Aviation experince - is it mandatory ??

[bala_murali]

Hi there guys .i checked many post regarding flight dispatch and the general feedback that i got was not so good ( as expected ) .I want to make this work some how . I am from india .i did my bachelors degree in electrical and electronics engineering and have worked in Dell computers for 2 years . i have planned to do my flight dispatcher course .i have no aviation field experience . Is aviation experience a mandatory entry requirement for flight dispatcher training?

I checked for DGCA authorized schools for doing my training. but my bad luck it seems there are no DGCA approved flight dispatcher training institutes in india . Where the hell do dispatcher in India train??

From what i have heard Emirates aviation college does offer a good training .And considering the immigration policies and job opportunities in other countries. i think UAE would be a better shot. So i would like to know few things .

• The total course fee was including exam fee in Emirates av college is 6885 USD -- Is there any other costs hidden cost apart from this
  
  
• the post i read were pretty outdated - i would like to know the training quality in emirates as of now
  
• Job opportunities in UAE right now ( Hoping to god for some positive replies )
  
• since both UAE and India come under ICAO contracting countries . Is there any way to convert a UAE license to DGCA license .

• Do you have any other training institutions in mind -- ( like if i do train there, i have the best possibility for a job{... like Harvard for law } )

Guys there i do know landing a job as a flight dispatcher is a pretty hard ,but i got to take the risk . i want to be in a job that i am actually interested in . I want to take a calculated risk not a stupid one . Hope your experience can guide me through to take a good decision Thanks a lot for your time guys .. Its much appreciated .

[boredcounter]

Why are you not looking

At getting an Engineer license?

[bala_murali]

Flight dispatcher license

NO to get a flight dispatcher license .

[+TSRA]

I cannot speak to the schools in the UAE you are speaking about, but I can speak to the experience required. However, if its an Emirates course, I would bet its pretty good.

For the training, there is no regulatory requirement for you to have a background in Aviation. As for the course, you may want to call the school to find out if they have a school prereq. list. Of course, it will help if you have a basic understanding of the rules and regulations and a basic handle on meteorology, navigation, advanced aircraft sytems, communications, etc, however this would all be taught during the course anyways.

As for your current degrees and experience, you can pretty much throw that out the window (no offence) for the commonality it will give you in aviation. While it may allow you to better understand the technical aspects of, say ACARS or ADS-B or similar systems, that will not really help when you are trying to decide the routing of a flight based on stated coverage of those systems and apply that to meteorological information - sorry.

Last but not least, a little leg work on contacting your local government office will answer all your local questions, regarding transfer of documents. Just because they are contracting states of ICAO does not give you free entry everywhere - there are regional differences which you must understand, so they will make you write an exam, or something.

Good luck!

[bala_murali]

Is 7 weeks of training enough ??

hi there TSRA

As you said i contact the Dgca licensing Dept . The person who took the phone didn't know what a flight dispatcher is ? .. My call got transfered in and around the dept and finally went to a person who couldn't understand English and finally after some they cut my call . .. Anyways will try my luck on Monday again.. But let me know one things , from what i check most institutions like ( sheffield , emirates ) offer this dispatch training for 7 weeks only Emirates | Aviation College, Aerospace & Academic Studies , i gave a engineering degree but no aviation experience. are these courses tailored for people in aviation industry( flight operation ) or even a new comer like me can join this course .... Basically what i want to know is " IS 7 WEEKS ENOUGH TIME TO COMPLETE THIS COURSE ?? ... Do i need to do any introductory courses before jumping to this 7 week program

[+TSRA]

The fact that the person did not know what a Flight Dispatcher is could be for a number of reasons, but they will have a similar position, they may just call it something different.

From what I just read on the Emirates website there that you provided, the course should be tailored to people entering the airline industry with no previous experience - the "new hires" gives that away.

The 7 weeks should not worry you. If you are willing to study hard, and use every spare second to reading the books and information they provide, then 7 weeks is enough time to take someone new and give them the information they need to enter the industry. Being a school attached to an airline means they want to keep their reputation up, so be prepared to work hard, but at the end you will have been given the information to pass the GCAA-UAE Dispatcher exam.

