Fully ready?????????
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 4,103
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From: Chabanais, France
I can well remember in the days of IT, (Inclusive Tour), being told at various European airports to call ten minutes prior to 'fully ready' and on making that call being told by ATC to call 'fully ready', this was usually to allow partisan controllers to fit their own airlines in ahead of you!
More recently in the long haul world I can recall getting ATC clearance on the delivery frequency and being told to contact Ground. On calling ground, e.g. "xyz123 with ATC, stand xx" and the response was always, "roger xyz123 call 'fully ready' ".
C'mon chaps, time to get out more!
More recently in the long haul world I can recall getting ATC clearance on the delivery frequency and being told to contact Ground. On calling ground, e.g. "xyz123 with ATC, stand xx" and the response was always, "roger xyz123 call 'fully ready' ".
C'mon chaps, time to get out more!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,122
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From: uk
Mr R Sole,
Thread creep,but the headings ending in zero I think started in LTCC,and was adopted nationally as ''Best practice''.It doesn't work so well with quadrantals which are numerous in Scotland.
Parabellum,
I certainly didn't give priority to CPA in HK,or BAW here.As far as not being ready when you say,then AFR regional take the biscuit here.You can clear them for push and start and nothing.Look through the bins and they are loading bag with a catering truck still attached.Then they turn the radio off.
At least when BAW say they are ready,then they are pushing very quickly.
Thread creep,but the headings ending in zero I think started in LTCC,and was adopted nationally as ''Best practice''.It doesn't work so well with quadrantals which are numerous in Scotland.
Parabellum,
I certainly didn't give priority to CPA in HK,or BAW here.As far as not being ready when you say,then AFR regional take the biscuit here.You can clear them for push and start and nothing.Look through the bins and they are loading bag with a catering truck still attached.Then they turn the radio off.
At least when BAW say they are ready,then they are pushing very quickly.
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 186
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From: orbital
FCUX. Are you sure? I'm with you on getting it right and keeping it simple. Maybe there are reasons for what happens elsewhere in the world. Like they are forced to operate ATC in the english language, which is not their local or normal language. Same for flight crew.
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,122
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From: uk
FCUX,
Well that's what we do.Not pushing within 2 minutes then you have to wait.As for the rest of the R/T which we have to provide,then I agree,most of it is s
t.You should see the runway incursion garbage that we have to say as well.Anyway getting off the point somewhat.
Hey what is it with American pilots.If they say ''Understand'' it's a guarantee that they didn't.
Anyway I'm sure the FAA has rules to the R/T that you use.If we don't use our standard R/T,and something happens,guess who's balls are hung out to dry.
Take it easy.
Well that's what we do.Not pushing within 2 minutes then you have to wait.As for the rest of the R/T which we have to provide,then I agree,most of it is s
t.You should see the runway incursion garbage that we have to say as well.Anyway getting off the point somewhat.Hey what is it with American pilots.If they say ''Understand'' it's a guarantee that they didn't.
Anyway I'm sure the FAA has rules to the R/T that you use.If we don't use our standard R/T,and something happens,guess who's balls are hung out to dry.
Take it easy.
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 335
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From: Asia
FCUX
The reason you are meant to add degrees is: in the event of poor reception, speaker turned tooo low, partially blocked transmissin, that you only hear the ....270. Then you happen to be climbing to 250 but your final is 290 so you set 270 read it back, busy controler hears what he expects and presto there you are. Unfourtunately some of these things were implimented for all the right reasons. Tenireef (man I bet I spelled that wrong) is an example, as are the numerous runway incursions of late.
Yes Chicago does get a little stroppy but not too bad. I was actually basaed there and as a foreign carrier you can tell they slow down when they talk to us which we appreciate !!! Some of what we have to say is in the manual so you have to blame those in management.
However cannot explaiin fully ready !
Yes Chicago does get a little stroppy but not too bad. I was actually basaed there and as a foreign carrier you can tell they slow down when they talk to us which we appreciate !!! Some of what we have to say is in the manual so you have to blame those in management.
However cannot explaiin fully ready !
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 73
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From: The Harbour
fully what
you guys are loosing the plot.... one word "fully" and all this chat about it. While i dont fully understand it all... I'd like to add in my worst word I hear in HK.....
"Stand-by".....
....
this fully makes me agro.... there are a few people on the ground in HK that only have one response to any call..... "stand-by"
wtf
would a mayday get the same response???? Probably....
Can you " Fully Stand-by"??????
"Stand-by".....
....
this fully makes me agro.... there are a few people on the ground in HK that only have one response to any call..... "stand-by"
wtf
would a mayday get the same response???? Probably....
Can you " Fully Stand-by"??????
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 56
Likes: 7
From: HK
[QUOTE=FCUX;2831530]
As for this "degrees" nonsense, it surely isnt used in the US, which by the way has the overwhelming majority of ALL aviation traffic. What pilot doesnt understand that "turn right heading 270" means turn right heading 270. Am i missing something here, is there another unit besides degrees that is used in aviation? Im sure if the Brits had it their way they would say "change your magnetic degree heading from your current, to new magnetic heading on your compass of 270 degrees magnetic heading". Ridiculous.
QUOTE]
Uhm, there are many units besides degrees used in aviation. Feet, metres, knots, gallons, litres, lb-ft, kilos, pax, tonnes, etc. Granted, not all used in ATC-cockpit R/T, but feet (flight levels) and degrees could be mixed up quite easily...
As for this "degrees" nonsense, it surely isnt used in the US, which by the way has the overwhelming majority of ALL aviation traffic. What pilot doesnt understand that "turn right heading 270" means turn right heading 270. Am i missing something here, is there another unit besides degrees that is used in aviation? Im sure if the Brits had it their way they would say "change your magnetic degree heading from your current, to new magnetic heading on your compass of 270 degrees magnetic heading". Ridiculous.
