Taking your FAA logbook to the JAA...
Thread Starter
Taking your FAA logbook to the JAA...
Quick question: (and its on this forum because a lot of people go to the states to instruct,then return with a logbook full of hours)
I understand that there are some subtle differences between logging of time - i believe that in the UK you are supposed to log individual flight times with start and stop times, whereas over here I just add up the number of hours flown that day and make one entry.
Has anyone ever had any problems with this when returning to start JAA?
Also, any problems regarding PIC time?
I understand that there are some subtle differences between logging of time - i believe that in the UK you are supposed to log individual flight times with start and stop times, whereas over here I just add up the number of hours flown that day and make one entry.
Has anyone ever had any problems with this when returning to start JAA?
Also, any problems regarding PIC time?
In the UK you are required to record your hours for validation purposes. Most pilots take some pride in their hours as it is a historical record of what they have done, aircraft they have flown, where they have been and who they have flown with.
If you can't be bothered to record your hours in a way that gives you an accurate record of what you have done, why should anyone else care what you have done. No doubt your log will be of interest to a prospective employer as it will give an insight to your professionalism!
If you can't be bothered to record your hours in a way that gives you an accurate record of what you have done, why should anyone else care what you have done. No doubt your log will be of interest to a prospective employer as it will give an insight to your professionalism!
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Well, I always log and logged every flight. Over here in the UK and in the US.
As the previous poster already said, why would anyone bother with you 'logged' hours if they're not even logged right.
By the way unless you already have al the ratings you'll ever need, FAR §61.51 still applies. (So also for meeting your currency requirements)
But to answer your initial question. The CAA will NOT accept your hours that way. And if you present it like that once, you probably don't get a second chance as well.
As the previous poster already said, why would anyone bother with you 'logged' hours if they're not even logged right.
By the way unless you already have al the ratings you'll ever need, FAR §61.51 still applies. (So also for meeting your currency requirements)
But to answer your initial question. The CAA will NOT accept your hours that way. And if you present it like that once, you probably don't get a second chance as well.
Thread Starter
Thankyou.
By the way, a typical logbook entry would read:
DATE : TYPE : REGISTRATION : FROM : TO : FLIGHT TIME : PIC : (XC) : (NIGHT) : (SOLO) : (DUAL) : COMMENTS
I take pride in my hours also, but not to the point of using calligraphy. I log what FAR 61.51 says.
The FAA require only the date and length of flight, but not Start and End.
I guess i'll have to buy a new logbook with columns for Start and End!
By the way, a typical logbook entry would read:
DATE : TYPE : REGISTRATION : FROM : TO : FLIGHT TIME : PIC : (XC) : (NIGHT) : (SOLO) : (DUAL) : COMMENTS
I take pride in my hours also, but not to the point of using calligraphy. I log what FAR 61.51 says.
The FAA require only the date and length of flight, but not Start and End.
I guess i'll have to buy a new logbook with columns for Start and End!
Last edited by rudestuff; 15th Aug 2006 at 20:47.
The UK requires the following:
You will see that it does not require Start or End times either!
I don't quite see how you log individual flight details! when you said
35 (1) Every member of the flight crew of an aircraft registered in the United Kingdom and every person who engages in flying for the purpose of qualifying for the grant or renewal of a licence under this Order shall keep a personal flying log book in which the following particulars shall be recorded:
(a) the name and address of the holder of the log book;
(b) particulars of the holder’s licence (if any) to act as a member of the flight crew of an aircraft; and
(c) the name and address of his employer (if any).
(2) Particulars of each flight during which the holder of the log book acted either as a member of the flight crew of an aircraft or for the purpose of qualifying for the grant or renewal of a licence under this Order, as the case may be, shall be recorded in the log book at the end of each flight or as soon thereafter as is reasonably practicable, including:
(a) the date, the places at which the holder embarked on and disembarked from the aircraft and the time spent during the course of a flight when he was acting in either capacity;
(b) the type and registration marks of the aircraft;
(c) the capacity in which the holder acted in flight;
(d) particulars of any special conditions under which the flight was conducted, including night flying and instrument flying; and
(e) particulars of any test or examination undertaken whilst in flight.
(3) For the purposes of this article, a helicopter shall be deemed to be in flight from the moment the helicopter first moves under its own power for the purpose of taking off until the rotors are next stopped.
(4) Particulars of any test or examination undertaken whilst in a flight simulator shall be recorded in the log book, including:
(a) the date of the test or examination;
(b) the type of simulator;
(c) the capacity in which the holder acted; and
(d) the nature of the test or examination.
(a) the name and address of the holder of the log book;
(b) particulars of the holder’s licence (if any) to act as a member of the flight crew of an aircraft; and
(c) the name and address of his employer (if any).
(2) Particulars of each flight during which the holder of the log book acted either as a member of the flight crew of an aircraft or for the purpose of qualifying for the grant or renewal of a licence under this Order, as the case may be, shall be recorded in the log book at the end of each flight or as soon thereafter as is reasonably practicable, including:
(a) the date, the places at which the holder embarked on and disembarked from the aircraft and the time spent during the course of a flight when he was acting in either capacity;
(b) the type and registration marks of the aircraft;
(c) the capacity in which the holder acted in flight;
(d) particulars of any special conditions under which the flight was conducted, including night flying and instrument flying; and
(e) particulars of any test or examination undertaken whilst in flight.
(3) For the purposes of this article, a helicopter shall be deemed to be in flight from the moment the helicopter first moves under its own power for the purpose of taking off until the rotors are next stopped.
(4) Particulars of any test or examination undertaken whilst in a flight simulator shall be recorded in the log book, including:
(a) the date of the test or examination;
(b) the type of simulator;
(c) the capacity in which the holder acted; and
(d) the nature of the test or examination.
I don't quite see how you log individual flight details! when you said
I just add up the number of hours flown that day and make one entry.
Last edited by Whopity; 16th Aug 2006 at 16:44.
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Rudestuff
From my experience it does not matter if you haven't logged start and finish times. As long as you have the other details for each flight your log book is acceptable to the CAA
If they want to they can find start and finish times by contacting the airfield but they are very unlikely to do that
From my experience it does not matter if you haven't logged start and finish times. As long as you have the other details for each flight your log book is acceptable to the CAA
If they want to they can find start and finish times by contacting the airfield but they are very unlikely to do that
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FAA and JAA Logbooks!
Most people I know who fly in the US with an aim to return to Europe to fly under JAR Rules keep 2 log books - one to meet the FAA Rules and therefore recording PIC time even if you are not in command (all after FAA Pvt) - and another to record all the details (including times) required in accordance with the ANO and JAR FCL - plus the different definition of XC! 
Don't be so hard on the guy. . What about this bit from LASORS:
Sec A, App B, 1, f
If the holder of a licence carries out a number
of flights upon the same day returning on each
occasion to the same place of departure and
the interval between successive flights does
not exceed thirty minutes, such series of
flights may recorded as a single entry.
Sec A, App B, 1, f
If the holder of a licence carries out a number
of flights upon the same day returning on each
occasion to the same place of departure and
the interval between successive flights does
not exceed thirty minutes, such series of
flights may recorded as a single entry.
