some did. If you swap down to 30 hours, then you should get paid for 30 hours. Period! I'm surprised CX didn't try to close that loophole a long time ago.
As far as them being a stronger union than us... true, they are -- and kudos to them. But, the reality is that it's easier for them because they're not afraid to lose their low-paying job. We on the other hand, worry about the future and not next month's roster. We realize that if we f$%k it up and lose our job, we won't be able to make up for it in the long run. We're too scared to take the risk. Management knows this and is quick to take advantage of it.
I don't think that the CC have as many different payscales/conditions/etc. as we do. Pilots think about 1 person. I'd take the risk and go on strike over this tomorrow, but I know I'd be a party of one and would just end up losing my job.
As far as them being a stronger union than us... true, they are -- and kudos to them. But, the reality is that it's easier for them because they're not afraid to lose their low-paying job. We on the other hand, worry about the future and not next month's roster. We realize that if we f$%k it up and lose our job, we won't be able to make up for it in the long run. We're too scared to take the risk. Management knows this and is quick to take advantage of it.
I don't think that the CC have as many different payscales/conditions/etc. as we do. Pilots think about 1 person. I'd take the risk and go on strike over this tomorrow, but I know I'd be a party of one and would just end up losing my job.
Join Date: Mar 2010
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When it come to shafting I am the MASTER , I have been shafting people most of my career.
But I do need to make an apology.
TB a nice south African bloke was one of the few decent aviators who had a Porsche like me, we used to go on drives from time to time and he used to kiss my ass in fear that one day he may get me on a check.
TB invited me round for dinner and drinks to watch the F1 one night, we had a nice time but I got a little boozed up during dinner.
TB had an early start the next day and went to bed early, this left me and his wife on the couch.
I was feeling tipsy and a bit randy so I threw myself on his wife because I thought she was giving me the eye. Just like Bert Reynolds my mustache was sparkling and my gold chain were showing - how could a married woman resist me?
TB and I had a falling out after I put one on his wife, I told him how dare he under estimate the pulling power of a Caribou pilot that never made fast jets!
TB ended up leaving his job, he was uncertain how his career on the fleet would go when he came up for command. Poor old TB made up excuses like he wanted to do real flying and get back to his roots but the truth is he left because of me....
TB I'm sorry mate you shouldn't have left your job because of me we could have worked things out. I would have given you a good ERAS report out of guilt for my wrong doings.
I'm just a sad little man with no friends, your wife was giving me mixed signals and I couldn't resist.
Sorry dude I apologise for my devious actions
But I do need to make an apology.
TB a nice south African bloke was one of the few decent aviators who had a Porsche like me, we used to go on drives from time to time and he used to kiss my ass in fear that one day he may get me on a check.
TB invited me round for dinner and drinks to watch the F1 one night, we had a nice time but I got a little boozed up during dinner.
TB had an early start the next day and went to bed early, this left me and his wife on the couch.
I was feeling tipsy and a bit randy so I threw myself on his wife because I thought she was giving me the eye. Just like Bert Reynolds my mustache was sparkling and my gold chain were showing - how could a married woman resist me?
TB and I had a falling out after I put one on his wife, I told him how dare he under estimate the pulling power of a Caribou pilot that never made fast jets!
TB ended up leaving his job, he was uncertain how his career on the fleet would go when he came up for command. Poor old TB made up excuses like he wanted to do real flying and get back to his roots but the truth is he left because of me....
TB I'm sorry mate you shouldn't have left your job because of me we could have worked things out. I would have given you a good ERAS report out of guilt for my wrong doings.
I'm just a sad little man with no friends, your wife was giving me mixed signals and I couldn't resist.
Sorry dude I apologise for my devious actions
Join Date: Jul 2000
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Check this out 
YouTube - Flight Attendant Union EGM emergency meeting 19 March, 2010
Can anyone translate it? (Far Lok?)
YouTube - Flight Attendant Union EGM emergency meeting 19 March, 2010
Can anyone translate it? (Far Lok?)
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Cathay Easter strike looms, BA woes worsen
Cathay Easter strike looms, BA woes worsen - The Standard
Cathay Easter strike looms, BA woes worsen - The Standard
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I don't think so! The majority of cabin crew are not affected by this change it is only the hourly paid crew. The company, not surprisingly, object to this section of the crew community being paid a guaranteed 70 hours but swopping away most of their roster and flying only 20 or 30 hours. The crew accepting the extra work may then earn overtime. So not only are the company paying twice for the same work but at premium rates for some of it. We can't swop into overtime which stops this happening with our roster. Obviously someone drafting the contract in ISD didn't see this loophole leaving it open, wonder if they're still employed. This is merely a case of some cabin crew abusing the goodwill of the company. They guaranteed the hourly paid crew 70 hours pay to protect them in any downturn not to allow time off for second jobs and swops into overtime. Very few things are worth striking over and this doesn't come even close.
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Cabin crew at Cathay threaten to demonstrate
Flight attendants oppose shortening of rest period
20 March 2010
South China Morning Post
Cathay Pacific Airways flight attendants have hit out at the airline's plan to cut staff layover times for flights to Milan from 48 to 28 hours, saying it will affect service and safety.