If you did want to take a course or something before hand, I would suggest going to the local flying school and asking them if you could enrole in a course to get a feel for the information. That will give you a basic idea of the type of information you will be provided- I would suggest a Commercial Pilot Meteorology or Navigation class (Airline Transport would be even better, but be prepared to feel like youre in too deep!)

All in all, it looks and sounds like a good course, and it is a great career! Good luck!

[bala_murali]

Ticketing Agent to Flight dispatcher ( WOW long way )

hi there TSRA . Got a the info from DGCA that there are no DGCA authorized training centers in India . I also spoke to a flight dispatcher working in jet airways . He told to his knowledge there are no flight dispatch training in India . He joined the airline as a ticketing agent and he moved up the line it seems . I am 25 years right now . It is hard to accept the fact that after finishing my engineering degree in electrical and electronics and working in dell computer for 2 years, i have to join an airline as a ticketing agent in order to become a flight dispatcher . It seem the aviation industry in India doesn't recruit people directly for ground handling and dispatcher kinda jobs . they go with people working in cargo and other sectors of the aviation industry . This is a real bad news for me
So i think the next logical step would be to try in emirates which atleast has a college which is approved my GCAA govering authority . I did see from many posts that , only UAE nationals are employed there , its not a place for outsiders. But i think opportunities in Dubai would be much better than in india ( Correct me if i am wrong ) ..
I got a email from emirated about the syllabus and details . Have sent the attachement and the mail . Check it out . Do love some advice and opinions guys ..

Dear,
Thank you for your interest in our Training. Please find attached course syllabus and the agreement form which you need to fill up with complete information, and send it back to us. Pls indicate your complete address, contact number, email address and nationality in the form.



Emirates Aviation College in collaboration with Jeppesen Academy offers the Flight Dispatch Course at the college in Dubai. The course is approved by the General Civil Aviation - UAE.

Successful applicants will be issued an initial GCAA (General Civil Aviation Authority – UAE) Dispatcher License. Upon completing on the Job training for 90 working days at recognized Dispatch Centre, we will issue the full license.

The course is, as well, JAA compliant and the syllabus is FAA approved in the United States.

Flight Dispatch

* 3 October - 18 November, 2010

Duration: 7-week course

(Additional 3-5 days) for the oral and practical exam.

Course Fee: US$ 6,815

Oral and Practical (O+P) Examination Fees: US$ 330 cash (to be paid to the examiner during the exam day).

O+P Re-takes: US$ 165

GCAA License Fee: AED 900

EAC Processing Fee: AED 200

Timings: SUN-THU, 8:30am to 4:30pm

Entry Requirements: 21 years old and above

Good command of English

No previous experience required but prior knowledge about the course is an advantage.



We do not give discount. Billing is done by Jeppesen. Bills will be paid directly to Jeppesen Gmbh Account upon receipt of the invoice which will be sent to your email address you provided.

If you need visa and accommodation, you have to inform us at least a month before the course starts.

