ICAO English language proficiency

[zondaracer]

FAR 61.103 clearly states:
quote:
(c) Be able to read, speak, write, and understand the English language.

I don´t ever recall being tested on my ability to write for the purposes of proving my proficiency when I acquired my FAA certificates. Perhaps the examiner looked in my logbook and saw that I wrote all my entries in English. Or maybe the FAA assumes that since I passed my written exams which were in English, that I can read English. Therefore, I must be able to write in English.

An a slightly different note, even though the CAA will issue an ICAO level 6 when passing a flight test, would it be a good idea to also get an ICAO Level 6 certificate? I ask, because I heard a rumor that some airlines may actually ask for an ICAO English certificate. Thanks in advance for any replies.

[Whopity]

Thirdly, they have no clear guidelines as to what to do or where to turn when the candidate is obviously not Level 6.

Yes they do Page 19; you tick the NO box and they have to go to a professional assessor!

[SandroUK]

I am Italian and I have been living in England for 2 years... I am doing my NPPL licence without any problem up to know and my instructor never asked me a certificate to prove my spoken English...

[billyh42]

I have just had written notification from the CAA that when my JAR/JAA PPL (A) expires at the end of March then when I convert it to the EASA equivalent I must pay an extra £22 to "prove" I can speak English - even although I have pointed out I was born here, English is the only language I can speak and that my current licence states I am English proficient.

Still, it's not as bad as them also stating that to keep my FAA PPL valid then I must also "attend personally" at Gatwick to "prove" my identity and also pay another £45. Not really very handy for people living in Glasgow?

[Whopity]

I must pay an extra £22 to "prove" I can speak English

So long as you do this at the same time as you convert your licence there is no additional charge. Just include SRG1199 signed by an examiner. Your FAA PPL has nothing to do with the CAA! As you hold a JAA PPL all you need to do is complete SRG1104, follow the instructions and pay them £73 for a lifetime PPL. There is another option to also retain a UK National licence, that will cost an additional £35. Checkout the Scheme of ChargesPara 3.2 Table 2 and Para 3.3

[MrAverage]

If billyh42 has a piggyback FAA (I understand his post suggests not) is there not a requirement for I.D. check because of the slight change in his EASA licence number?

[nick14]

If the licence number changes then a new FAA certificate must be obtained as the privileges are limited to a valid licence (number written on the back) being maintained.

I had the same issue this year with a new licence number i had to go through the verification process again.

[Whopity]

Perhaps a good reason to pay the £35 and retain a UK National Licence as well. In any event the number remains the same.

[billyh42]

If billyh42 has a piggyback FAA (I understand his post suggests not) is there not a requirement for I.D. check because of the slight change in his EASA licence number?

My FAA PPL is "piggybacked" on the JAA PPL. Initially when the EASA changes were announced, the FAA said that their "piggybacked" certificates would remain valid as long as the holder had an "equivalent" EASA licence.

However, they announced just last month that holders of any "piggybacked" licences would have to attend personally at Gatwick and renew if converting a licence to EASA. The point of my complaint being that I already have to provide a passport etc to the CAA at Gatwick to "verify" my identity for the EASA conversion, so common sense (not the CAA's strongpoint I know) would suggest that this should suffice as ID to allow everything to be done at the same time.

The deadline for renewal is however October 2018, but as usual it's still a bit ambiguous as to whether the current FAA licence remains valid?

[Whopity]

However, they announced just last month that holders of any "piggybacked" licences would have to attend personally at Gatwick and renew if converting a licence to EASA.

Who exactly are "They"? "Renew what"? You cannot renew a FAA piggy back licence at Gatwick, so your claim makes no sense at all!

[billyh42]

Who exactly are "They"? "Renew what"? You cannot renew a FAA piggy back licence at Gatwick, so your claim makes no sense at all

"They" are the FAA - they announced last month that anyone holding a UK National or EASA licence would have to have their "piggybacked" FAA certificates reissued and that it would be facilitated by the CAA at Gatwick.

I was notified of this, in writing, by the CAA as I was already involved in extensive correspondence regarding EASA conversion and had also asked about the FAA certificates.

Part of the FAA announcement reads:-

"Following harmonisation of European pilot licences, pilots holding UK National or EASA licences living outside the USA who also hold a US Federal Administration Certificate allowing them to fly in the United States must have it reissued with the UK CAA to retain its validity. This is an FAA requirement, following the format changes to European licences, and avoids the need for pilots to travel to the US...................Personal identity must be verified in person. Pilots having completed form SRG 2110, must visit the CAA Public Counter Service at Aviation House, South Area Gatwick Airport................"

The full announcement also appeared in Pilot Magazine, March 2014, page 10 - in which the lower third of the page explains this.

[Whopity]

would have to have their "piggybacked" FAA certificates reissued and that it would be facilitated by the CAA at Gatwick.

This is the purpose of SRG 2110 which facilitates the reissue by the FAA.

"Following harmonisation of European pilot licences, pilots holding UK National or EASA licences living outside the USA who also hold a US Federal Administration Certificate allowing them to fly in the United States must have it reissued with the UK CAA to retain its validity.

