Virgin launches advertising salvo against Qantas re: JT
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Virgin launches advertising salvo against Qantas re: JT
Will things get nastier between DJ and QF? To me this is a very clever piece of advertising, which is in all national papers today. But I'm guessing that QF won't be too pleased about it.
It also reflects a body of opinion that has been all too obvious here...
* * *
John Travolta, says Qantas, is great.
He's a better actor than we thought.
At Virgin we have VIPs on our planes everyday. They're our guests and our team of over 2000 staff. And while Qantas employs ageing movie stars to fly their old aircraft, Virgin Blue employs experienced pilots to fly the youngest fleet of aircraft in our skies. When you fly Virgin Blue you're paying for friendly Australian service, we don't ask you to pay for a Hollywood endorsement.
Thank you for supporting the airline that supports Australians.
It also reflects a body of opinion that has been all too obvious here...
* * *
John Travolta, says Qantas, is great.
He's a better actor than we thought.
At Virgin we have VIPs on our planes everyday. They're our guests and our team of over 2000 staff. And while Qantas employs ageing movie stars to fly their old aircraft, Virgin Blue employs experienced pilots to fly the youngest fleet of aircraft in our skies. When you fly Virgin Blue you're paying for friendly Australian service, we don't ask you to pay for a Hollywood endorsement.
Thank you for supporting the airline that supports Australians.
Smacks of childish jealousy to me. Qantas return to the limelight with what is frankly a pretty clever campaign and DJ get all huffy. Veeeery bitchy - handbags at twenty paces girls!!! 
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The brilliant over paid guru that wasted Virgins dollars with that pathetic salvo of immature nah nah nah nah nah's has done nothing but make vb look like a pack of children.
I believe in competition, but to resort to direct rudeness - ie disrespecting an individual that vb would give a right arm for to have on THEIR side and then try to make what you have sound better ( experienced pilots - inferring that theirs are more exp than QF drivers ) compared with a proven track record of decades of safety and professionalism is really holding on with a thin grip - reminds me of schoolyard days when some kid didn't have a comeback and so just came up with something that made them look even more pathetic !!! Its a shame to see aviation be brought to this level by those who dont even like flying.
Come on VB - u can do better than that...
Anyone in the public with a sprinkle of a brain cell will see this for what it is....
Put the claws away girls !!!
I believe in competition, but to resort to direct rudeness - ie disrespecting an individual that vb would give a right arm for to have on THEIR side and then try to make what you have sound better ( experienced pilots - inferring that theirs are more exp than QF drivers ) compared with a proven track record of decades of safety and professionalism is really holding on with a thin grip - reminds me of schoolyard days when some kid didn't have a comeback and so just came up with something that made them look even more pathetic !!! Its a shame to see aviation be brought to this level by those who dont even like flying.
Come on VB - u can do better than that...
Anyone in the public with a sprinkle of a brain cell will see this for what it is....
Put the claws away girls !!!
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Good on you QF. It is an advertising masterpiece. To see that beautiful 707 in the old colours visiting places all around the world money could not buy that type of advertising. Typical DJ sour grapes. Just accept it guys QF will keep up the pressure.
Z Force
Too true.I think they should be very careful on the issue of pilot training.
Before VB came to this country the 737 conversion was about two months long,prior to the commencement of line training.The conversion was done in house,with company procedures etc,in infrastructure heavily invested in this country.
VB and CASA have enabled young VB pilots to pay for a 10 day wonder course,in the USA,weened on 737 procedures at best described as being similar to VBs.The 10 day course includes ground school!
I think it is very resourceful of Virgin to keep their training costs to zilch,to win over CASA in permitting such contrasts in training between it and QF,but if a clever reporter got hold of it?Especially drawing on the recent Darwin incident,posing hypotheticals such as F/O inexperience in relation to cockpit gradient,delving into VBs CRM culture and tying it altogether with a final reference to the 10 day conversion in comparison to AN/QFs 737 training.
Virgin is resourcful,but QF is slick-especially their advertising,political pull and skulduggery.
What worked in the UK,anti-BA in the media and as a motivator for staff,may not be appreciated in this country.
Too true.I think they should be very careful on the issue of pilot training.
Before VB came to this country the 737 conversion was about two months long,prior to the commencement of line training.The conversion was done in house,with company procedures etc,in infrastructure heavily invested in this country.
VB and CASA have enabled young VB pilots to pay for a 10 day wonder course,in the USA,weened on 737 procedures at best described as being similar to VBs.The 10 day course includes ground school!
I think it is very resourceful of Virgin to keep their training costs to zilch,to win over CASA in permitting such contrasts in training between it and QF,but if a clever reporter got hold of it?Especially drawing on the recent Darwin incident,posing hypotheticals such as F/O inexperience in relation to cockpit gradient,delving into VBs CRM culture and tying it altogether with a final reference to the 10 day conversion in comparison to AN/QFs 737 training.
