CoS08 improvement go through
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Funny to see RH has changed his tone over the weekend. That's if he actually wrote his latest update. Sounds like those who havent made a selection will be getting a phone call... WTF, dont cx get the hint....
Like ROOK stated; it will be interesting to see the stats by rank. I'm interested to see how many S.Os actually took Cos08.
Like ROOK stated; it will be interesting to see the stats by rank. I'm interested to see how many S.Os actually took Cos08.
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They would have had a riot on their hands if they hadn't passed the improvements. Good for those that already were on COS08 and those who were close to 55.
I doubt many SOs or 'young' FOs signed up, even though he says that by 2010 most of the pilots will be on 08...
I doubt many SOs or 'young' FOs signed up, even though he says that by 2010 most of the pilots will be on 08...
Join Date: Nov 1999
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Here are the numbers that are doing the rounds at the moment:
56% of all crew on COS08. Total crew is 2490, so 56% of that is 1395. Assuming that all Captains (937 of them) moved over, that leaves another 458. Of that number, apparently about 300 were already on COS08, so that means that only about 158 (of the available 1252) signed up.
As far as I can tell, that doesn't look like a great victory for CX...
56% of all crew on COS08. Total crew is 2490, so 56% of that is 1395. Assuming that all Captains (937 of them) moved over, that leaves another 458. Of that number, apparently about 300 were already on COS08, so that means that only about 158 (of the available 1252) signed up.
As far as I can tell, that doesn't look like a great victory for CX...
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End of freighter commands
Now there is an end to freighter commands and as depicted in the latest AoA update "That said, the end to freighter commands is an important achievement." And the fact that the majority ratified this in the AoA vote.
I assume that the freighter commands to commence this year will be canned?
I assume that the freighter commands to commence this year will be canned?
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If you read GMA's update 1 May 09 it states that all Freighter slots already allocated will be honoured as well as those that were successfully bid for in the 2007/8 NTC
; so although seniority will be used from 1 Jul 09, this will not apply for the next bunch of freighter commands. Good hey?
; so although seniority will be used from 1 Jul 09, this will not apply for the next bunch of freighter commands. Good hey?
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Yeah, and don't forget there is two freakin' years worth of freighter commands left!!
That is how many upgrades the company will go through on the freighter before they start upgrading guys who will get paid passenger pay.
So it is another "broken promise" in my book. Two Years? You know how much stuff can happen in two years? By then, the union will be laying down to COS11, which will transfer all the freighters to Air Hong Kong under the revised scope clause of COS08, so the freighters on B scale thing will then become obsolete.
Not a surprise coming from Cathay, but quite a shocker that our own union backed it.
That is how many upgrades the company will go through on the freighter before they start upgrading guys who will get paid passenger pay.
So it is another "broken promise" in my book. Two Years? You know how much stuff can happen in two years? By then, the union will be laying down to COS11, which will transfer all the freighters to Air Hong Kong under the revised scope clause of COS08, so the freighters on B scale thing will then become obsolete.
Not a surprise coming from Cathay, but quite a shocker that our own union backed it.
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Fire Wall
At the current rate of commands, that's probably about 2 years worth. Note no "tongue in cheek smiley".
It's unlikely there'll be any new pax commands in that time so we're looking at no "in seniority" commands for a long time.
At the current rate of commands, that's probably about 2 years worth. Note no "tongue in cheek smiley".
It's unlikely there'll be any new pax commands in that time so we're looking at no "in seniority" commands for a long time.
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Sqwak7700, why are you so worried about our Union lying down, bending over and all the other ways you have described it. Having read some of your past., you have stated many times that you were going to resign from the Union.
Now that the vote has gone through, I hope you act on your threats and leave. That way we don't have to hear how your Union failed your little world.
Maybe after all of this , you should go and join EK where you will have no Union to join, no fees to pay and no Union to bash.
Now that the vote has gone through, I hope you act on your threats and leave. That way we don't have to hear how your Union failed your little world.
Maybe after all of this , you should go and join EK where you will have no Union to join, no fees to pay and no Union to bash.
