New PC, just which one?
Sub Judice Angel Lovegod
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Danny
Thank you for your apology
I think that Flitestar and ProPlan will do well as examples of the "specialist software" I am describing.
Certainly most of the products of my own companies, which are specialist in the arts and entertainment business are designed for Windows. If we are asked to deliver on Macs, we propose Citrix (as we need a SQL Server core anyway, so we may as well use TS as well.) We have tested on Mac PC emulators and they work provided the underlying Mac has enough umph, but we don't support the environment because it introduces another layer of complexity if diagnosis is required. (Incidentally, we also don't support W95, 98 or ME, even though the software works on them, because they are crap.)
We lose very few sales through not supporting Macs. We lose more through not supporting W9x.
I think that what you maybe missed in my earlier post was that if you don't need any specialist software, I agree with you that a Mac is preferable to a PC. I reckon that LINUX is probably better as well...more stable than both PC and Mac...but suffers an even greater shortage of native software.
W
Thank you for your apology
I think that Flitestar and ProPlan will do well as examples of the "specialist software" I am describing.
Certainly most of the products of my own companies, which are specialist in the arts and entertainment business are designed for Windows. If we are asked to deliver on Macs, we propose Citrix (as we need a SQL Server core anyway, so we may as well use TS as well.) We have tested on Mac PC emulators and they work provided the underlying Mac has enough umph, but we don't support the environment because it introduces another layer of complexity if diagnosis is required. (Incidentally, we also don't support W95, 98 or ME, even though the software works on them, because they are crap.)
We lose very few sales through not supporting Macs. We lose more through not supporting W9x.
I think that what you maybe missed in my earlier post was that if you don't need any specialist software, I agree with you that a Mac is preferable to a PC. I reckon that LINUX is probably better as well...more stable than both PC and Mac...but suffers an even greater shortage of native software.
W
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Some friends of mine decided to upgrade their PC from Windoze ME to XP at the end of May. Despite several visits by an 'friend who's in IT' (ahem), it's still not working...
Now, every time they visit me, they drool longingly as they play with my new 17" iMac and iPod
You see, you can spout all the techie bollox you like about PeeCees, but the Mac (especially now with OS X) has something the Wintel gang never been able to achieve - a truly beautifully thought-out user experience.
Jx
Delighted Mac user
Now, every time they visit me, they drool longingly as they play with my new 17" iMac and iPod
You see, you can spout all the techie bollox you like about PeeCees, but the Mac (especially now with OS X) has something the Wintel gang never been able to achieve - a truly beautifully thought-out user experience.
Jx
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5MB - you didn't say what you have now.....
I use a 6-year-old PIII 500 with 256Mb running a stripped-down, custom installed Windows98 (2nd).
In the past year I have set up 2 desktops and a laptop for other people - all much more powerful than mine and all running XP. All 3 run slower than my machine!
I don't do heavy graphics or movies, do surf all day, every day and do WP, spreadsheets, accounts. ADSL is the greatest go-faster gizmo around (I have an internal DSL modem and share the connection with one other machine).
Do get USB ports (you don't say how old your machine is) - they are very useful.
Make sure you have a good backup method and USE IT DAILY. Then you can recover easily from any crisis.
HP make great printers - I am on my third in 14 years and only change when the technology leaps forward. Will be buying the printer/scanner/copier thing when my ink supply runs out - I think it's £99!
Don't waste your money unless there's something you really want. PCs are upgradeable........
In the past year I have set up 2 desktops and a laptop for other people - all much more powerful than mine and all running XP. All 3 run slower than my machine!
I don't do heavy graphics or movies, do surf all day, every day and do WP, spreadsheets, accounts. ADSL is the greatest go-faster gizmo around (I have an internal DSL modem and share the connection with one other machine).
Do get USB ports (you don't say how old your machine is) - they are very useful.
Make sure you have a good backup method and USE IT DAILY. Then you can recover easily from any crisis.
HP make great printers - I am on my third in 14 years and only change when the technology leaps forward. Will be buying the printer/scanner/copier thing when my ink supply runs out - I think it's £99!
Don't waste your money unless there's something you really want. PCs are upgradeable........
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This is turning out good and getting all the techy stuff out that I was looking for.
At the moment I have a Tiny 30gig Pentium III early edition, Win98 SE with a cr@p set of graphics and sound, only 7gig left on the harddrive (mainly music and digi camera stuff) and a Broadband program to crash anything it likes. On top of this is connected a Palm (and all the software for normal ops and also MP3) and a scanner. In total I have a need for 4 (sometimes 5) USB ports, although not all at once but it would be nice not to keep going around the back to change leads. Having priced up upgrading the existing with compatable parts, it would just be as well to go get a new one and have it all there with a few more toys for the boys.