Regards,

Faten

Syllabus content

Level 2 Flight Operations Management

Syllabus
The six-week Level 2 course will be divided into eight main lessons, plus an introduction. Each lesson presents instructional material, gives students opportunities to apply what they have learned in various exercises, and quizzes students on what they have learned. The following sections provide an overview of the goals of each lesson, outline the topics covered in each lesson, and provide an estimate of the approximate class time to complete each lesson and its exercises is provided. Time estimates do not include time to complete the knowledge or mock practical exams.
Introduction 0.5 hours
This lesson orients the student to the course as a whole and to the expectations for completion. It includes the following topics:
 Syllabus Review
 Attendance Policy
 Grading Criteria
 Homework
 Reading Materials
Federal Aviation Regulations 16 hours
This lesson covers applicable FARs relating to both:
 Airline transport pilot privileges, limitations, and flight operations
 Dispatcher role and responsibilities, limitations and expectations
It includes the following topics:
 FAR Part 1 Definitions and Abbreviations
 FAR Part 13 Investigative and Enforcement Procedures
 FAR Part 25 Airworthiness Standards
 FAR Part 61 Certification: Pilots and Flight Instructors
 FAR Part 65 Certification: Airmen other than Flight Crewmembers
 FAR Part 71 Designation of Federal Airways, Area Low Routes, Controlled Airspace, and Reporting Points
Federal Aviation Regulations (con’t)
 FAR Part 73 Special Use Airspace
 FAR Part 91 General Operating and Flight Rules
 FAR Part 97 Standard Instrument Approach Procedures
 FAR Part 108 Security
 FAR Part 121 Certification and Operations: Domestic, Flag, and Supplemental
 FAR Part 139 Certification and Operations: Land Airports Serving Certain Air Carriers
 FAR Part 175 Hazardous Material Regulations
 NTSB 830 Notification and Reporting of Aircraft Accidents, Incidents, Overdue Aircraft, and Preservation of Aircraft Wreckage, Mail, Cargo, and Records
 General Operating Manual
Meteorology 76 hours
This lesson covers basic weather studies, such as:
 Knowledge and effects of fronts, frontal characteristics, cloud formations, icing, and upper-air data
 General system of weather and NOTAM collection, dissemination, interpretation and use
 Interpretation and use of weather charts, maps, forecasts, sequence reports, abbreviations, and symbols.
 National Weather Service functions as they pertain to operations in the National Airspace System
 Windshear and microburst awareness, identification, and avoidance
 Principles of air navigation under instrument meteorological conditions in the National airspace System
It includes the following topics:
 The earth’s motion and its affect on weather
 Regional weather types, characteristics, and structures
 Maritime
 Continental
 Polar
Meteorology (con’t)
 Tropical
 Local Weather Types, Characteristics, and Structures
 Coastal
 Mountainous
 Island
 Tropical
 Basic Properties of the Atmosphere
 Layers
 Composition
 Density/Pressure
 Units of measure
 Weather systems characteristics
 Temperature effects on weather
 Altimeters
 Pressure gradient force
 Pressure pattern flying weather
 Heat and Temperature
 Wind
 Global wind patterns
 Major wind systems and coriolis force
 Jetstreams and their characteristics
 Local wind and related terms
 Ozone and Solar Heating
 States of Matter
 Solids, liquid, and gases
 Causes of state changes
 Clouds
 Formation
 Condensation
 Precipitation
 Cloud types and families
 Use of cloud knowledge in forecasting
 Fog and Ice
 Types
 Cause and formation
 Hazards to aviation
 Detection and removal
 Stability and Instability
 Temperature lapse rate, convection
Meteorology (con’t)
 Adiabatic processes
 Lifting processes
 Divergence
 Convergence
 Turbulence
 Causes
 Low level windshear
 Mountain waves
 Thunderstorms
 Clear Air Turbulence
 Determination of smooth level of flight
 Hazards to aviation
 Detection equipment
 Air masses
 Classification
 Flying conditions to be encountered
 Use of air mass knowledge in forecasting
 Fronts
 Structure and characteristics
 Symbology
 Cloud sequence in fronts
 Establishing position of front by cloud type
 Fronts in north America and seasonal variations
 Flying weather in fronts
 Cyclones, anticyclones, and squall lines
 Storm systems
 Thunderstorms
 Tornadoes
 Hurricanes and typhoons
 Microbursts
 Structure and complexity of internal winds
 Hail, its cause and formation
 Causes, formation, and dissipation
 Hazards to aviation
 Detection equipment
 Interpreting weather data
 Aviation weather service programs
 Weather sequences, symbols, and decoding
 Weather map symbols and decoding
 Drawing a weather map
 Reading a weather map
Meteorology (con’t)

