Flight planning for a long haul
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3
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From: RSA
Flight planning for a long haul
We are starting a new flight from Johannesburg International to Gatwick soon. What Flightplanning System would be the "Better" one to use ? The A/C type will be a B767-300.
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 58
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From: Geneva, Switzerland
I would sgtrongly recommened the SITA solution GraFlite, but then again, I am biased. For a customer perspective feel free to approach your opposite number in SAA for his personal opinion and a local reference site visit.
Are you setting up something new or are you an existing SA based operator expanding into long-haul?
Send me a PM with your email address and I'll arrange for the relevant documentation to be forwarded to you for consideration.
Whooaahh!!!
Are you setting up something new or are you an existing SA based operator expanding into long-haul?
Send me a PM with your email address and I'll arrange for the relevant documentation to be forwarded to you for consideration.
Whooaahh!!!
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
From: Midlands
GraFlite
Just as piece of advice, think twice before signing up for SITA GraFlite. Has some major drawbacks, re-routing is a nightmare as the database used by SITA to store all its routes is pre-historic and there are a few more I could mention as I use it only a daily basis. Aaaaarrrgggghh!!!!!!!!!
Have you tried Jeppesen Jetplan? It's user friendly and you have more control over routing options and is much easier to amend payloads, fuel etc etc.
Keep it tight at the back, and watch out for the spare man!
AK
Have you tried Jeppesen Jetplan? It's user friendly and you have more control over routing options and is much easier to amend payloads, fuel etc etc.
Keep it tight at the back, and watch out for the spare man!
AK
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
From: Great Hallingbury
Jeppesen OnSight
We used Jeppesen OnSight for long-haul mainly using B767-200 & -300. It was an excellent system, but as we were the launch customer it did take a while & some amount of cash to get it working up to it's final spec'....If you would like any further details/info give me a shout
Much success with your flying programme, I will keep an eye out for you Brgds MriyaDream
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
From: Geneva, Switzerland
Looks to me like Ar Kid needs a little refresher training on the optimum use of GraFlite. There are many different ways to handle reroutings, payload changes, fuel policies, etc. within GraFlite and none of which involve using the admitedly technically outdated master route database or even contacting QIF for support.
Incidentally, this master routes database will be replaced in the very near future with "NewNav". This will give you much more flexibility and control over your stored routings than the old version and is streets ahead of Jeppesen's methodology.
Whooaahh!!
Incidentally, this master routes database will be replaced in the very near future with "NewNav". This will give you much more flexibility and control over your stored routings than the old version and is streets ahead of Jeppesen's methodology.
Whooaahh!!
Last edited by Whooaahh; 20th August 2003 at 04:09.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 532
Likes: 0
From: Tracy Island
Looks to me like Ar Kid needs a little refresher training on the optimum use of GraFlite.
Graflite is not user friendly, it's not autonomous as the user has no control over the route data base or aircraft performance.
PJGE
If you're on a small budget then go for Jetplan.com make sure you screw them down on price. Just sign up for the flight plan package only the wx and notam service isn't very good. If you need any more information please contact me by PM.
Rgds
FEBA
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: South East
I fully agree with FEBA. After using the Graflite, I found it not user friendly at all, also the ARB keyword sometime doesn't works well outside Europe, if it does we may have a delay on the plan. Also some problem reported by our handling agent, plan with no notam and weather. Also, we spend a lots of money and time on training for the Graflite system, lots of keywords but most of them you hardly use it.
However there are some good functions, add-on, the notam and weather alert side are very good and useful. I think overall is a good system for airlines with a large number of movement and using fixed route all the time, since it is cheaper than Jepp.
On the dispatcher point of view, Jepp is great on getting the job done. Sometime you may need to open your chart but at least it works and you are in control at all time. I can go online to rerun and change the plan live.
By the look of the way Whooaahh present Graflite, it seem we have a Sales person here. I think most the time people just want the work done, not the add-on feature. If you can't get the plan run probably what's the point on using the system. For the past few years I used Jepp, only once we have to contact Jepp to make some changes to our crz mode. But with Graflite, it seem likes a day to day things, especially with any of our charter route.
See for yourself. At the end of the day, Jepp is ahead of the game.
However there are some good functions, add-on, the notam and weather alert side are very good and useful. I think overall is a good system for airlines with a large number of movement and using fixed route all the time, since it is cheaper than Jepp.
On the dispatcher point of view, Jepp is great on getting the job done. Sometime you may need to open your chart but at least it works and you are in control at all time. I can go online to rerun and change the plan live.
By the look of the way Whooaahh present Graflite, it seem we have a Sales person here. I think most the time people just want the work done, not the add-on feature. If you can't get the plan run probably what's the point on using the system. For the past few years I used Jepp, only once we have to contact Jepp to make some changes to our crz mode. But with Graflite, it seem likes a day to day things, especially with any of our charter route.
See for yourself. At the end of the day, Jepp is ahead of the game.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 532
Likes: 0
From: Tracy Island
OpsBoy
Price is all in the negotiation. Generally speaking Jeppesen will compete well with SITA and in my experience come out favourably (depending on the size of the contract of course). When you consider that it is a better product with superior algorithms, easier to use, offers you your own databases, far greater resiliance, faster and more reliable, it's obvious which one to go for.
Before you ask; no I'm not a salesman. There is a better product than Jeppesen, it's LIDO; very expensive though.
Whooooah - Give my regards to Victoria V!!
Rgds
FEBA
Price is all in the negotiation. Generally speaking Jeppesen will compete well with SITA and in my experience come out favourably (depending on the size of the contract of course). When you consider that it is a better product with superior algorithms, easier to use, offers you your own databases, far greater resiliance, faster and more reliable, it's obvious which one to go for.
Before you ask; no I'm not a salesman. There is a better product than Jeppesen, it's LIDO; very expensive though.
Whooooah - Give my regards to Victoria V!!
Rgds
FEBA
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Try UV Datalink. Excellant facility, user friendly and easy to learn with support from the US and the UK. allows selection best winds, own routes, Universal routes and includes NAT track selections, ETP's - whatever you want.
Can be accessed anywhere you have internet connection and in addition to routes provides route and airfield weather, Notams, charts. Highly recommended.
www.uvdatalink.com
Can be accessed anywhere you have internet connection and in addition to routes provides route and airfield weather, Notams, charts. Highly recommended.
www.uvdatalink.com
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Planet Earth
Having worked with SAS, KLM, Phoenix, Atraxis and now LIDO.
I would recommend either Atraxis (magnificent graphics) or if you want to keep the logistics simple and the cost low, then go for Phoenix access is simple thru Sita.
ctc a guy called Peake at LGWCSCO.
Good luck
EB
I would recommend either Atraxis (magnificent graphics) or if you want to keep the logistics simple and the cost low, then go for Phoenix access is simple thru Sita.
ctc a guy called Peake at LGWCSCO.
Good luck
EB