Virgin is resourcful,but QF is slick-especially their advertising,political pull and skulduggery.
What worked in the UK,anti-BA in the media and as a motivator for staff,may not be appreciated in this country.
Last edited by Gnadenburg; 13th Jul 2002 at 01:17.
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Don't want to re-hash old news, but just wanted to rimind z-force that VB aren't the only Oz Airline to have over-run a tad in recent times............fore..........
Amazing how things change for the worse in aviation over time. QF and AN may not have liked each other but there was always a professional relationship between the 2 that meant that petty gutter tactics like this never came up. Except for a fanatical few staff, not many QF nor AN staff said a nasty thing about the opposition in public, can you say the same between DJ and QF, and can you blame them!
Thats because there was shameful and virtually identical airfares between Qantas and Ansett (the "C" word). How else could two airlines with completely different cost structures co-exist? It wasn't until Impulse and Virgin came along that the whole house of cards came tumbling down for the inefficient Ansett.
The 707 looks excellent. Great PR. As is the Longreach museum. Good to see. The Virgin ad was a chuckle, great PR too! All lighthearted and nothing to get all anal about. A bit like the British Airways Millenium Eye in London which they had initial trouble lifting into place. Virgin quickly flew a balloon over the site draping a banner reading "BA can't get it up". All good for a laugh!
Z Force, reckon you might you need to think carefully about hassling Virgin about overrunning runways, particularly if you are using Qantas as a datum!
It's all good for the industry. Just as Travolta wanted, the industry needs to be view in a lighthearted manner instead of the grimness which has surrounded it over the last year.
The 707 looks excellent. Great PR. As is the Longreach museum. Good to see. The Virgin ad was a chuckle, great PR too! All lighthearted and nothing to get all anal about. A bit like the British Airways Millenium Eye in London which they had initial trouble lifting into place. Virgin quickly flew a balloon over the site draping a banner reading "BA can't get it up". All good for a laugh!
Z Force, reckon you might you need to think carefully about hassling Virgin about overrunning runways, particularly if you are using Qantas as a datum!
It's all good for the industry. Just as Travolta wanted, the industry needs to be view in a lighthearted manner instead of the grimness which has surrounded it over the last year.
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Al - point taken but the fact stands.
At the time of the Virgin Blue overrun the weather was blue sky with little wind!
At least with QF the weather was the typical crappy rain we always get in HK or BKK.
Read my post about the CASA report into the VB overrun.
It's one thing to cut costs of fares but when safety corners are cut ( in a woefully lacking CRM program and the total lack of a Flight Operations Quality Assurance program with its associated safety benefits)....then thats another thing.
Besides........the ACCC what a joke!
These clowns want competition but when fares are similar they whinge.
How else is there to be competition if you cant match fares and in doing so bring them down from time to time.
Judging by an article in the Asian Wall St Journal industry and the federal govt are seriously rethinking the role of the ACCC.
At the time of the Virgin Blue overrun the weather was blue sky with little wind!
At least with QF the weather was the typical crappy rain we always get in HK or BKK.
Read my post about the CASA report into the VB overrun.
It's one thing to cut costs of fares but when safety corners are cut ( in a woefully lacking CRM program and the total lack of a Flight Operations Quality Assurance program with its associated safety benefits)....then thats another thing.
Besides........the ACCC what a joke!
These clowns want competition but when fares are similar they whinge.
How else is there to be competition if you cant match fares and in doing so bring them down from time to time.
Judging by an article in the Asian Wall St Journal industry and the federal govt are seriously rethinking the role of the ACCC.
Last edited by Scooter; 13th Jul 2002 at 03:15.
Scooter...read and replied to your post on the Darwin incident.
You mention above cost-cutting. That is in fact one of the reasons QANTAS crashed in BKK. The airline was insisting on lower flap settings for approaches (to reduce flap wear and thus save $$$$). Additionally, reverse thrust was not used.
Qantas tried to save money and ended up with a crashed aircraft which cost in excess of $100,000,000 to repair. So in fact the cost-cutting adversely affecting safety argument you use above actually is more applicable to the Qantas crash than the DJ incident.
Sounds as though you are right though, Virgin Blue probably need a kick up the bum for their unsophisticated CRM courses etc, but in light of history using Qantas as an example is not really appropriate.
You mention above cost-cutting. That is in fact one of the reasons QANTAS crashed in BKK. The airline was insisting on lower flap settings for approaches (to reduce flap wear and thus save $$$$). Additionally, reverse thrust was not used.
Qantas tried to save money and ended up with a crashed aircraft which cost in excess of $100,000,000 to repair. So in fact the cost-cutting adversely affecting safety argument you use above actually is more applicable to the Qantas crash than the DJ incident.