 Upper level charts
 Adiabatic charts
 Winds aloft charts
 Instruments used to gather and record the weather
 Weather forecasting
 Extrapolation
 Movement of fronts and air masses
 Barometric tendency
 Isobars, isotachs, isotherms
 Weather Related Aircraft Hazards
 Crosswinds and gusts
 Contaminated runways
 Restrictions to surface visibility
 Turbulence and windshear
 Icing
 Thunderstorms and microbursts
 Volcanic ash
 Application of weather knowledge
 Planning a flight
Navigation 32 hours
This lesson teaches principles of air navigation under IMC conditions in the NAS. It ensures that students have adequate knowledge of applicable navigation instruments.
It includes the following topics:
 Study of the Earth
 Mercater projections
 Gnomonic projections
 Lambert projections
 Polyconic projections
 Dead reckoning
 Magnetic variation, compass deviation
 Terms, winds, and vectors
 Correction angle
Navigation (con’t)
 Findings wind drift off course
 Off course problems
 Wind velocity by single and double drift
 Interception problems
 Radius of action – problems
 Search problems
 Computer use – problems
 Types of Navigation
 Class 1 and 2
 Types of Navaids
 Self contained
 Ground facilities
 Combination
 Radio Navigation
 Principle of the radio range, radio compass, direction finder, marker beacons, ILS, CAA, radio altimeter, Loran, and others
 Navigational Instruments
 Altimeter, airspeed indicator, compass, drift, rate of climb indicator, and others
 Errors associated with radio navigation and navigational instruments
 Chart reading
 Symbols, landmarks, etc
Aircraft 28 hours
This lesson teaches aircraft loading, weight and balance, use of charts, graphs, tables, formulas, and computations and their effect on aircraft performance. It also discusses aerodynamics relating to an aircraft’s flight characteristics and performance in normal and abnormal flight regimes. It ensures that students have an adequate knowledge of:
 applicable aircraft flight instruments and systems, and their operating characteristics
Aircraft (con’t)
 aircraft systems and components
 normal, abnormal, and emergency operating procedures
 use of correct terminology
 operating handbook or flight manual with regard to flight instruments, navigation instruments and avionics systems, aircraft systems, minimum equipment list, and operations specifications as appropriate.
 performance limitations
It includes the following topics:
 Basic Aerodynamics
 Lift, weight, thrust, drag
 Roll, yaw causes and characteristics
 Aircraft controls
 Airspeeds
 Engine specifications - powerplant
 Operating limits
 Fuel consumption
 Accessories
 Operating manual
 Airplane specifications
 Operational equipment
 Flight controls, landing gear hydraulic system, electrical system, fuel capacity, heating and ventilation system, de-icing equipment, and others
 Weight and balance
 Center of gravity
 How determined
 Center of gravity limits
 Loading characteristics
 Problems in loading
 Performance
 Effect of weight, wind, air density, and runway surfaces on aircraft performance
 Power setting and cockpit procedure
 Types of cruise control
 Performance charts
 Take-off distance, landing distance, accelerate-stop distance
 Climb, cruise, and descent charts
 Holding, single-engine performance charts
 Terrain clearance/drift down
Communications 8 hours
This lesson teaches crew resource management, including crew communication and coordination. It includes the following topics:
 Radio-telephone rules and regulations
 FCC rules and regulations
 Company communications
 Air to ground radio communications and procedures
 Point to point communications and procedures
 Equipment air to ground and point to point
 FAA communications
 Air to ground radio communications and procedures
 Point to point communications and procedures
 Equipment air to ground and point to point
Air Traffic Control 24 hours
This lesson teaches air traffic control procedures and pilot responsibilities as they relate to enroute operations, terminal area and radar operations, and instrument departure and approach procedures. It includes the following topics:
 Air route traffic control procedures and equipment
 Airport traffic control procedures and equipment
 Various ATC agencies
 Airport familiarization
 Airport lighting
 Airport markings
 Airport facility directory
 Airspace
 Notams
Emergency and Abnormal Procedures 8 hours
This lesson teaches roles and responsibilities in emergency situations. It includes the following topics:
 Security measures on the ground
 Security measures in the air
 FAA responsibility and service
 Collection and dissemination of information
 Means of declaring an emergency
 Responsibility for declaring an emergency
 Required reporting of an emergency
 NTSB reporting requirements
Practical Dispatching 30 hours
This lesson teaches practical applications of the knowledge taught in the previous lessons. It helps prepare students for the FAA Practical Test.
It includes the following topics:
 Human Factors
 Decision Making
 Human Error
 Teamwork
 Preflight
 Safety
 Economic advantage
 Airport selection and legality/field conditions
 Crew legality
 Notams/pireps
 Route selection and distance
 Horizontal and vertical extent of the weather
 Forecast weather and winds aloft
 Minimum safe altitude
 Altitude selection
 Flight plan/alternate plan
 Clearances – company and air traffic control
 Fuel determination
 Loading consideration
 Departure time
 In-flight
 Position report
Practical Dispatching (con’t)

