DJ PILOTS vs QF PILOTS
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Join Date: May 2002
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DJ PILOTS vs QF PILOTS
Lets call a spade a spade here. The majority of all DJ pilots could never get into a real airline as the majors wouldn't touch them, so therefore they BUY a job and accept poor pay and conditions, thereby lowering the standard of Australian Airlines.
Now QF Management are putting the pressure on because they see a DJ pilot who was doomed to GA for whatever reason is doing the same job for much less. And ofocarse the DJ crew are happy with poor pay and conditions for flying a jet becuase by buying a job it was their only chance to fly one.
Well done.
Now QF Management are putting the pressure on because they see a DJ pilot who was doomed to GA for whatever reason is doing the same job for much less. And ofocarse the DJ crew are happy with poor pay and conditions for flying a jet becuase by buying a job it was their only chance to fly one.
Well done.
Nunc est bibendum
Geez, I fly for QF and even I think thats a load of crap.
Yes QF pilots are now under more pressure than we would like to WRT pay and conditions be but to relate that to skill level? What the?
I'm dissappointed that the VB crew are paid so poorly (world standard) but there you go. I don't think it is anything to do with skill level though.
The interesting bit will be if anyone used VB as a 'stepping stone' to QF. Better pay and conditions in the longer term if you can handle the back seat for a couple of years. I guess that is the reason that VB make their crews pay for the endorsement. Takes a long time to pay it off and may stop you from looking elsewhere!
Yes QF pilots are now under more pressure than we would like to WRT pay and conditions be but to relate that to skill level? What the?
I'm dissappointed that the VB crew are paid so poorly (world standard) but there you go. I don't think it is anything to do with skill level though.
The interesting bit will be if anyone used VB as a 'stepping stone' to QF. Better pay and conditions in the longer term if you can handle the back seat for a couple of years. I guess that is the reason that VB make their crews pay for the endorsement. Takes a long time to pay it off and may stop you from looking elsewhere!
Join Date: Apr 2002
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If you think that a second officer who joins QF with 500 hrs total time and a MECIR with no ( absolutely no ) twin experience, and with absolutley no multi crew experience, and with pimples, and with a daddy in the big airline and with the ability to pass the famed QF psyche test then yes QF have got it right in their recruitment process. They seem to rather take more of the lesser plebs that the bigger fish from G.A. Now i wonder if you took a survey of new recruits into QF and asked them how much money they spent on trying to get into QF you would be quite surprised. Alot of guys and front bums have spent a considerable amount of money on interview technique courses etc and why do you think this is so?
Is it that they are just as i had described them before, totally inexperienced pilots who don't even know how to wipe their own arse without any training.
I think its a farce that QF lets such inexperienced little pilots into such a major airline and then mixes them with the highly experienced moguls in the left and right hand seat. But then maybe you are sorry that it will take the better part of your carreer to get into the left hand seat of a 737 with QF let alone the left seat of a 744. God help you when QF start recruiting direct entry contract captains and first officers to Aussie airlines instead of keeping the initial few QF mainline pilots on. Have you thought for a second about this or are you just a little man with a big chip on his shoulder now that you are flying the rat?
While you bag the guys who pay $20k + for their 737 ratings ( and get it paid back to them after a period of time ) you are probably not aware that if you get yourself a P1 rating with the rat and then leave withing a certain time frame after the endorsement you will be paying alot more for the privelage that the boys at DJ!
Remember this is discount airline you are talking about, operating in a country that has never seen this in its little aviation life, the only reason the pilots pay for the endorsement is to keep training costs down, keep an eye on them over the next few years from your back seat in the cockpit and wonder how it would have felt if you had of gotten that opportunity to invest in your future.
They are probably looking out of their cockpit windows at you thinking i am sooo lucky i didn't end up a second officer flying the rat for so many years to command.
Or finally maybe you are just p1ssed off that they had the money to pay for it and you didn't coz your training salary was just a little more than what they paid for their endorsements!
You small minded individual
Is it that they are just as i had described them before, totally inexperienced pilots who don't even know how to wipe their own arse without any training.
I think its a farce that QF lets such inexperienced little pilots into such a major airline and then mixes them with the highly experienced moguls in the left and right hand seat. But then maybe you are sorry that it will take the better part of your carreer to get into the left hand seat of a 737 with QF let alone the left seat of a 744. God help you when QF start recruiting direct entry contract captains and first officers to Aussie airlines instead of keeping the initial few QF mainline pilots on. Have you thought for a second about this or are you just a little man with a big chip on his shoulder now that you are flying the rat?
While you bag the guys who pay $20k + for their 737 ratings ( and get it paid back to them after a period of time ) you are probably not aware that if you get yourself a P1 rating with the rat and then leave withing a certain time frame after the endorsement you will be paying alot more for the privelage that the boys at DJ!
Remember this is discount airline you are talking about, operating in a country that has never seen this in its little aviation life, the only reason the pilots pay for the endorsement is to keep training costs down, keep an eye on them over the next few years from your back seat in the cockpit and wonder how it would have felt if you had of gotten that opportunity to invest in your future.
They are probably looking out of their cockpit windows at you thinking i am sooo lucky i didn't end up a second officer flying the rat for so many years to command.
Or finally maybe you are just p1ssed off that they had the money to pay for it and you didn't coz your training salary was just a little more than what they paid for their endorsements!
You small minded individual
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Wafella, can we also call a dipstick a dipstick-
As a QF driver, even I know that the majority of DJ drivers are top shelf. (and there is no doubt their FA's are better on the eyes too.)
