CABAIR : Sponsored FI course
Join Date: Aug 2007
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T21
ok, , fair do's gov, quite
now. 2500 hours as an instructor, should of checked your profile.
Apololgies aside now, the bottom line is that whether or not cabairs people skills are good or bad, the opportunity as an instructor there is quite good.
1000 in the bank for your first 20 hours, then £25 per hour hour after.
So if you did 50 hours a month (very realistic), by my reckoning is about £1500 in the bank at the end of the month. Then any groundschool in the evenings and ferry flights on days off?
Sorry if i pissed you off, but if i knew i could get that kind of loot as a ppl instructor id be doing whatever it took to work for them.
ok, , fair do's gov, quite
now. 2500 hours as an instructor, should of checked your profile. Apololgies aside now, the bottom line is that whether or not cabairs people skills are good or bad, the opportunity as an instructor there is quite good.
1000 in the bank for your first 20 hours, then £25 per hour hour after.
So if you did 50 hours a month (very realistic), by my reckoning is about £1500 in the bank at the end of the month. Then any groundschool in the evenings and ferry flights on days off?
Sorry if i pissed you off, but if i knew i could get that kind of loot as a ppl instructor id be doing whatever it took to work for them.
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Mr Flybe,
Thanks for your apology, I am staying in IT support as i am frustrated with the way flying instructors are looked after(crap) in terms of salary and respect. It is a very responsible teaching and supervisory job and should be rewarded accordingly. I doubt if it will ever change but as to basic manners in the industry some of these outfits need mystery shopper visits. I do wish you well with any airline position, i am taking a sabbatical from it and although i miss the flying i don't miss all the currency checks and weather hassles is it flyable yes/no !
Thanks for your apology, I am staying in IT support as i am frustrated with the way flying instructors are looked after(crap) in terms of salary and respect. It is a very responsible teaching and supervisory job and should be rewarded accordingly. I doubt if it will ever change but as to basic manners in the industry some of these outfits need mystery shopper visits. I do wish you well with any airline position, i am taking a sabbatical from it and although i miss the flying i don't miss all the currency checks and weather hassles is it flyable yes/no !
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Flybe,
Am I thinking if I did my PPL/Night/MEP/Hour Building ASAP and got my ATPL exams out of the way I'd stand any chance of getting on this sponsorship?
As you said, financially £1,500+ a month isn't bad to live off and totting up the hours with a highly respected FTO.
I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by getting as far as my ATPL exams then running out of cash to do my CPL/IR/FI/MCC
I'll quite happily hunt Cabair for this sponsorship next year but I need to know if there is any chance of it going ahead too.
Feel free to PM me any details.
Thanks
Andrew
Am I thinking if I did my PPL/Night/MEP/Hour Building ASAP and got my ATPL exams out of the way I'd stand any chance of getting on this sponsorship?
As you said, financially £1,500+ a month isn't bad to live off and totting up the hours with a highly respected FTO.
I don't want to shoot myself in the foot by getting as far as my ATPL exams then running out of cash to do my CPL/IR/FI/MCC
I'll quite happily hunt Cabair for this sponsorship next year but I need to know if there is any chance of it going ahead too.
Feel free to PM me any details.
Thanks
Andrew
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Maybe I'm just being naive, by why not call them rather than speculate? Being caustic about the company is not really going to endear you to them and I understand that existing FIs are being interviewed with everyone else likely to follow in the next couple of weeks.
Join Date: Nov 2005
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Hmm,
Well I think an update is due on this elusive scheme. Having just looked at the Cabair site an clicked on the Instructor Sponsorship scheme a dialogue box appears saying the course is over subscribed!!! Well Seeing as nobody has heard a sniff, who have they recruited???????????
This gets more interesting.............. And so, the mystery still contunues.......... Until next time
Well I think an update is due on this elusive scheme. Having just looked at the Cabair site an clicked on the Instructor Sponsorship scheme a dialogue box appears saying the course is over subscribed!!! Well Seeing as nobody has heard a sniff, who have they recruited???????????
This gets more interesting.............. And so, the mystery still contunues.......... Until next time
Join Date: Jul 2007
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cabin fever!
Just a thought guys:-cabair are currently in the process of moving their offices into new buildings at cranfield. they are currently operating in portacabins so you could imagine the turmoil of moving premises whilst 'maintaining' flight operations. do not be 'put off' by the lack of responses from cabair, although T-21 is correct that they should have the common courtesy to respond to our correspondance, you have got to chase after these schemes otherwise you are not going to get a sniff of an interview.