I have to say that at the moment the iMac is very tempting, but is competing against a Mesh 3000+ Athlon and Evesham Pent 4 2.8GB. I'm fortunately enjoying going shopping every weekend and having a play in all the shops I find on all different types of machine, better decide soon though, or I'll be needing a new window here too
At the moment I have a Tiny 30gig Pentium III early edition, Win98 SE with a cr@p set of graphics and sound, only 7gig left on the harddrive (mainly music and digi camera stuff) and a Broadband program to crash anything it likes. On top of this is connected a Palm (and all the software for normal ops and also MP3) and a scanner. In total I have a need for 4 (sometimes 5) USB ports, although not all at once but it would be nice not to keep going around the back to change leads. Having priced up upgrading the existing with compatable parts, it would just be as well to go get a new one and have it all there with a few more toys for the boys.
I have to say that at the moment the iMac is very tempting, but is competing against a Mesh 3000+ Athlon and Evesham Pent 4 2.8GB. I'm fortunately enjoying going shopping every weekend and having a play in all the shops I find on all different types of machine, better decide soon though, or I'll be needing a new window here too
Sub Judice Angel Lovegod
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5mb
Have you thought about getting a powered USB hub (£25) and an external USB disk (£80) and shift all your media files onto that.
Get more memory (£30) and install XP (thus overcoming instability) (£50 ?)
Remember to format the disk before you install XP (do not upgrade, but dump all your data to the external drive first.
For a total investment of £185 you will be hugely better off than now.
Just a thought.
W
Have you thought about getting a powered USB hub (£25) and an external USB disk (£80) and shift all your media files onto that.
Get more memory (£30) and install XP (thus overcoming instability) (£50 ?)
Remember to format the disk before you install XP (do not upgrade, but dump all your data to the external drive first.
For a total investment of £185 you will be hugely better off than now.
Just a thought.
W
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Fobotsco,
I've been pondering your query on the previous page and trying to think of a way to get it across when you aren't actually handling the goods so to speak
Try this analogy: Follow a couple of the links to the Apple hardware provide on this thread. Spend a few moments just looking at them and consider the thought that has gone into creating such consumer sculpture. The same intellect and care has gone into creating the operating system. The clever stuff is hidden - it's just supposed to be a consistent delight to use across all programmes.
As I mentioned before, everything a user needs is built in and pre-installed up to and including non linear video editing. If a DVD writer is specified you also get complete multimedia creation software as well.
The cost issue is a myth unless you steal high end music, video and DVD authoring software for a new PC
Consider this as well - all the PC crowd are sending down a barrage of buy this bit, buy that, it's rubbish if you don't fit such and such.
Compare and contrast with the Mac users - they don't tell you to buy any particular speed, configuration or form factor. It's none of their business and know you'll find the one that suits your pocket, location and needs.
What they are telling you is to buy the experience of using a Mac - they don't care which one because they're actually suggesting that you buy the OS in reality - the user experience.
That's why Mac folks never go back to a PC and also why not a single PC'er ever raves about the operating system - and I mean ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've been pondering your query on the previous page and trying to think of a way to get it across when you aren't actually handling the goods so to speak
Try this analogy: Follow a couple of the links to the Apple hardware provide on this thread. Spend a few moments just looking at them and consider the thought that has gone into creating such consumer sculpture. The same intellect and care has gone into creating the operating system. The clever stuff is hidden - it's just supposed to be a consistent delight to use across all programmes.
As I mentioned before, everything a user needs is built in and pre-installed up to and including non linear video editing. If a DVD writer is specified you also get complete multimedia creation software as well.
The cost issue is a myth unless you steal high end music, video and DVD authoring software for a new PC
Consider this as well - all the PC crowd are sending down a barrage of buy this bit, buy that, it's rubbish if you don't fit such and such.
Compare and contrast with the Mac users - they don't tell you to buy any particular speed, configuration or form factor. It's none of their business and know you'll find the one that suits your pocket, location and needs.
What they are telling you is to buy the experience of using a Mac - they don't care which one because they're actually suggesting that you buy the OS in reality - the user experience.
That's why Mac folks never go back to a PC and also why not a single PC'er ever raves about the operating system - and I mean ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last edited by PPRuNe Towers; 22nd Jul 2003 at 22:51.
The Oracle
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PPRuNe Towers,
You made a very good point:
It really says something about the type of user that goes for a Mac vs the type that goes for a PC.
