What Are You Voting
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 249
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
I am completely perplexed as to why so many are even considering SLS. I don't care what your personal situation is, that's why we have annual leave. The situation now is completely different than what he had during SARS. Take SLS without any guarantees that it will all be paid back to you, and you are essentially sending the message "yes, I am overpaid". Talk about lowering the bar even further. This is nothing more than management wanting to exercise their control over you, power and greed at its finest!
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 249
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
Vtwin,
Well then so be it, if the situation is that dire make people redundant! The company would like you to believe that they are offering SLS to avoid redundancies, but that is complete B
S! We all joined the airlines knowing full well the advantages and disadvantages that seniority brings.
Well then so be it, if the situation is that dire make people redundant! The company would like you to believe that they are offering SLS to avoid redundancies, but that is complete B
S! We all joined the airlines knowing full well the advantages and disadvantages that seniority brings.
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Milky Way
Pat Obrien-
How do you know you will want to fly past 55 when you get there? That is a big price to pay just to have the choice. Furthermore, there is compound interest to consider with the money we would give up. 200k/yr from 55-65 only has a short time to earn on itself. An extra 100k at age 30 or 40 would have another 25 and 15 years respectively versus 10. Besides that, not all of us are trying to fund our retirements from our salary alone. Many have side businesses and could use CoS99 pay for capital.
How do you know you will want to fly past 55 when you get there? That is a big price to pay just to have the choice. Furthermore, there is compound interest to consider with the money we would give up. 200k/yr from 55-65 only has a short time to earn on itself. An extra 100k at age 30 or 40 would have another 25 and 15 years respectively versus 10. Besides that, not all of us are trying to fund our retirements from our salary alone. Many have side businesses and could use CoS99 pay for capital.
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
35yo F/O NO to Cos 08 and a maybe to SLS.
Anybody who tells me in 20 years I will have to retire at 55 is delusional. In that time frame if I hold a licence and a medical I will be alowed to fly...by LAW!!! COS 08 Has nothing for me except to give away any chance of bypass pay.
Thanks but no thanks....
Anybody who tells me in 20 years I will have to retire at 55 is delusional. In that time frame if I hold a licence and a medical I will be alowed to fly...by LAW!!! COS 08 Has nothing for me except to give away any chance of bypass pay.
Thanks but no thanks....
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 552
Likes: 22
From: Hong Kong
1500Smooth
Interesting post. I happen to agree with your points regarding age 55, anyone telling me that I need to retire when I turn 55 is delusional.
Isn't that what me and others have been saying for some time now? Only to be told by many of your colleagues to go to h*ll and leave at 55 so they can get promoted faster.
Although I'm not thrilled with the terms of going beyond 55, I now have the security of knowing the issue is settled and I can feed my family for several more years.
I'm 53, and a Captian. I will vote Yes and Yes.
Interesting post. I happen to agree with your points regarding age 55, anyone telling me that I need to retire when I turn 55 is delusional.
Isn't that what me and others have been saying for some time now? Only to be told by many of your colleagues to go to h*ll and leave at 55 so they can get promoted faster.
Although I'm not thrilled with the terms of going beyond 55, I now have the security of knowing the issue is settled and I can feed my family for several more years.
I'm 53, and a Captian. I will vote Yes and Yes.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
From: Jamaica
1500
OK, what happens between now and 20 years that makes RA55 unactionable by CX, by law? Maybe I'll change my mind......
Billy, no problem with guys saying no - but be careful with the compound interest element in the decision matrix. Looks good in the lab, but real life is a whole lot different, especially over 20 years - and those rate of returns may be better in the late years looking forward from today. If CX is just a way to earn some cash in the near future while your side business develops, yeah you'll probably be out way before 55 to make that career happen, so staying on CoS 99 makes sense.
OK, what happens between now and 20 years that makes RA55 unactionable by CX, by law? Maybe I'll change my mind......
Billy, no problem with guys saying no - but be careful with the compound interest element in the decision matrix. Looks good in the lab, but real life is a whole lot different, especially over 20 years - and those rate of returns may be better in the late years looking forward from today. If CX is just a way to earn some cash in the near future while your side business develops, yeah you'll probably be out way before 55 to make that career happen, so staying on CoS 99 makes sense.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 322
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
I now have the security of knowing the issue is settled and I can feed my family for several more years.
I will vote Yes and Yes.
You'll happily take SLS while having problems feeding your family......
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 174
Likes: 0
From: Lion rock bottom
In that time frame if I hold a licence and a medical I will be alowed to fly...by LAW!!!
Sysiphos:
Everybody doing what's in their best interest means CNs and SFOs going to COS08 and everybody else staying on COS99. This is actually detrimental to the company and beneficial to most of us.