Join Date: Jan 2008
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My first post on pprune.... here goes:
I Have frozen ATPL's which I acquired in September 2007...So I started job hunting like made and like most, found it harder than I had anticipated! Airline jobs that were available seemed to be ones where you fund your own type... I'm a young guy with many many years (hopefully) ahead of me to walk through the cockpit door of an airbus so my goel posts changed and I found myself looking down the instructor road, and looking at the Cabair FI sponsorship. Cut the story short: I was invited for an interview early Oct 2007 at Elstree. I was told there and then that I will be accepted for the FI sponsorship - £1000 net p.m, £25 p.h after first 20hours of the month, £10 for ferry flights and upto £13 p.h for ground school. Now to get to this point I did personally hand in my CV at cranfield, and keep chasing them up untill I got the interview.
My start date is meant to be the end of January - this month at Cranfield. I am also yet to receive any form of contract or written letter to say I have been successful.
I have since my interview in October chased cabair up every two weeks via phone and visiting them personally... each time I was assure that the contract will be done at the end of the week, and the delay was due to internal confusion about who was responsible, and I was told not to worry as I have been successful.
Yesterday I called around the company to chase up the progress of my contract, and to find exact details for the start of the FI course - location, time and what would be required of me. To my surprise I found that cabair cranfield knew nothing of an FI course for the end of January, so I went back to the gentleman who conducted my interview. To my surprise I was told that the contract has now changed, and that the package was the following:
Net £1000 p.m
NO £25p.m after the first 20 hours
NO £10 p.h for ferry flight
NO extra pay for ground school
Free revalidation of my ME/IR
Free Glass cockpit conversion.
Commitments - 2 Years/1500 hours.
This as you can understand is substantially different pay without any incentive for flying over 20 hours a month..... why wasn't I told this over 3 months ago?? I happen to live on my own and I am now faced with the dilema of how do I live on £1000 p.m for the next two years? after spending over £40k to get to this possition of frozen ATPL's....
Has anyone else reading this found themselves in the same position as me with the cabair FI sponsorship?
I Have frozen ATPL's which I acquired in September 2007...So I started job hunting like made and like most, found it harder than I had anticipated! Airline jobs that were available seemed to be ones where you fund your own type... I'm a young guy with many many years (hopefully) ahead of me to walk through the cockpit door of an airbus so my goel posts changed and I found myself looking down the instructor road, and looking at the Cabair FI sponsorship. Cut the story short: I was invited for an interview early Oct 2007 at Elstree. I was told there and then that I will be accepted for the FI sponsorship - £1000 net p.m, £25 p.h after first 20hours of the month, £10 for ferry flights and upto £13 p.h for ground school. Now to get to this point I did personally hand in my CV at cranfield, and keep chasing them up untill I got the interview.
My start date is meant to be the end of January - this month at Cranfield. I am also yet to receive any form of contract or written letter to say I have been successful.
I have since my interview in October chased cabair up every two weeks via phone and visiting them personally... each time I was assure that the contract will be done at the end of the week, and the delay was due to internal confusion about who was responsible, and I was told not to worry as I have been successful.
Yesterday I called around the company to chase up the progress of my contract, and to find exact details for the start of the FI course - location, time and what would be required of me. To my surprise I found that cabair cranfield knew nothing of an FI course for the end of January, so I went back to the gentleman who conducted my interview. To my surprise I was told that the contract has now changed, and that the package was the following:
Net £1000 p.m
NO £25p.m after the first 20 hours
NO £10 p.h for ferry flight
NO extra pay for ground school
Free revalidation of my ME/IR
Free Glass cockpit conversion.
Commitments - 2 Years/1500 hours.
This as you can understand is substantially different pay without any incentive for flying over 20 hours a month..... why wasn't I told this over 3 months ago?? I happen to live on my own and I am now faced with the dilema of how do I live on £1000 p.m for the next two years? after spending over £40k to get to this possition of frozen ATPL's....
Has anyone else reading this found themselves in the same position as me with the cabair FI sponsorship?
Join Date: Feb 2000
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Depending on how you want to push it, if you we're verbally offered the better contract at interview, it should be what they are obliged to offer.
Note: this is not legal advice!! best speak to a lawyer.
Note: this is not legal advice!! best speak to a lawyer.
Dancing with the devil, going with the flow... it's all a game to me.
Join Date: May 2000
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Another lovely Cabair cock-up by the sounds of things.
I would spin on your heel if I were you jakjakajk and think yourself very lucky you saw what they are like before becoming employed by them. If your contract has not arrived yet then you will not have signed anything WILL YOU? If so, you are not duty bound to go through with anything at this stage.