I think this sentance is missing a comma, (it) refers to the UK National licence. I don't see any process by which the CAA could, or would have the slightest interest in issuing an FAA Certificate. The CAA don't work for nothing annd I don't see the FAA paying them for the privilege. I can find nothing on either the CAA or FAA websites about any such process.

[BEagle]

FAA reissuance

See Verify a Renumbered Pilot licence | Our Role | About the CAA, which explains matters.

[billyh42]

"Following harmonisation of European pilot licences, pilots holding UK National or EASA licences living outside the USA who also hold a US Federal Administration Certificate allowing them to fly in the United States must have it reissued with the UK CAA to retain its validity.

I think this sentance is missing a comma, (it) refers to the UK National licence.

No commas missing - it clearly says UK National or EASA licences!

I don't see any process by which the CAA could, or would have the slightest interest in issuing an FAA Certificate. The CAA don't work for nothing annd I don't see the FAA paying them for the privilege. I can find nothing on either the CAA or FAA websites about any such process.

As per the first quote from the FAA announcement, "must have it reissued with the UK CAA" seems to suggest otherwise!

The section I quoted from the FAA announcement was just that - a section. The full announcement appeared in Pilot Magazine, Feb 2014, Page 10 as well as eleswhere in the UK aviation media.

However, here's yet another snippet, this time from the CAA themselves:-

"Recognising the difficulties that this will present to European pilots, the FAA’s Flight Standards Service has decided to grant a deviation from its standard reissuance practice. This allows the pilot to attend the UK CAA in person with the required documentation and fee. The UK CAA will then verify your information to the FAA, who will then issue a new FAA pilot certificates (validation)"

[Whopity]

As per Beagle's post the FAA reissue the certificate. Cheaper to go to Gatwick to be ID'd than a FISDO in the US. The cost for the SRG2110 would be the same either way.

[Capt Chambo]

I'm at my wit's end.

I need to convert my JAA ATPL (UK issuing authority) to an EASA ATPL. My application has been returned as I do not have ELP 6. I no longer use my JAA licence but want to keep it "dormant".

Does anyone know of an authorised examiner in Australia who is acceptable to the UK's CAA who could do the necessary test for me. (The CAAs website only shows one authorised examiner in Australia, and they are no longer available)

PM's would be fine.

Thanks in advance.

[3 Point]

I'm no longer qualified to carry out the English Language proficiency assessment but I was. There is no requirement I know of for us to meet face to face to carry out this assessment. I simply have to verify that you can communicate effectively in an aviation environment using the English language. I don't see why that can't be done by phone or, even better, Skype video call!

I have previously done them via a phone call with crewmembers who are not based at the company's main operating base. Any EASA licenced flight examiner (ie not a ground examiner) who holds English Level 6 himself, can assess you as level 6.

Something to think about?!?

[Emorik]

Good Afternoon,
I hope someone can answer me quickly:
tomorrow i will renew my english proficiency
I have EASA licence under UK CAA
I live in italy and i will do the test here in a school associated with Mayflower college.

I've read on UK CAA website that i will need to provide them the form SRG1199 after the test
http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/SRG1199FFenabled.pdf
My examiner doesn't know anything about this. He told me that he will send everything to the college and they will send me back a certificate.

MY BIG problem is that today in england is bankholyday or something similar and CAA doesn't answer to the phone -.-

Does someone know if the certificate is enought or my examiner must fill this form (with some identification number that i'm not sure he has)?

Thank You

[ifitaintboeing]

There is no requirement I know of for us to meet face to face to carry out this assessment. I simply have to verify that you can communicate effectively in an aviation environment using the English language. I don't see why that can't be done by phone or, even better, Skype video call!

CAA Standards Document 51:

One such acceptable means, for ‘expert speakers’ Level 6 only, is for the holder of a CAA issued examiner certificate (as listed in (a) and (b) above) to conduct a language assessment as a face to face aviation-related conversation that is not associated with a Skill Test, Proficiency Check, Assessment of Competence or Flight Radio Telephony practical test.

ifitaint...

[Level Attitude]

I live in italy and i will do the test here in a school associated with Mayflower college.

Emorik,
According to SRG1199, which you refer to, a UK Licence Holder can only be tested for Aviation English Proficiency by a language school provided that the school is either approved by the CAA or accredited by the British Council.

Although on their website, Mayflower (Plymouth Southern England) say they can conduct Aviation English tests they do not claim to be approved by the CAA, but they do seem to be accredited by the British Council.

However you are being tested by a local Italian school "in association' with Mayflower College. Additionally you say "My examiner doesn't know anything about this" - which implies it is a very loose association with Mayflower.

The day before a test does seem an odd time for you to try and confirm that the school you are using is acceptable to the CAA.

I would suggest you go ahead with the test and hope that Mayflower send you back a properly completed SRG1199.

If not you need to ask for your money back from the local school (I assume you specifically told them you wanted to be tested for Aviation English for a UK issued Licence?)