Career advice for daughter - UK aircraft tech wannabe
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Career advice for daughter - UK aircraft tech wannabe
I've scanned the forum but have a few qs...
For some reason my daughter seems keen on fixing aircraft for a living. This is something I know zero about so have started scanning the internet. Be I'd be grateful for any pointers on how career paths work in the UK.
There seem to be apprenticeships and degrees in various forms of technician work - are these both pathways that lead to licencing (and how do the various grades of that all work?)?
She's also said that joining RN/RAF/Army is something she'd consider as a route - is it? And is there a difference between the services?
She's 17, got good GCSEs (As in sciences, maths etc) is waiting on A level results (inc maths) and has a place at university for a not-quite-science subject. But she's bored rigid with academia so probably won't take it up.
Many thanks for any comments - and I hope this (my first) post is in the right area (if not, let me know and I'll repost elsewhere).
For some reason my daughter seems keen on fixing aircraft for a living. This is something I know zero about so have started scanning the internet. Be I'd be grateful for any pointers on how career paths work in the UK.
There seem to be apprenticeships and degrees in various forms of technician work - are these both pathways that lead to licencing (and how do the various grades of that all work?)?
She's also said that joining RN/RAF/Army is something she'd consider as a route - is it? And is there a difference between the services?
She's 17, got good GCSEs (As in sciences, maths etc) is waiting on A level results (inc maths) and has a place at university for a not-quite-science subject. But she's bored rigid with academia so probably won't take it up.
Many thanks for any comments - and I hope this (my first) post is in the right area (if not, let me know and I'll repost elsewhere).
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Hi Lizziesdad. I'll try my best to give you some advice. She will need to be taken on as an apprentice. First though, she will need qualifications. Probably the minimum will be A levels in Maths and Physics. Most of our apprentices arrive with HND's or higher in aeronautical engineering. This is just to get through the door. With a 1000 plus applicants for 8 places, our company has a lot to sift through. Quite a few of our recent recruits have degrees.
Our company put apprentices through an A licence then after they have finished they are encouraged to go for their full B licence. In this job, you cannot escape the academia side of things. The study never really ceases. When you do get your licence, you still need to study for type courses, continuation training etc. 50% is doing the job and 50% is the paperwork.
My own career route involved 12 years in the RAF. I self studied all the EASA Part 66 modules while still serving then left and started with a well known north sea helicopter company and I haven't looked back since. Going the military route will still involve getting qualifications but if I remember correctly, it was only to GCSE Level and getting a good score in the aptitude test. The training from the military is second to none in my experience.
I hope this helps and good luck on her chosen career path. It's a long slog but definitely worth it.
Our company put apprentices through an A licence then after they have finished they are encouraged to go for their full B licence. In this job, you cannot escape the academia side of things. The study never really ceases. When you do get your licence, you still need to study for type courses, continuation training etc. 50% is doing the job and 50% is the paperwork.
My own career route involved 12 years in the RAF. I self studied all the EASA Part 66 modules while still serving then left and started with a well known north sea helicopter company and I haven't looked back since. Going the military route will still involve getting qualifications but if I remember correctly, it was only to GCSE Level and getting a good score in the aptitude test. The training from the military is second to none in my experience.
I hope this helps and good luck on her chosen career path. It's a long slog but definitely worth it.
British Airways have a variety of 'apprentice' positions available.
Have a look here..BA Apprentices
Minimum requirement is 5 GCSE 'C' grade or above including Maths and English.
It was the same when I joined thirty odd years ago but loads got in with barely a CSE. Didn't do them any harm as most are doing very nicely now.
Good luck to your daughter.
Have a look here..BA Apprentices
Minimum requirement is 5 GCSE 'C' grade or above including Maths and English.
It was the same when I joined thirty odd years ago but loads got in with barely a CSE. Didn't do them any harm as most are doing very nicely now.
Good luck to your daughter.
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Many thanks for the replies and info.
We've done a bit more research and think we understand the lie of the land a bit better now.
It seems that B1 and B2 licencing with specific aircraft ratings is the nirvana to which she should aspire - making her employable in a wide variety of contexts (while keeping her on her tools - she's not keen (yet - give it 20 years!) on office work.
Getting an apprenticeship would be a simple and direct route in the right direction.
However, (i) most apprenticeship intakes seem to be complete for this year, (ii) they're hellishly competitive (not a bad thing), and (iii) she's weak on both academics ("A" grade GCSEs are OK but she has only maths A Level (and some irrelevant ones inc RE) - grades unknown until mid August).