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I don't think we're going to get the company changing their mind on these out of seniority commands but how about getting the aoa to pursue a similar deal to what was done with asl; ie 3 pax cmds for every ftr cmd on the 400. That way we'd get both lists moving. Sure some freighter cmds will get deferred but at the moment so are many pax commands and these guys have been waiting 10 years. It seems in these economic times that the ftr guys are being protected but the pax guys are being left out to dry. we should all share the pain.
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before this economic slow-down and COS 08 my pax command should have come up at the end of this year. god knows when it is now. cant see one single reason why early freighter commands should take priority over pax commands other than it saves the company more money.
1 for 3, stuff that for a game of soldiers and thankfully the grumbles are being well voiced on the AOA site. we can live in hope.
1 for 3, stuff that for a game of soldiers and thankfully the grumbles are being well voiced on the AOA site. we can live in hope.
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Gee...... I can think of one. A notice to crew was issued with Freighter command positions available. Those interested submitted a bid, and the positions were awarded in seniority order. These are not "out of seniority" commands as you lot keep calling them.
Many of the successful applicants were put on hold while training courses were allocated to the DECs from Oasis, KA and god-knows-where else.
Now that there are training resouces available again, the company has chosen to honor the Freighter commands that were bid for and awarded by the original successful applicants. Simple really.
Your rants should be directed to the DEC fiasco, not the Freighter command issue.
Many of the successful applicants were put on hold while training courses were allocated to the DECs from Oasis, KA and god-knows-where else.
Now that there are training resouces available again, the company has chosen to honor the Freighter commands that were bid for and awarded by the original successful applicants. Simple really.
Your rants should be directed to the DEC fiasco, not the Freighter command issue.
Last edited by Penske; 21st May 2009 at 17:52.
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OK Penske
Imagine for a moment that a NTC went out advertising pax commands (of course this doesn't need a NTC because you're assumed to have applied when you joined the company, but bear with me). The successful applicants (Cat A F/Os) were then allocated command courses in seniority order.
There are training resources available but these courses have now been cancelled.
The -400 courses can be filled by either type of applicant. Both types of F/O applied and were allocated courses in seniority order.
Taking the freighter applicants first is slightly cheaper for the company, but is it still right?
Imagine for a moment that a NTC went out advertising pax commands (of course this doesn't need a NTC because you're assumed to have applied when you joined the company, but bear with me). The successful applicants (Cat A F/Os) were then allocated command courses in seniority order.
There are training resources available but these courses have now been cancelled.
The -400 courses can be filled by either type of applicant. Both types of F/O applied and were allocated courses in seniority order.
Taking the freighter applicants first is slightly cheaper for the company, but is it still right?
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I have not kept up with the course allocations for Pax commands. IF there have been courses cancelled as opposed to just delayed, there is definitely an issue that should be addressed.
If the company wants to honour their commitments, it is only fair that ALL previously awarded commands go ahead - especially in light of the fact that the playing field had changed significantly with DECs and now COS08 since those officers bid their positions.
If the company wants to honour their commitments, it is only fair that ALL previously awarded commands go ahead - especially in light of the fact that the playing field had changed significantly with DECs and now COS08 since those officers bid their positions.
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Penske, I agree that the guys bid for those freighter commands as per the ntc should eventually get them but by the same token 10 pax command courses were cancelled next month and a plethora of pcas' also cancelled. By suggesting alternating ftr/pax courses at least commands are moving for both albeit slowly.
Also I hope those guys taking the ftr cmds realise that they are going to be spending probably another 6 years on the ftr than they expected due to the slowdown in pax cmds. It's in everyone's interests to keep the pax seniority list moving.
1 Jul was the agreed date to move back to a seniority based airline but in practise this will take a few more years to achieve, i think
Also I hope those guys taking the ftr cmds realise that they are going to be spending probably another 6 years on the ftr than they expected due to the slowdown in pax cmds. It's in everyone's interests to keep the pax seniority list moving.
1 Jul was the agreed date to move back to a seniority based airline but in practise this will take a few more years to achieve, i think