QUOTE]
Uhm, there are many units besides degrees used in aviation. Feet, metres, knots, gallons, litres, lb-ft, kilos, pax, tonnes, etc. Granted, not all used in ATC-cockpit R/T, but feet (flight levels) and degrees could be mixed up quite easily...
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 199
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From: No longer in Hong kong
HKG Phooey
Get your facts right mate. The only place you get consistent "standby's" is from CDC and the bulk of the time that is being done by non ATC's. CDC is a coordination nightmare, so it will happen. If you are told to standby by ground, there is a reason, either what you want is not immediately/readily available, or the poor bugger wants a second to gather their thoughts. I often ask pilots a question and am answered "standby"..I don't always expect an immediate answer. So please be reasonable with what you put here, and what you expect in the real world, or both.
Get your facts right mate. The only place you get consistent "standby's" is from CDC and the bulk of the time that is being done by non ATC's. CDC is a coordination nightmare, so it will happen. If you are told to standby by ground, there is a reason, either what you want is not immediately/readily available, or the poor bugger wants a second to gather their thoughts. I often ask pilots a question and am answered "standby"..I don't always expect an immediate answer. So please be reasonable with what you put here, and what you expect in the real world, or both.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 322
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From: Hong Kong
Exactly what part of aviation did the Americans invent?? The wing? Glider flight? The reciprocating engine? The jet engine? The radar? The radio? Taking inventions and putting it together doesn't constitute as an invention! Please don't be so arrogant!
Last edited by Dragon69; 8th September 2006 at 08:01.
Joined: Dec 2005
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From: Above the Gay Bar
FCUX meet Redflyin!!
Reading your post, I am reminded of a story a QFI mate of mine told. He was on exchange in the US at a military flying school, and was quite humbly trying to explain the concept of base speeds (TAS vs GS calculations) at different temperatures and altitudes on low level navigation sorties. The US instructors looked at him blankly, and one of them replied "We invented flyin' man - what would you know!"
I have worked with a lot of US pilots, and most have been good operators, but unfortunately, a large percentage of pilots from Commonwealth countries seem to have their own personal examples of US arrogance which tends to muddy their opinion of the US community.
As I say, it is unfortunate because in my experience, the US does have a lot of great pilots, and they do build the best aeroplanes in the world!
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 245
Likes: 60
From: illabo
Hey HK Phooey,
If a long discussion about "fully" winds you up a bit - I'll tell you what winds me up a bit - the amount of guys on PPRUNE (yourself included) who do not know the difference between loose and lose.
Loose - not tight
Lose - to misplace, to not win
Call me a spelling nazi if you wish but I am truly dumbfounded by the amount of times so called intelligent aviators make this mistake.
So what did you mean when you say we are loosing the plot? did you mean we are making the plot less tight, or did you actually mean we are losing the plot.
Rod (English teacher)
If a long discussion about "fully" winds you up a bit - I'll tell you what winds me up a bit - the amount of guys on PPRUNE (yourself included) who do not know the difference between loose and lose.
Loose - not tight
Lose - to misplace, to not win
Call me a spelling nazi if you wish but I am truly dumbfounded by the amount of times so called intelligent aviators make this mistake.
So what did you mean when you say we are loosing the plot? did you mean we are making the plot less tight, or did you actually mean we are losing the plot.
Rod (English teacher)
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 740
Likes: 0
From: Over There
Hey HK Phooey,
If a long discussion about "fully" winds you up a bit - I'll tell you what winds me up a bit - the amount of guys on PPRUNE (yourself included) who do not know the difference between loose and lose.
Loose - not tight
Lose - to misplace, to not win
Call me a spelling nazi if you wish but I am truly dumbfounded by the amount of times so called intelligent aviators make this mistake.
So what did you mean when you say we are loosing the plot? did you mean we are making the plot less tight, or did you actually mean we are losing the plot.
Rod (English teacher)
If a long discussion about "fully" winds you up a bit - I'll tell you what winds me up a bit - the amount of guys on PPRUNE (yourself included) who do not know the difference between loose and lose.
Loose - not tight
Lose - to misplace, to not win
Call me a spelling nazi if you wish but I am truly dumbfounded by the amount of times so called intelligent aviators make this mistake.
So what did you mean when you say we are loosing the plot? did you mean we are making the plot less tight, or did you actually mean we are losing the plot.
Rod (English teacher)
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 46
Likes: 3
From: Fliegensville, Gold Coast Australia
Fully ignorant, fully arrogant, fully fully
What has this thread not got eh? Fully feckin everything!
"If I could lose a few kilos then this shirt may be a little more loose than it is now"
Fully correct
Fully fun
Fulla ya selves!!
What has this thread not got eh? Fully feckin everything!
"If I could lose a few kilos then this shirt may be a little more loose than it is now"
Fully correct
Fully fun
Fulla ya selves!!
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 21
Likes: 0
From: Macau
Time limit
Dyce,
I would like to see the idea of a 2 minute time limit on the push backs in Hong Kong. At least half the airplanes would fail and have to wait for their turn again. Can't really see our management standing up to the airlines, though!
I would like to see the idea of a 2 minute time limit on the push backs in Hong Kong. At least half the airplanes would fail and have to wait for their turn again. Can't really see our management standing up to the airlines, though!
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 199
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From: No longer in Hong kong
Hey Hkg Phooey, now is your big chance mate. Beta Light posted a complimentary comment on page 3 of the Hkg Atc thread early today. Maybe you could ask him (or her) if their Emergency call was answered with a "standby". I wasn't there, and maybe I am wrong, but it would seem not!
Whatever......
Whatever......