There are many questions yet to be answered. The company wants us to make an irrational and uninformed decision. DO nothing until you are informed of the details pertaining to your case. Email the company to ask questions. They are receiving so many of them they can't answer them all. The FAQ they'll come up with will probably not cover everything that was asked.
I don't know about you guys, but I will not, I can not and I can't be expected to make a decision until all my questions have been answered...
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 552
Likes: 22
From: Hong Kong
Dragon69....
Gee...Oh gosh darn, did I let you down?
By the way where have you been? We've been having a civil dialogue while you were away? Have you been busy with your facebook or MSN? Was there a rap concert in town?
Learn any more swear words while you were away? I mean...like...any really cool ones?
Gee...Oh gosh darn, did I let you down?
By the way where have you been? We've been having a civil dialogue while you were away? Have you been busy with your facebook or MSN? Was there a rap concert in town?
Learn any more swear words while you were away? I mean...like...any really cool ones?
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
From: Pimper's paradise
FO, late 30ish, NAM, NO SLS because of the threatening tone taken in company comm. to us, NO Cos.08 unless they do something about the severe paycut I'd have to take for the next 10 years as an FO.
PatObrian, B!^#ch I told you to wait until the last day and told you why!!! Now stop this crazy talk already! You dig?!?
PatObrian, B!^#ch I told you to wait until the last day and told you why!!! Now stop this crazy talk already! You dig?!?
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 93
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
Raven?
Raven, it's your call as to whether or not you agree to SLS/CoS 08 or any other change to your contract.
However, I think I saw you coming out of CX Coffee and it looked like you were crying, were they crocodile tears or were you laughing so hard at what you had just posted you cried?
I showed your post to my F/A gf, she didn't cry, but she did wet herself at the bit about having to go from A to B and still afford to feed your staving family!
However, I think I saw you coming out of CX Coffee and it looked like you were crying, were they crocodile tears or were you laughing so hard at what you had just posted you cried?
I showed your post to my F/A gf, she didn't cry, but she did wet herself at the bit about having to go from A to B and still afford to feed your staving family!
Joined: Jul 1998
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
From: Between a rock
I am with Pat.
I think it is pragmatic, unless you are
Based in NA
<35 almost anywhere
<35 and an SO in HKG
But if you are 40 plus and based in HKG then it might be better to have the option of RA65 for planning purposes.
So I guess I am yes.
I think it is pragmatic, unless you are
Based in NA
<35 almost anywhere
<35 and an SO in HKG
But if you are 40 plus and based in HKG then it might be better to have the option of RA65 for planning purposes.
So I guess I am yes.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 322
Likes: 0
From: Hong Kong
Raven11
Many times in the past you have blamed the B scalers for joining on conditions lower than yours and hence being the root of the problem.
Good to see that after 20+ years of flying as an A scaler, you no longer have any real fiber to retire with some sense of dignity, and will happily accept a B- salary. What an honorable and commendable chap you are.
Now run along, the GMA is waiting for his toilet paper.
PS:
WHAT THE FU ARE YOU ON ABOUT?????
Many times in the past you have blamed the B scalers for joining on conditions lower than yours and hence being the root of the problem.
Good to see that after 20+ years of flying as an A scaler, you no longer have any real fiber to retire with some sense of dignity, and will happily accept a B- salary. What an honorable and commendable chap you are.
Now run along, the GMA is waiting for his toilet paper.
PS:
Have you been busy with your facebook or MSN? Was there a rap concert in town? Learn any more swear words while you were away? I mean...like...any really cool ones?
ARE YOU ON ABOUT?????
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 552
Likes: 22
From: Hong Kong
Dragon
If you actually read my posts instead of losing your temper and posting like a child (that, BTW, is what I was getting on about) you would have gleaned that I don't blame the B scalers (unless I'm responding to insults from said group...like the two posts on this page from you for example). In fact, I have consistently asked for unity...the kind of unity that posters like you unwittingly fracture!
Now I ask you Dragon69, are you happy with the lack of unity that people like you have perpetuated, and where it has brought us?
So, just to be clear, Dragon.....I blame you!
Now you run along and ponder that! And please stay away from any keyboard while you're pondering!
If you actually read my posts instead of losing your temper and posting like a child (that, BTW, is what I was getting on about) you would have gleaned that I don't blame the B scalers (unless I'm responding to insults from said group...like the two posts on this page from you for example). In fact, I have consistently asked for unity...the kind of unity that posters like you unwittingly fracture!
Now I ask you Dragon69, are you happy with the lack of unity that people like you have perpetuated, and where it has brought us?
So, just to be clear, Dragon.....I blame you!
Now you run along and ponder that! And please stay away from any keyboard while you're pondering!