Mac users are more inclined to look at a computer as if it were a toaster. You put in bread, out comes toast and that is all they want to know about it. (I know there are power users that want to know more and do high end functions, I am talking about the Average P.D.U.)
The average PC user goes 1) low end PC due to price or 2) they go PC since they want a little greater control of they system and flexibility of hardware for the future.
Richard
You made a very good point:
Compare and contrast with the Mac users - they don't tell you to buy any particular speed, configuration or form factor.
Mac users are more inclined to look at a computer as if it were a toaster. You put in bread, out comes toast and that is all they want to know about it. (I know there are power users that want to know more and do high end functions, I am talking about the Average P.D.U.)
The average PC user goes 1) low end PC due to price or 2) they go PC since they want a little greater control of they system and flexibility of hardware for the future.
Richard
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Thanks Towers, Richard, MrC et al. I' really benefiting from this increasingly constructive debate.
Believe it or not I'm making notes on a big piece of paper (which, according to the first law of Making Notes on Paper will turn out to be too small) and when Summer turns to Winter over that long week-end in October we call Autumn I'll make a decision.
I've decided one thing, I'll always have a PC with the masses of kit and knowledge I have. But for the Main workhorse of Maison Fobs I could just go for the Mac.... But the G5 is awfully expensive even if those big flat screens are so sexy.
My Dentist Chum has both in his surgery and chose the Mac for home. I have to trust his judgement now, don't I...?
Believe it or not I'm making notes on a big piece of paper (which, according to the first law of Making Notes on Paper will turn out to be too small) and when Summer turns to Winter over that long week-end in October we call Autumn I'll make a decision.
I've decided one thing, I'll always have a PC with the masses of kit and knowledge I have. But for the Main workhorse of Maison Fobs I could just go for the Mac.... But the G5 is awfully expensive even if those big flat screens are so sexy.
My Dentist Chum has both in his surgery and chose the Mac for home. I have to trust his judgement now, don't I...?
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fobotsco
I'm in a similar posiion to your dentist (except probably not as loaded)
I use both platforms at work, having to put up with a PeeCee running NT4 for most of the administrative part of my job - but the Mac has always been my personal choice for home (after all, it is my money).
As for the 'toaster' remark - nice analogy, not condescending in the slightest This is the kind of thing I do on my Ethernet broadband-powered G4 iMac Toaster at home:
Web and Print Graphic Design (Quark*, Illustrator FreeHand, Dreamweaver, Flash, Director etc.)
High-end Photoshop
Web development
DV editing
Audio editing
HD Music recording
MP3 Encoding
Huge macro-laden spreadsheets
PowerpPoint (eughh!)
Reading and Writing CDs/DVDs
...and it rips through the lot of 'em like a dose of the $hits!
Jx
*Cant wait to get my mitts on Quark 6 so I can finally be all-OS X
I'm in a similar posiion to your dentist (except probably not as loaded)
I use both platforms at work, having to put up with a PeeCee running NT4 for most of the administrative part of my job - but the Mac has always been my personal choice for home (after all, it is my money).
As for the 'toaster' remark - nice analogy, not condescending in the slightest
This is the kind of thing I do on my Ethernet broadband-powered G4 iMac Toaster at home:Web and Print Graphic Design (Quark*, Illustrator FreeHand, Dreamweaver, Flash, Director etc.)
High-end Photoshop
Web development
DV editing
Audio editing
HD Music recording
MP3 Encoding
Huge macro-laden spreadsheets
PowerpPoint (eughh!)
Reading and Writing CDs/DVDs
...and it rips through the lot of 'em like a dose of the $hits!
Jx
*Cant wait to get my mitts on Quark 6 so I can finally be all-OS X
The Oracle
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WeatherJinx,
Actually the Toaster idea was from a friend of mine. He is a Mac user. He owns one of the highest of the high end Home Entertainment companies in the U.S.
Visual Environments
They do all the high end home theater systems for the very affluent around the world along with the Hollywood elite.
We were talking about the some of the high end systems he was currently completed along with some of the more eccentric additions that they had to custom design. I asked him about the computer systems that he could integrate into them, and his comment was, to him a computer is nothing more than a toaster, etc.
By no means was I being condescending in the comment.
Richard
Actually the Toaster idea was from a friend of mine. He is a Mac user. He owns one of the highest of the high end Home Entertainment companies in the U.S.
Visual Environments
They do all the high end home theater systems for the very affluent around the world along with the Hollywood elite.
We were talking about the some of the high end systems he was currently completed along with some of the more eccentric additions that they had to custom design. I asked him about the computer systems that he could integrate into them, and his comment was, to him a computer is nothing more than a toaster, etc.
By no means was I being condescending in the comment.
Richard