Do yourself a favour and look at other options that do not include Cabair and count the wasted time since October as a lesson learnt. The GA instructing game is the same as any working environment and you need to push for the best deal FOR YOU, just as you would in any other field.
Do not be fooled by the "congratulations, you have been successful!" tactic many use when they're plainly desperate for instructors (read: mugs).
VFE.
I would spin on your heel if I were you jakjakajk and think yourself very lucky you saw what they are like before becoming employed by them. If your contract has not arrived yet then you will not have signed anything WILL YOU? If so, you are not duty bound to go through with anything at this stage.
Do yourself a favour and look at other options that do not include Cabair and count the wasted time since October as a lesson learnt. The GA instructing game is the same as any working environment and you need to push for the best deal FOR YOU, just as you would in any other field.
Do not be fooled by the "congratulations, you have been successful!" tactic many use when they're plainly desperate for instructors (read: mugs).
VFE.
Last edited by VFE; 16th Jan 2008 at 18:24.
Join Date: Sep 2004
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As above, I'd find out the details regarding this '20 hours per month' thing. It would be a monumental loophole but if there's nothing that says you must fly more than 20 hours per month as your salary is based on those hours alone, you could refuse to work any more.
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flying is a complete con! Im bowing out and going to get a proper job,with proper prospects,and a decent contract,with a decent wage and job security!
I will instruct part time at weekends and as I see fit on my terms!
I will instruct part time at weekends and as I see fit on my terms!
Dancing with the devil, going with the flow... it's all a game to me.
Join Date: May 2000
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Cabair forbid their instructors to instruct elsewhere whilst under their employment. You WILL be expected to do more than 20 hours per month!
Look, would you trust an employer who is not even available for you to talk with? Read jakjakjak's post again and you will see the lengths the poor guy has been to in order to check about his employment status AFTER being offered employment!
My word, how many warnings do you need in order to smell that something is not right? If you cannot detect something drastically afoot with this arrangement, especially after the terms have been altered WITHOUT even consulting the person who has been offered employment, then I question your sanity to walk the streets, nevermind fly an aeroplane!
I would run now, before you get yourself into an almighty mess. No axe to grind, couldn't care less for the firm (I think this shows) but simply would hate to see someone get themselves into a bad situation.
There is an instructor shortage, if you cannot afford the FIC then seek a lender AWAY from aviation. It does not ring true that you have no way of obtaining money after forking out £40K. If you did not plan for either a type rating or FIC following training then you really did not do sufficient research into the game before you got the bread together to get where you are now.
VFE.
Look, would you trust an employer who is not even available for you to talk with? Read jakjakjak's post again and you will see the lengths the poor guy has been to in order to check about his employment status AFTER being offered employment!
My word, how many warnings do you need in order to smell that something is not right? If you cannot detect something drastically afoot with this arrangement, especially after the terms have been altered WITHOUT even consulting the person who has been offered employment, then I question your sanity to walk the streets, nevermind fly an aeroplane!
I would run now, before you get yourself into an almighty mess. No axe to grind, couldn't care less for the firm (I think this shows) but simply would hate to see someone get themselves into a bad situation.
There is an instructor shortage, if you cannot afford the FIC then seek a lender AWAY from aviation. It does not ring true that you have no way of obtaining money after forking out £40K. If you did not plan for either a type rating or FIC following training then you really did not do sufficient research into the game before you got the bread together to get where you are now.
VFE.
Join Date: Apr 2004
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It's a standard contract of employment, and you'll be at the airfield (irrespective of weather) from 8am to sunset, 5 days a week to include Saturday and Sunday. So even if it wasn't forbidden in the contract, you'd probably struggle to find time to instruct elsewhere. The £1,000 pcm is a salary of c. £15k, thereby being around the minimum wage (this covers their @rse for demanding you be on site 8am-SS). I believe self-sponsored guys get the £25 for >20 hours, etc., but Cabair sponsored guys don't.
I think I'm correct in saying they're the only outfit to offer sponsorship; I think they deserve some credit for getting people into paid flying jobs that might previously have not been, even if they do drape you over a barrel... Unless you've got a wife and kids, Cabair's inferior offer has got to be better than nothing, and another 2 years in a job you gave up because you wanted to fly.
I think I'm correct in saying they're the only outfit to offer sponsorship; I think they deserve some credit for getting people into paid flying jobs that might previously have not been, even if they do drape you over a barrel... Unless you've got a wife and kids, Cabair's inferior offer has got to be better than nothing, and another 2 years in a job you gave up because you wanted to fly.