Gash or by the book?
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Pilots' Pal
Joined: Nov 1998
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From: USA
Gash or by the book?
Would you rather have a reputation as a gash, "pen-it-off" and ignore the regulations certifier; or could you live with being a (for the most part!) a "by-the-book" certifying aircraft maintenance engineer?
Joined: Aug 2004
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From: WSSS
By the book
Depends on the nature of the defect. When faced with a lot transits one can get a little flexible. Experience does come into play here but we are here because we know when to say NO! An analogy I have heard many a times...don't cut into my drinking time...but then these words are spoken by people who are are there for a long time. I would say that I am more of a by the book type. Cheers
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From: The Daylight Saving Free Zone
When you are young and "invincible" it is very easy to feel like you can pen things off (the nature of your company can instill those thoughts in ones brain for comercial reasons).
But dont ever compromise saftey...... How? .... Use 'the book' and throw its contents at those who try to influence you to do otherwise. It sure beats the hell out of 'the book' being thrown at you in a court of law.
By the book for me. You're covered.
But dont ever compromise saftey...... How? .... Use 'the book' and throw its contents at those who try to influence you to do otherwise. It sure beats the hell out of 'the book' being thrown at you in a court of law.
By the book for me. You're covered.
Thread Starter
Pilots' Pal
Joined: Nov 1998
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From: USA
I'm glad there are a few who think like me! In the past, I've been criticised for not being "flexible" enough. However, during spells in QA, I've investigated incidents involving excessive flexibility and realise the effects.
I'm not suggesting one should blindly follow an incorrect procedure; highlight the problem and pass it up the chain of support to get it changed.
I'm not suggesting one should blindly follow an incorrect procedure; highlight the problem and pass it up the chain of support to get it changed.
Cunning Artificer
Joined: Jun 2001
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From: The spiritual home of DeHavilland
In these days of EASA Part 145 organizations there is nearly always a department whose job is to draft an EO, or similar document, to cover deviations from the book. Unfortunately, the pressure that used to be applied to the certifiers is moving to those who draft EOs. For the most part these guys are professional enough to refuse to cooperate in penning-off defects, but one day someone is bound to slip up...
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: East Sussex
Nice to see the responses from Licensed Aircraft Engineers who think and feel the same way as I do. As a manager I have always told staff that if they delay an aircraft because they are not satisfied with its serviceabilty and they can justify their actions I will back them every time. This is not a glib statement, it is a fact.
Once you start down the slippery slope of 'pen it off; or 'it'll do a trip' you have crossed the line and your personal standards drop. I always remember, it is my Licence that I worked damned hard and long to get and it is up to me to safeguard my Licence.
Once you get a reputation as a 'pen off' merchant the name sticks and we should avoid employing such people. There will be precious few Licensed Aircraft Engineers to go around in the future as it is so we had better make sure that those that do exist are up for the job and maintain the required high standards.
Temps the Technician
Once you start down the slippery slope of 'pen it off; or 'it'll do a trip' you have crossed the line and your personal standards drop. I always remember, it is my Licence that I worked damned hard and long to get and it is up to me to safeguard my Licence.
Once you get a reputation as a 'pen off' merchant the name sticks and we should avoid employing such people. There will be precious few Licensed Aircraft Engineers to go around in the future as it is so we had better make sure that those that do exist are up for the job and maintain the required high standards.
Temps the Technician
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: Sweden
So what happens when the book is wrong, and don't tell me they never are I have worked with a few.
Do you 1) Ignore it and do according your own experience 2) Refuse to do the job, due missing/incorrect documentation.
Books are a wonderful tool, in the right hands, in the inexperienced hands they are bloody misleading and dangerous.
Brgds
Doc
Do you 1) Ignore it and do according your own experience 2) Refuse to do the job, due missing/incorrect documentation.
Books are a wonderful tool, in the right hands, in the inexperienced hands they are bloody misleading and dangerous.
Brgds
Doc
Moderator
Joined: Feb 2000
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From: UK
You get authorisation to change the book, any organisation worth it's salt should have some mechanism to do this.
After all, "the book" is there to record best practice, and that's not necessarily a fixed quantity.
G
After all, "the book" is there to record best practice, and that's not necessarily a fixed quantity.
G
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: East Sussex
Genghis,
I agree with your statement. If the book isn't right, tell the OEM and get it changed. The book is the bench mark. Deviate from written and accepted practices at your peril.
Temps
I agree with your statement. If the book isn't right, tell the OEM and get it changed. The book is the bench mark. Deviate from written and accepted practices at your peril.
Temps
Joined: Dec 2004
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From: EGNH
By the book for the most part, there were times when a little deviation was tolerated, but not anymore. By the book is our protection, management may ask you to bend the rules, but would stand a long way back when you are being hauled over the coals.
On the subject of changing the book when we know it to be wrong, yes, we have done where I work.
On the subject of changing the book when we know it to be wrong, yes, we have done where I work.
Joined: Oct 2001
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From: East Sussex
Thanks smudge,
Shame you had to spoil the response with a 'dig'. I have already admitted in this thread that I was a manager (which you knew already, but you have the advantage of hiding behind a nickname) and by nature of this fact I don't certify anymore. I was in fact relating to Genghis who signs himself as Genghis the Engineer and in a jocular fashion I signed myself as Tempsford the Technician.
Temps
Shame you had to spoil the response with a 'dig'. I have already admitted in this thread that I was a manager (which you knew already, but you have the advantage of hiding behind a nickname) and by nature of this fact I don't certify anymore. I was in fact relating to Genghis who signs himself as Genghis the Engineer and in a jocular fashion I signed myself as Tempsford the Technician.
Temps
Last edited by Tempsford; 22nd December 2004 at 20:21.