 Altimeter settings
 Weather reports
 Weather change
 Changing instrument altitude
 Additional clearances/re-release
 Emergency procedures/communication
 Post flight
 Arrival report
 Differences between forecast and actual/pireps
 Maintenance considerations

Entry requirements
A good command of English and either completion of Level 1 course or passing grade of 80% on knowledge test provided by Jeppesen Academy

Course length 6 Weeks
Training Methods
• Classroom Lessons
• Classroom Lectures
• Practical Exercises
Participants
24 ( maximum )
Language
English

[boredcounter]

Bala

I do not wish to be critical in any way at all, go ahead and buy your ticket. It will be worthless. If you wish to work in the ME, good luck, I honestly mean it. Lots of FAR regs taught there, worthless in trying to transfer your ticket, especially to the EU.

You do seem to have the background more suited to an engineer.
If you want to spend a lot of cash to be a 'dispatcher' feel free.

Know your aircraft type and the MEL/CDL
Know your Crew and the FTLS
Know your handlers
Know your Engineers and the info received
Know the Ops Manuals, where to look.

Know where to get the best from the above

All that cannot be 'bought by a coures and a license' it takes years to build up. Save your money and get in at the bottom...............

It is the best grounding you will ever get.

Above all, LEARN................. It cannot be taught in 7 weeks in the real World.

Bored has seen too many freshmen on here, have ticket, where can I find a job, from Pilots too dispatchers...........................it's sad for the industry!


Bored

[+TSRA]

After reading the course syllabus that they sent, I have to somewhat agree with Bored - in that it is very FAR based which means transfering that knowledge to the EU or Middle East will require further study than the course shows. While this is not difficult, it is something that you would need to take into account because while most of the major regulations are the same, there are regional differences (flight duty time, airspace configurations, etc) that become a pain when planning a flight, and that seems to be something they are not teaching by only going the FAR route.

However, I disagree with the need to work yourself from the bottom up in a single airline to become a dispatcher. All of the dispatchers I know have worked up through the industry from smaller operators to larger ones (just like Pilots), and by the time they reach the majors they have all the operational knowledge that a dispatcher needs, without ever having to have washed an airplane or do the things that, quite frankly, are useless for international operations.

[ghulam_21]

Hi

bala PM me if u need info on jeppesen course and conversion criteria as i have been through the same

[bala_murali]

FAA or GCAA

Hi +TSRA .finally I have decided to do the course. There is no centre for dispatch training in India. So the opinion of India in turned down as of now... I got 2 options. From my research Sheffield school, in USA seems to be very reputed in their training standards... It cost around 4500 dollars there ... and I heard good feedback about emirates aviation college dispatch course. It cost around 7500 dollars there. So on the whole, puting the food and accommodation charges etc... Both of them are coming to the same budget. I would like to know your opinion of whether to choose FAA or GCAA course taking into account the job propects. I would love to do this course in USA, but I heard getting a work permit after finishing the course in USA is next to impossible for an international student. Or do you recommend any other country where I could train in which much better job prospects. I have Dubai emirates Aviation College in mind because I think I have a better shot or getin a work permit and landing a job there compared to other countries. Do correct me if I am wrong. I am asking you this keeping in mind that landing a job as a dispatcher is very difficult in any country now days .But still it’s not the end of the world. People who are passionate about aviation will get into aviation no matter what ever be the case .I know I am taking a big risk. But I want my risk to be a calculated one! Your opinions your greatly help me in my decision making. Thanks a lot for your time guys. It’s much appreciated...

[boredcounter]

+TSRA

'However, I disagree with the need to work yourself from the bottom up in a single airline to become a dispatcher. All of the dispatchers I know have worked up through the industry from smaller operators to larger ones (just like Pilots), and by the time they reach the majors they have all the operational knowledge that a dispatcher needs, without ever having to have washed an airplane or do the things that, quite frankly, are useless for international operations.'