The airline's Flight Attendants' Union has threatened to protest on Thursday if management does not meet its members before noon on Wednesday about reinstating the present arrangement and withdrawing a separate policy that restricts shift-swapping by attendants.
Becky Kwan Siu-wah, vice-chairwoman of the union, said the airline announced a cut in layover time for staff on a quarter of flights to Milan from March 28, when the carrier begins a direct service to the Italian city.
"We have been enjoying at least 48 hours of outport resting time if we fly to cities with a time difference of six hours or more. This is a consensus between us and the company," Kwan said. Usually, attendants work a five-day roster if they fly to and from Europe, she said. The new arrangement would shorten the trip to four days by reducing the rest period.
She said the move would not only affect the income and rest time of staff but also posed a threat to the quality of safety and service.
"We're afraid that this will apply to other long-haul flights in the future, too," Kwan said.
The complaint came two days after the airline suspended indefinitely a new policy requiring attendants to work at least 70 hours a month before they can swap shifts with colleagues. The airline said some attendants had abused the roster system and pocketed a minimum salary despite working less than 70 hours. The new policy was put on hold after attendants threatened to strike during the Easter break.
About 500 staff attended a union meeting yesterday to discuss the issues. They requested a meeting with chief executive Tony Tyler, urging him to withdraw the policy.
They also expressed concern that management had deployed Bangkok-based crew to work on flights from Hong Kong to Melbourne under a three-month trial.
A Cathay Pacific spokeswoman said that since the airline would launch four flights to Milan per week, one would have to operate on the four-day pattern.
"We've got 7,097 flight attendants, and it takes nine to 11 years for a flight attendant to get this four-day Milan schedule once," she said, adding changes would be made when the route was up and running.
She said the airline had only 24 cabin crew based in Thailand, and the impact on Hong Kong staff would be minimal. She said the union had been approached for a meeting.
Flight attendants oppose shortening of rest period
20 March 2010
South China Morning Post
Cathay Pacific Airways flight attendants have hit out at the airline's plan to cut staff layover times for flights to Milan from 48 to 28 hours, saying it will affect service and safety.
The airline's Flight Attendants' Union has threatened to protest on Thursday if management does not meet its members before noon on Wednesday about reinstating the present arrangement and withdrawing a separate policy that restricts shift-swapping by attendants.
Becky Kwan Siu-wah, vice-chairwoman of the union, said the airline announced a cut in layover time for staff on a quarter of flights to Milan from March 28, when the carrier begins a direct service to the Italian city.
"We have been enjoying at least 48 hours of outport resting time if we fly to cities with a time difference of six hours or more. This is a consensus between us and the company," Kwan said. Usually, attendants work a five-day roster if they fly to and from Europe, she said. The new arrangement would shorten the trip to four days by reducing the rest period.
She said the move would not only affect the income and rest time of staff but also posed a threat to the quality of safety and service.
"We're afraid that this will apply to other long-haul flights in the future, too," Kwan said.
The complaint came two days after the airline suspended indefinitely a new policy requiring attendants to work at least 70 hours a month before they can swap shifts with colleagues. The airline said some attendants had abused the roster system and pocketed a minimum salary despite working less than 70 hours. The new policy was put on hold after attendants threatened to strike during the Easter break.
About 500 staff attended a union meeting yesterday to discuss the issues. They requested a meeting with chief executive Tony Tyler, urging him to withdraw the policy.
They also expressed concern that management had deployed Bangkok-based crew to work on flights from Hong Kong to Melbourne under a three-month trial.
A Cathay Pacific spokeswoman said that since the airline would launch four flights to Milan per week, one would have to operate on the four-day pattern.
"We've got 7,097 flight attendants, and it takes nine to 11 years for a flight attendant to get this four-day Milan schedule once," she said, adding changes would be made when the route was up and running.
She said the airline had only 24 cabin crew based in Thailand, and the impact on Hong Kong staff would be minimal. She said the union had been approached for a meeting.
Join Date: Oct 2003
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Article says cabin crew 'sit-in' at CX City on Thursday. Best they get a truck load of anti-wrinkle cream and an SK2 stall set-up in the Crew Lounge then, so that CX can profit from this united front!
Join Date: Jan 2010
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Well done to the the "girls' for sticking to their convictions but hard to swallow the safety implications of a reduced 2 day jolly in MXP as justification for it when they consistently get an extra day of 'rest' on every Long Haul pattern they do with us.
Perhaps we are too tired to fly after only 24 hours off and just don't appreciate it?
Perhaps we are too tired to fly after only 24 hours off and just don't appreciate it?
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24hr layover
hard to swallow the safety implications of a reduced 2 day jolly in MXP as justification for it when they consistently get an extra day of 'rest' on every Long Haul pattern they do with us.
Secondly, just because we only get 24hrs, doesn't mean they should. What sometimes mitigates the jet lag effect for us is having based crew, when a common-sense captain can use the different acclimatisations to manage the sleep.