If you have never paid for any endorsement, be it GA single or light twin or 737 to get into 'flying' then you are either a dreamer or a pretender. Live and let live.
As a QF driver, even I know that the majority of DJ drivers are top shelf. (and there is no doubt their FA's are better on the eyes too.)
If you have never paid for any endorsement, be it GA single or light twin or 737 to get into 'flying' then you are either a dreamer or a pretender. Live and let live.
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Hvy 18 Wheeler, you obviously have no idea of what you're talking about, living in pixieland are we !!!.
The pimply pilots you refer too, are in the minority in Qantas. The majority of pilots employed by Q over the last 2 years have had alot of previous experience, many with regional, military and other airline experience.
Having flown with many of the low time pilots that you denigrated in your post, I can say this. Qantas got there recruiting right, these pilots are a pleasure to fly with, they are motivated, intelligent and for someone with very low time, they operate the aircraft to a very good standard. Maybe something you could aspire too!
The pimply pilots you refer too, are in the minority in Qantas. The majority of pilots employed by Q over the last 2 years have had alot of previous experience, many with regional, military and other airline experience.
Having flown with many of the low time pilots that you denigrated in your post, I can say this. Qantas got there recruiting right, these pilots are a pleasure to fly with, they are motivated, intelligent and for someone with very low time, they operate the aircraft to a very good standard. Maybe something you could aspire too!
Grandpa Aerotart
Gee Wafella, your last vitriolic post on VB lasted about an hour before it dissappeared...wonder how long this will last?
No-one with the skills and maturity to have made it to any seat in a jet could post such a baseless, childish, moronic post...so that makes you one hell of a loser.
I have quite a lot of friends at DJ....some are 89ers....I'll give you a hint Wafella, I've yet to meet an 89er that wasn't a good pilot and who didn't have a very refined idea of what fairness, honesty and integrity mean...oh sorry, do you have a dictionary to look up those words?
The ones I know who aren't 89ers are go getters...motivated to get ahead without stepping on other people to get their.
Quite a few are ex NJS, Sunstate, Eastern, Ansett (pre 89 and post 93) so your assertion that they couldn't get 'real' airline jobs is just BS.
Guess what ********? It was THEIR decision to buy an endorsement to give their careers a boost in the right direction. They pay for it up front..but get it reimbursed within 2 years...is that buying a job?...I don't think so! I think it's a great way to avoid being bonded for 3 years.
Bottom line Wafella? The DJ guys and girls are making a success of their careers...many will stay with DJ because they like it...some will take their experience overseas and make big bucks later
While you wallow in self rightious bitterness...in some non aviation job because you don't have what it takes.
Chuck.
No-one with the skills and maturity to have made it to any seat in a jet could post such a baseless, childish, moronic post...so that makes you one hell of a loser.
I have quite a lot of friends at DJ....some are 89ers....I'll give you a hint Wafella, I've yet to meet an 89er that wasn't a good pilot and who didn't have a very refined idea of what fairness, honesty and integrity mean...oh sorry, do you have a dictionary to look up those words?
The ones I know who aren't 89ers are go getters...motivated to get ahead without stepping on other people to get their.
Quite a few are ex NJS, Sunstate, Eastern, Ansett (pre 89 and post 93) so your assertion that they couldn't get 'real' airline jobs is just BS.
Guess what ********? It was THEIR decision to buy an endorsement to give their careers a boost in the right direction. They pay for it up front..but get it reimbursed within 2 years...is that buying a job?...I don't think so! I think it's a great way to avoid being bonded for 3 years.
Bottom line Wafella? The DJ guys and girls are making a success of their careers...many will stay with DJ because they like it...some will take their experience overseas and make big bucks later
While you wallow in self rightious bitterness...in some non aviation job because you don't have what it takes.
Chuck.
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wafella
I sent your last post into the ether rather than binning you, because I was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt and in the hope that you would learn some manners by watching the vigourous but for the most part rational debate that takes place between the professionals from DJ and QF on this and other matters.
Gratuitous insults such as your posts do not add to the Forum beyond reminding us all that there continue to be a continuous supply of candidates for the Darwin Awards.
I am going to leave this one running in the hope that the real professionals from all the real airlines, including DJ (now Australias second airline and no, I dont work for either or any of them), that haunt these halls, may show you how to adjust your attitude, at least sufficiently for you to be allowed to continue to play with the big kids.
Like everything in life, it's up to you.
Good Luck!
Woomera
I sent your last post into the ether rather than binning you, because I was prepared to give you the benefit of the doubt and in the hope that you would learn some manners by watching the vigourous but for the most part rational debate that takes place between the professionals from DJ and QF on this and other matters.
Gratuitous insults such as your posts do not add to the Forum beyond reminding us all that there continue to be a continuous supply of candidates for the Darwin Awards.
I am going to leave this one running in the hope that the real professionals from all the real airlines, including DJ (now Australias second airline and no, I dont work for either or any of them), that haunt these halls, may show you how to adjust your attitude, at least sufficiently for you to be allowed to continue to play with the big kids.
Like everything in life, it's up to you.
Good Luck!
Woomera
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Whatever this turkey's (wafella) motive's are, brings me to the conlcusion that the "wankiness in aviation" still exists in 2002. He/she is just trying to open up a can of worms amongst us & make a name for themselves in the process. One can only assume that THIS person is the sort of PROUD monkey that wears their uniform into a Westfield food court.
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I don't work for either company, nor do I fly, but who gives you the right wafella to judge the capabilities and experience of VB pilots or any other pilot for that matter? I don't remember reading the press release stating you as the new almighty!
Was your application to 'purchase' a job rejected?
Was your application to 'purchase' a job rejected?
