Licenses & computers
Guest
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Licenses & computers
Firstly, thanks for listening re the Ground staff forum.
Does anyone out there know anything about rumoured plans to get UK Ops and Crew Control staff licensed. When will this happen etc..
Also, I would be interested in hearing from anyone with regard to computerised flight watch, rostering and crew control. What is your experience good or bad and any system recommendations/or otherwise... Any flight crew input would be appreciated on this topic as well.
Does anyone out there know anything about rumoured plans to get UK Ops and Crew Control staff licensed. When will this happen etc..
Also, I would be interested in hearing from anyone with regard to computerised flight watch, rostering and crew control. What is your experience good or bad and any system recommendations/or otherwise... Any flight crew input would be appreciated on this topic as well.
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Obi Wan,
The idea of licences for Ops and Crewing staff has been arround for some time. However, the last major attempt I know of was in the early 90's. From what I have heard the plan was to base the training and qualifications on the Birdseed training programme. However BALPA went to the CAA and objected because they saw this as the first step towards FAA style dispatchers. From what I have heard this was never the plan, but it was dropped anyway.
Regarding systems there are 4 I have seen:
Acrobat - Good flight watch system, if a little unreliable at times. Not the best crewing system. (Used by Monarch & easyJet)
RM - Good system, all visually driven, but a little poor in the database side, very expensive. (Used by Jersey, KLMuk, Manx)
AIMS - Good alround system from what I've seen (Air2000, Debonair, GO)
Sabre - Written for Ammerican Airlines, very expensive from what I hear, but, I don't have enough knowledge for an evaluation (Used by Britannia)
[This message has been edited by opsbod (edited 22 August 1999).]
The idea of licences for Ops and Crewing staff has been arround for some time. However, the last major attempt I know of was in the early 90's. From what I have heard the plan was to base the training and qualifications on the Birdseed training programme. However BALPA went to the CAA and objected because they saw this as the first step towards FAA style dispatchers. From what I have heard this was never the plan, but it was dropped anyway.
Regarding systems there are 4 I have seen:
Acrobat - Good flight watch system, if a little unreliable at times. Not the best crewing system. (Used by Monarch & easyJet)
RM - Good system, all visually driven, but a little poor in the database side, very expensive. (Used by Jersey, KLMuk, Manx)
AIMS - Good alround system from what I've seen (Air2000, Debonair, GO)
Sabre - Written for Ammerican Airlines, very expensive from what I hear, but, I don't have enough knowledge for an evaluation (Used by Britannia)
[This message has been edited by opsbod (edited 22 August 1999).]
Guest
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Interesting to hear about BALPA not wanting ops people to be licensed years ago.
If there are any flightdeck reading this, how do you feel nowadays ?
Do you not think it would be good for the aviation business as a whole, and especially for the service you receive ?
If there are any flightdeck reading this, how do you feel nowadays ?
Do you not think it would be good for the aviation business as a whole, and especially for the service you receive ?
Guest
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One of the best systems I've ever seen is at Southwest in Dallas. They use 'SWIFT', (Southwest In-Flight Tracking).
It started off as a shareware thing on the net, and their own IT dept teaked it out of all recognition, into the all singing all dancing ops / crewing masterpiece that it is now !
Hmmm - a dedicated H24 Ops IT dept - now wouldn't that be nice !!!
It started off as a shareware thing on the net, and their own IT dept teaked it out of all recognition, into the all singing all dancing ops / crewing masterpiece that it is now !
Hmmm - a dedicated H24 Ops IT dept - now wouldn't that be nice !!!
Guest
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I must say this forum is a good idea. I am flight deck by the way.
Where I work we recently had an intake of new recruits into the crewing department and there were some teething problems. However, I am not sure just what training each company gives to their controllers/ dispatchers and the like. I am keen to know more though.
The main problem for most flight deck is that we don't fully rely on the computer. We tend to keep an eye on things ourselves, and are sometimes asked to do things that help the company out, but are illegal, or very close to. Usually it involves fiddling the figures. For example, "If I come in tomorrow to do that flight I only get 10 hours rest". Crewing "OK then, report two hours later and we will have to delay the flight". Or on reporting sick the comeback is always "we will have to sub the flight if you don't come in" which is a bit demoralising, as generally we don't tend to skive off, and if we are ill you don't really want us being incapacitated once airborne, besides the fact it would be illegal to operate when ill anyway.
If we can help with any more feedback from the flight deck side, let us know!
Where I work we recently had an intake of new recruits into the crewing department and there were some teething problems. However, I am not sure just what training each company gives to their controllers/ dispatchers and the like. I am keen to know more though.
The main problem for most flight deck is that we don't fully rely on the computer. We tend to keep an eye on things ourselves, and are sometimes asked to do things that help the company out, but are illegal, or very close to. Usually it involves fiddling the figures. For example, "If I come in tomorrow to do that flight I only get 10 hours rest". Crewing "OK then, report two hours later and we will have to delay the flight". Or on reporting sick the comeback is always "we will have to sub the flight if you don't come in" which is a bit demoralising, as generally we don't tend to skive off, and if we are ill you don't really want us being incapacitated once airborne, besides the fact it would be illegal to operate when ill anyway.
If we can help with any more feedback from the flight deck side, let us know!
Guest
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Re Licensing, there was a very interesting article in one of the safety magazines, about 18 months ago, written by a retired Flight Ops Inspector. He was making the suggestion that Crewing/Rostering personnel should be licensed due to the very complex nature of the job. He made some very interesting suggestions, one of which was that ALL airlines should follow the same crewing levels. He even suggested that this formula be made law as part of CAP 371 or JAR-Ops part Q.
On the subject of computer systems, my ex-employer, had a program written for them. Although no where near as comprehensive as the ready made systems, nor as expensive, it did its intended job. The rostering/crewing data was still entered in manually, but you had the basic ability of checking hours, restrictions etc. The roster prints were well liked by the crews, which gave them very comprehensive details of their duties, which mean't no need for timetables, etc. Although over six years old, it is still going strong and other related ops and crew records programs have been made because of it.
Totally off-topic, I think Danny should be well congratulated on giving the ground bods there own forum. Although no longer employed in aviation, I still keep tabs on the industry.
Having spent six years in the crewing/rostering/ops side of the business, I know the frustration we ALL feel at times. This forum may even show the pilots that we aren't all "18 year old school leavers"!!!!
On the subject of computer systems, my ex-employer, had a program written for them. Although no where near as comprehensive as the ready made systems, nor as expensive, it did its intended job. The rostering/crewing data was still entered in manually, but you had the basic ability of checking hours, restrictions etc. The roster prints were well liked by the crews, which gave them very comprehensive details of their duties, which mean't no need for timetables, etc. Although over six years old, it is still going strong and other related ops and crew records programs have been made because of it.
Totally off-topic, I think Danny should be well congratulated on giving the ground bods there own forum. Although no longer employed in aviation, I still keep tabs on the industry.
Having spent six years in the crewing/rostering/ops side of the business, I know the frustration we ALL feel at times. This forum may even show the pilots that we aren't all "18 year old school leavers"!!!!