So, if she wants to follow this route; she needs to do some consolidation - adding a science A Level and somehow demonstrating her practical work. Or, as she's found, doing a Level 3 Diploma (I have no idea what this is) in Aeronautical Engineering at the local college.
Specific questions:
1. Are there any "traps"; would doing too much study and too many courses make her of less interest as a potential apprentice? As hands-on work experience is so important to this career, I can imagine a degree (for example) being an actual disadvantage. Would doing a diploma at her own expense and in her "gap year" help or hinder?
2. She wants to demonstrate or document somehow, her practical skills as she has a purely academic CV right now. She's a bit stumped on how to do this so would welcome ideas. Her ideas so far are to volunteer to local organisations that might have some connection with engineering (a historical machinery museum, hovercraft museum, RNLI etc). I've told her she's more likely to end up polishing the floor but I suppose it's still CV material of sorts.
3. We're guessing that the RAF as an employer would want the same as an apprentice employer - but she's got an appointment with them soon so will find out one way or the other.
Once again, many thanks for the info.
We've done a bit more research and think we understand the lie of the land a bit better now.
It seems that B1 and B2 licencing with specific aircraft ratings is the nirvana to which she should aspire - making her employable in a wide variety of contexts (while keeping her on her tools - she's not keen (yet - give it 20 years!) on office work.
Getting an apprenticeship would be a simple and direct route in the right direction.
However, (i) most apprenticeship intakes seem to be complete for this year, (ii) they're hellishly competitive (not a bad thing), and (iii) she's weak on both academics ("A" grade GCSEs are OK but she has only maths A Level (and some irrelevant ones inc RE) - grades unknown until mid August).
So, if she wants to follow this route; she needs to do some consolidation - adding a science A Level and somehow demonstrating her practical work. Or, as she's found, doing a Level 3 Diploma (I have no idea what this is) in Aeronautical Engineering at the local college.
Specific questions:
1. Are there any "traps"; would doing too much study and too many courses make her of less interest as a potential apprentice? As hands-on work experience is so important to this career, I can imagine a degree (for example) being an actual disadvantage. Would doing a diploma at her own expense and in her "gap year" help or hinder?
2. She wants to demonstrate or document somehow, her practical skills as she has a purely academic CV right now. She's a bit stumped on how to do this so would welcome ideas. Her ideas so far are to volunteer to local organisations that might have some connection with engineering (a historical machinery museum, hovercraft museum, RNLI etc). I've told her she's more likely to end up polishing the floor but I suppose it's still CV material of sorts.
3. We're guessing that the RAF as an employer would want the same as an apprentice employer - but she's got an appointment with them soon so will find out one way or the other.
Once again, many thanks for the info.
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I just spotted this. Bristow - bristowgroup.com
Apprentice positions available.
Apprentice positions available.
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I'll offer a thumbs up for the Bristow apprenticeship, my son is two years into his. He was the youngest of his intake at 17. The oldest was 24, ranging from GCSE's, A levels and degree holders. He's enjoying every minute of it, even though he has to live in the most expensive city in Scotland.
Also look at Monarch, Thomson, Easyjet, Virgin etc.
Also look at Monarch, Thomson, Easyjet, Virgin etc.
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I think you are spot on there with point 2. Any experience "on the tools" is a good thing, just using hand tools and taking things apart, I don't think there's much of this in schools now. Doesn't have to be aircraft either - volunteering at a local transport museum, restoring something like a BSA Bantam, its all useful stuff. Don't forget books, have a look in charity shops or Ebay for things like "Engineering Workshop Practice" or "Workshop Technology". Some of these old books explain the basics very well. Its already been said, interviews are very competitive, taking along a few photos of things she's done could swing it!
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Don't get too bogged down with the A levels etc, most modern apprenticeships rerquire 5 GCSE's at grade C or above to include Maths, English and 1 science subject so I dont think A levels or degrees will help.
If the GCSE's are no problem then I can agree with the others that hand skills are almost as important as the academics! Volunteer work with the local airfield maintenance organisation or any other engineering/mechanical job that will allow some hands on experience.
Where about's are you based and it might help some of us give you some pointers?
Monarch intake is shut for this year and will reopen around Feb Next year, one of the best apprenticeships you could be a part of!
If the GCSE's are no problem then I can agree with the others that hand skills are almost as important as the academics! Volunteer work with the local airfield maintenance organisation or any other engineering/mechanical job that will allow some hands on experience.
Where about's are you based and it might help some of us give you some pointers?
Monarch intake is shut for this year and will reopen around Feb Next year, one of the best apprenticeships you could be a part of!
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I certainly wouldn't recommend the forces route, the army even less so. The training is poor now (bare minimum standards) and almost everyone I talk to now can't wait to leave.