Guess my post must have been ambiguous, as that is just what I had in mind with starting at the bottom and working up. However, my first three months were spent as the only loader of small freighters, through interest, I started learning W&B. That in turn lead to my start in Operations Control.

Hence start at the bottom and work up, it sure worked for me.

To the origional poster, if you are sure you wish to go down the road, I would give my personal reccomendation to Sheffield in FL. I was asked to complete their 2 week fast track course by my current employer. The training is very good, hard work, but worth it. I stand corrected after a chat with a German Licenced dispatcher, I believe LH now accept the FAA ticket in place of the LBA.

Good luck to you, which ever you choose.



Bored

[desertopsguy]

Bali Murali,

You're getting some Euro-centric responses here and they will not help you if you want to work as a 'flight' dispatcher in the M.East. There is no 'work your way up' route here.

The reason that route is common in some European countries, UK in particular, is because they have not yet embraced the licenced flight dispatcher concept and have no choice. Many airlines, Easyjet included, send their aspiring flight dispatchers for flight dispatcher training. The training is relevant and standardised and gives an excellent foundation on which to build. Learning bits and pieces as you go, from lots of different people is not a good way to learn things.

Sheffield is the best when it comes to training. The Dispatcher factory in DXB is overpriced and taking advantage of the fact that many people in that region cannot afford or are not allowed to go all the way to USA. They are also responsible for flooding the M.East with inexperienced newbies who will work for the lowest bidder.
I could never figure out why they are issuing GCAA licences yet go heavy on the FAA regs, not the regs of their licencing authority. Makes no sense to me.

Good luck with whatever you choose.

D.O.G

[bala_murali]

FAR reg on regulation GCAA !!is it a bad thing

Hi there desertops guy

Many guys have quoted your line

issuing GCAA licences yet go heavy on the FAA regs, not the regs of their licencing authority

... Is that bad in some way ? sorry if this question sound stupid ( i have no aviation experience ).
Three main thing that drew me into this course

• Jeppesen handles the training
  
• Reputation of Emirates
  
• from talking to dispatcher in india , they told me that there is a much better chance of me landing a job in UAE than in india ,

And finally there is no DGCA approved dispatch training academies in India .So that option is completely ruled out .

Everybody told that the training in sheffield is awesome .But at the end of the day what do i do with a FAA license . there is no way i can get a work permit in USA .

I do understand that getting a assistant dispatcher job is very difficult even in UAE ,india or anywhere for that matter . I want to give it the best possible shot ? Which license or whose training would give me the edge over the other ? How can i make myself attractive to the employer as a fresher dispatcher ? And guys i am 25 years old having a engineering degree and 2 years of work experince in dell as a Senior hardware technician ! i think the option of starting as a ticketing agent in an airline and moving up the line as a dispatcher would be too late for me

[azmalzea]

dispatcher course

bala, you cannot expect a job in india with faa or gcaa dispatchers license. neither there is any conversion process laid down by dgca.

so good luck, please re think before investing your money.

[bala_murali]

the way to do ?

Hi there azmal
i do understand that . From what i heard with the FAA Dispatcher license i would have the a best chance of getting into flight operations as a assistant dispatcher. After that i heard that we would have to work in an airline for 6 months after which the airline would send US for the DGCA dispatch examination.So from what i heard to enter into flight operations FAA dispatch license seemed to be the best goo( Correct me if i am wrong ) .. Do let me know your opinion of how i should approach this . . Thank you for your time ..

[PIA]

Hi Guys,

I am planning to go to dallas to AFDTC college in Nov for FAA DISPATCH license course, any idea is it worth to do this time, and as i have a 3 years experience in as a LOAD CONTROLLER, will this FAA Dispatch course and my LOAD CONTROL experience will help me to get a new job in europe or in middle east or far east asia.......Thanks

[desertopsguy]

Some cargo companies like it if their dispatchers have load control experience as the load sheet is sometimes prepared along with the flight paperwork by the dispatcher eg HeavyLift do this I believe.

Apart from that I'm not sure it makes much of a difference if you have load control experience as pax outfits normally let their gnd handlers do it, failing that, the pilots will take care of it.

D.O.G