Whilst I'm sure you've seen a few slackers in the cabin that don't pull their weight (more senior rather than junior I'd guess), most of the girls need the extra night downroute. At least we have the sanctuary of the cockpit & "controlled rest". They are on their feet for most of the flight, and when they're not in the bunk, they are at the beckon-call of the punters.
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As I said, 'well done for sticking to their convictions', unlike the AOA.
Was not accusing anyone of being lazy, junior or otherwise and I would certainly not desire to deal with the 'great unwashed' for a single minute and wholeheartedly respect the job they have to do but a 10 hour sector to MXP requiring 48 hours off to mitigate the jet lag?
I do many NA flight's with 4 HK based crew, utilising common sense rest for my crew and we still all feel like **** on the way back to HK after our 24 hours off. Maybe we should be pushing for an extra day off when no based pilot's are on the FD? Maybe they will give back the balance of the 13th month they thieved?
Bottom line is that they have historically achieved and maintained longer layover patterns than us because the company respects the unity of the FAU and they have absolutely no respect for us and get away with whatever they want.
Good luck to them!
Was not accusing anyone of being lazy, junior or otherwise and I would certainly not desire to deal with the 'great unwashed' for a single minute and wholeheartedly respect the job they have to do but a 10 hour sector to MXP requiring 48 hours off to mitigate the jet lag?
I do many NA flight's with 4 HK based crew, utilising common sense rest for my crew and we still all feel like **** on the way back to HK after our 24 hours off. Maybe we should be pushing for an extra day off when no based pilot's are on the FD? Maybe they will give back the balance of the 13th month they thieved?
Bottom line is that they have historically achieved and maintained longer layover patterns than us because the company respects the unity of the FAU and they have absolutely no respect for us and get away with whatever they want.
Good luck to them!
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Not quite so naive, but maybe selfish
Partly agree 747-8. However, I think there is some depth to this issue.
For the girls, it probably is mostly about money.
However, for me, it is about rest. Not so much for the 1 pattern a week to Milan where they get 24hrs, but in a few years time, when the thin edge of the wedge is now all the way in, and every pattern to Europe is 24hr rest for the girls. Cumulative effects can be quite insidious.
When I order an evacuation, I'd really like to have alert cabin crew activating the slides, and getting the punters out. On a personal, and admittedly selfish front, I want the girls at the door, or doors, right behind the cockpit to be alert.
For the girls, it probably is mostly about money.
However, for me, it is about rest. Not so much for the 1 pattern a week to Milan where they get 24hrs, but in a few years time, when the thin edge of the wedge is now all the way in, and every pattern to Europe is 24hr rest for the girls. Cumulative effects can be quite insidious.
When I order an evacuation, I'd really like to have alert cabin crew activating the slides, and getting the punters out. On a personal, and admittedly selfish front, I want the girls at the door, or doors, right behind the cockpit to be alert.
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Would that be the same A330 flight a few years back, that diverted to TPE due to smoke/electrical burning above the flt deck door (caused by an excellent installation job for the door lock by HAECO). Where the cabin crew, who were unable to tackle the problem with an extinguisher, called the flt crew in tears on the interphone, begging them to come out and extinguish the burning wires, cos they were sh!tting themselves?
Feel safe with the CC right behind you!?
Feel safe with the CC right behind you!?
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"Well at least they're standing up for what they care about, should they just give it up 747-8"
Not sure what you mean by give it up - do they currently have the right to determine crewing patterns? If so my apologies they shouldn't give that up. Is that what you meant?
Regarding outport rest didn't you know the majority of the CC, with a few notable exceptions, will sleep for the entire slip just waking up now and again to eat the food they brought with them. Seems to me 24 hours sleep is more than enough rest to perform any subsequent duty in an exemplary manner.
Not sure what you mean by give it up - do they currently have the right to determine crewing patterns? If so my apologies they shouldn't give that up. Is that what you meant?
Regarding outport rest didn't you know the majority of the CC, with a few notable exceptions, will sleep for the entire slip just waking up now and again to eat the food they brought with them. Seems to me 24 hours sleep is more than enough rest to perform any subsequent duty in an exemplary manner.
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i call BS...
the crew don't sleep the whole time... you are ignorant to think that...
4 days here, 4 days there... next thing they are on AOA rosters..
good for them for defending their rights.....
"Regarding outport rest didn't you know the majority of the CC, with a few notable exceptions, will sleep for the entire slip just waking up now and again to eat the food they brought with them."
747-8.. you poor poor man... trouble relating to the crew... probably a Dumb Aussie ******, or European Trash hauler.... stupid fu$k.......
the crew don't sleep the whole time... you are ignorant to think that...
4 days here, 4 days there... next thing they are on AOA rosters..
good for them for defending their rights.....
"Regarding outport rest didn't you know the majority of the CC, with a few notable exceptions, will sleep for the entire slip just waking up now and again to eat the food they brought with them."
747-8.. you poor poor man... trouble relating to the crew... probably a Dumb Aussie ******, or European Trash hauler.... stupid fu$k.......