Find a good civilian apprenticeship and stick with it. I'd also recommend avoiding any start-up companies that offer apprenticeships. I've seen a few first hand, and they tend to be unstructured, poorly tutored, and quickly die when the company gets into money problems.
Aim for the most prestigious schemes, and see what turns up.
One of our apprentices left two months ago after witnessing how poorly our workforce was treated during farcical redundancies last year. That, on top of the atroscious 'training' led her to leave aviation completely and win a proper apprenticeship at Jaguar/Landrover. Would Lizzie consider a growing industry over aircraft?
Find a good civilian apprenticeship and stick with it. I'd also recommend avoiding any start-up companies that offer apprenticeships. I've seen a few first hand, and they tend to be unstructured, poorly tutored, and quickly die when the company gets into money problems.
Aim for the most prestigious schemes, and see what turns up.
One of our apprentices left two months ago after witnessing how poorly our workforce was treated during farcical redundancies last year. That, on top of the atroscious 'training' led her to leave aviation completely and win a proper apprenticeship at Jaguar/Landrover. Would Lizzie consider a growing industry over aircraft?
Has she been down to a local airfield to see a maintenance company? What does she think of cold wet weather, working outdoors? A few other things to think about. Avionics used to be the big money game don't know if it still is, my tools have been confined to household DIY for some years now.
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Here in Australia we have pre-apprenticeship/pre-vocational courses offered at TAFE (tech colleges), which amounts to a Cert II (the apprenticeship is a Cert IV, a non-type rated license is a Diploma). So basically, the pre-apprenticeship means that you sit roughly half the theory subjects needed to complete the apprenticeship, get hands on experience on the college's aircraft and get access to the industry, as company representatives will actually approach the college to get an idea of who they want to recruit for their next intake.
If such a system exists in the UK, I'd say definitely get your daughter into one of those. Something like this might be what she needs to do.
Best of luck to her!
Cheers,
John
If such a system exists in the UK, I'd say definitely get your daughter into one of those. Something like this might be what she needs to do.
Best of luck to her!
Cheers,
John
Link to some additional info regarding apprenticeships. BAE Systems also offer an apprentice scheme.
Careers in Aerospace Training & Apprenticeships
Good luck
Careers in Aerospace Training & Apprenticeships
Good luck
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Many thanks for all the info.
The current state of play:
- she's chatted to the RAF at the careers office (and not been put off!),
- she has an interview with a local college for a Level 3 Diploma in Aerospace Eng
- she's been pinging off CVs, letters and phone calls to the likes of Britten-Norman, Bristows etc
- she's blogging, photographing and documenting a couple of projects (inc building an electric bike (entirely from scratch).
A Level results day tomorrow - and she'll need to make a decision as to whether to take up her place at university or not. I suspect she won't. A pity she hadn't had this change of direction 6 months ago (and got an apprenticeship lined up) - or, better, two years ago (and done something more relevant than RE at A Level)!
Once again, thanks for help. I'll update where this goes (or whether it peters out) - I dislike forum questions that are left unresolved).
The current state of play:
- she's chatted to the RAF at the careers office (and not been put off!),
- she has an interview with a local college for a Level 3 Diploma in Aerospace Eng
- she's been pinging off CVs, letters and phone calls to the likes of Britten-Norman, Bristows etc
- she's blogging, photographing and documenting a couple of projects (inc building an electric bike (entirely from scratch).
A Level results day tomorrow - and she'll need to make a decision as to whether to take up her place at university or not. I suspect she won't. A pity she hadn't had this change of direction 6 months ago (and got an apprenticeship lined up) - or, better, two years ago (and done something more relevant than RE at A Level)!
Once again, thanks for help. I'll update where this goes (or whether it peters out) - I dislike forum questions that are left unresolved).
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Flybe had a good apprentice scheme last time I looked.
4 years, which included a Basic Training Certificate AND the required work experience to apply for a Cat B licence, AND an option to study for a year to get a Foundation Degree from Kingston University.
OK, the Degree element was to secure HE funding as well as FE funding for the course, but none the worse for that.
Even if Flybe were unable to offer a Cat B job at the end of it (unlikely, it is "guaranteed"), she would have a Part 66 Cat G licence in her hand.
More information
4 years, which included a Basic Training Certificate AND the required work experience to apply for a Cat B licence, AND an option to study for a year to get a Foundation Degree from Kingston University.
OK, the Degree element was to secure HE funding as well as FE funding for the course, but none the worse for that.
Even if Flybe were unable to offer a Cat B job at the end of it (unlikely, it is "guaranteed"), she would have a Part 66 Cat G licence in her hand.
More information