Sounds as though you are right though, Virgin Blue probably need a kick up the bum for their unsophisticated CRM courses etc, but in light of history using Qantas as an example is not really appropriate.
Evertonian
People in glass houses....
DJ are getting very close to breaking an unwritten rule of aviation advertising (by implication). Never compare your safety standards to another airline.
Regardless of what I & others think of N707JT, it's a marvellous piece of PR. How many airlines have painted their current aircraft in retro colour schemes? Lots. Now, how many have grabbed one of the "original" aircraft and repainted it as it was? One (I think!)
At the very least, it's stopped me having to listen to those bluddy kids around the world!!!
Regardless of what I & others think of N707JT, it's a marvellous piece of PR. How many airlines have painted their current aircraft in retro colour schemes? Lots. Now, how many have grabbed one of the "original" aircraft and repainted it as it was? One (I think!)
At the very least, it's stopped me having to listen to those bluddy kids around the world!!!
Nunc est bibendum
VB also cutting it a little fine comparing their 'expereinced' pilots to JT. If the rumours on PRUNE are correct then the 5000 or so hours in JT's log book would out do a lot of the DJ crews.
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There are a few differences between the Virgin over run in Darwin and the QF.
Firstly it was a beautiful night in Darwin, light winds etc, not so good in BKK.
Everybody was immediately aware of the QF over run. Hard to hide I guess. The DN over run was a little easier to hide.
It took QF quite a few more years to have their accident/incident than it did Virgin. Only one year.
Virgins behaviour in the media runs along the same lines as the cabin and maybe even the flightdeck????
ref http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=59635
Firstly it was a beautiful night in Darwin, light winds etc, not so good in BKK.
Everybody was immediately aware of the QF over run. Hard to hide I guess. The DN over run was a little easier to hide.
It took QF quite a few more years to have their accident/incident than it did Virgin. Only one year.
Virgins behaviour in the media runs along the same lines as the cabin and maybe even the flightdeck????
ref http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=59635
Last edited by airbrake42; 13th Jul 2002 at 04:19.
I suppose the Virgin Blue response to the Travolta campaign is clever, but it's a pity that their ad men didn't put a little more effort into their copy. The second sentence might be forgiven in a press release but for a large newspaper advert it's very sloppy:
"At Virgin we have VIPs on our planes everyday. They're our guests and our team of over 2000 staff".
I have already gone on record praising Qantas for an inspired campaign but I see a small flaw emerging. If JT is going to continue showing off the interior of the 707 to the media (and why wouldn't he - it's gorgeous) the "customers" are going to expect that sort of luxury on all QF flights. I am reminded that I was working in reservations about the time that the 747s went into service and I was asked by one little old lady: "Do I have to bring my own towel for the shower on the 747?"
I still think it's a brilliant campaign.
"At Virgin we have VIPs on our planes everyday. They're our guests and our team of over 2000 staff".
I have already gone on record praising Qantas for an inspired campaign but I see a small flaw emerging. If JT is going to continue showing off the interior of the 707 to the media (and why wouldn't he - it's gorgeous) the "customers" are going to expect that sort of luxury on all QF flights. I am reminded that I was working in reservations about the time that the 747s went into service and I was asked by one little old lady: "Do I have to bring my own towel for the shower on the 747?"
I still think it's a brilliant campaign.
Bottums Up
My sixpenneth worth.
Whilst I find Travolta's gushings sickly sweet, I recognise the concept is good for Qantas if looked at in the context of the world market, particularly the US market.
VB's response in this morning's paper is quite clever an cheeky.
I don't think either campagn should be seen as anything other than publicity for the appropriate airline. Nor do I think either airline is 'having a go' at the other.
VB's response in this morning's paper is quite clever an cheeky.
I don't think either campagn should be seen as anything other than publicity for the appropriate airline. Nor do I think either airline is 'having a go' at the other.
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Why use John Travolta in the first place?
Qantas dumped those ever so ugly, expensive, slow and out of date machines and now because one is owned by a "superstar" suddenly everyone wants a piece of the action.
John Travolta owns a 707!
WOW!!! I want to fly QANTAS!!!
HARDLY!
Qantas dumped those ever so ugly, expensive, slow and out of date machines and now because one is owned by a "superstar" suddenly everyone wants a piece of the action.
John Travolta owns a 707!
WOW!!! I want to fly QANTAS!!!
HARDLY!
Bottums Up
hmm,
I don't think it's a case of
rather the publicity keeps Qantas in the consciousness of the public so that hopefully the first, or perhaps only, airline the potential pax thinks of is .......
I don't think it's a case of
John Travolta owns a 707!
WOW!!! I want to fly QANTAS!!!
WOW!!! I want to fly QANTAS!!!
