Bye Bye XP?

[FullOppositeRudder]

My situation will require the ongoing use of an XP computer in the office network which includes limited file exchange and printer sharing for the XP box with the rest of the system.

Given that my internet work will be done on a W7 box, is this an acceptable option for keeping the XP machine alive on the local network but shut off from the big bad online world?

Block Internet Access over Network but allow Network Access / File & Print Sharing in Windows 8 , 7 , Vista , XP | TroubleShoot Windows

Please just technical advice if you can - there is no need for your personal opinions on my circumstances and motives. I know the local requirements and this is what has to happen.

Thank you,
FOR

[cattletruck]

FOR, a good firewall and XP machines that cannot surf the net or receive uncertified software should be fine.

However, a few weeks ago I was reading a paper on how a bunch of smart hackers came to exploit a PDF file and make it launch executable code. Adobe has since patched up their PDF reader but you can bet that if something similar is discovered after XP support ends then Adobe *may* not provide an update for XP. This means that something as innocent as opening a PDF file may work ok on W7 but compromise your XP machines.

[FullOppositeRudder]

Thanks cattletruck, appreciate your comments.

Interestingly a friend of mine got "caught" about 6 months ago with a infection which somehow came with a PDF file. It was quite messy, but the local 'mixture' was able to restore order.

A good point - I'll keep it in mind. It will be a different world and I need to work with that.

Thanks again ...
FOR

[mixture]

However, a few weeks ago I was reading a paper on how a bunch of smart hackers came to exploit a PDF file and make it launch executable code.

PDF files... pah... that's for beginners.

I've seen tales of exploits hidden in innocent looking jpeg images.

Given that my internet work will be done on a W7 box, is this an acceptable option for keeping the XP machine alive on the local network but shut off from the big bad online world?

Configure the IP manually (both v4 and v6) and do not set a default gateway.

Machines on the local network will still be able to see the XP machine, but the XP machine will not be able to find its way out on to the internet.

BUT ... the ideal solution is still to rid yourself entirely for XP though, because if you get an exploit on to the XP machine, it will still be capable of infecting your local network, and thus get onto the internet indirectly.

I still have difficulty believing you have a genuine reason for running XP though .... print & file server is no excuse.... ;-)

[Saab Dastard]

Under Win7, you can run XP Mode, which is a Virtual PC running Windows XP

Yes, you can, but if it's internet connected it's just as vulnerable as any other instance of XP.

SD

[mixture]

after XP support ends then Adobe *may* not provide an update for XP

As I've said a million times before on the subject, its not a case of the third-party vendors providing updates for their products, otherwise anti-virus etc. on XP would be a viable option.

The problem is that anti-virus, Adobe and every other software package is running on top of the Operating System and are dependent on it and its APIs (developer coding interfaces).

As a result... unsupported, obsolete and vulnerable Operating System equals vulnerable software.... no matter what the software or whether its developer is still providing updates.

[le Pingouin]

FOR, the "traditional" way of doing that is to use 127.0.0.1 as the DNS - that's internal reference to the computer itself.

The problem with this approach is it just blocks address resolution and not Internet access. By using IP addresses it's possible to get in and out. Also it's not isolated from the network so if another system happens to cop a dose of something the WinXP system is vulnerable, and as has been highlighted it's still vulnerable to infected files. Obviously those are a smaller risk than actively taking it online, but it's a risk none the less.

[cattletruck]

Much to mixture's chagrin, I plan on running my XP machine until it dies.

Now before the ever so helpful and knowledgeable 'mix' gets all riled up please let me explain. I purchased this ASUS EeePC some 5 years ago with the intention of it being a sacrificial net surfing machine. The computer is not powerful so I had to turn off many Windows services to make it run to my liking. I do not run virus protection software although I have occasionally installed a free version when my suspicions were aroused only to find nothing, then I uninstall it. I only use the windows firewall that came with XP for internet protection. I do not install Windows updates.

Other than Windows XP the little NetBook also runs FireFox 26, Office 2003, VLC, Quicktime, Photoshop (old version), vim, Winzip, Cygwin and Kyodai Mahjongg - that's quite a punch for a little tacker - and they all work well enough to be useable.

I have recently setup another W7 laptop to become this one's replacement should it eventually croak. After 5 years and many net hours of use, the little EeePC is showing some physical signs of stress. The power supply plug has been replaced 3 times. The batteries are almost unusable and confusing the run-on-battery mode OS feature. Sometimes I can even hear faint electrical arcing noises emanating from the back.

But I will persist with it dammit....until its very last CPU cycle regardless of what those Microsoft people say.

[mixture]

I do not run virus protection software..
I do not install Windows updates.

I trust you are merely pulley my leg, because that sort of computing is incredibly reckless and you have been very, very,very,very lucky to not have been caught out by your utter contempt in more ways than one (i.e not only talking about viruses here, but the overall benefits that come with installing windows updates).

[cattletruck]

I wouldn't say I was lucky, nor reckless, I guess the good outcome is more a reflection of the kind of internet activity I choose to engage with. I should have also added that I did reconfigure that internet firewall to be extremely strict. The only thing of value on this laptop is the time invested in setting it up.

I recall many years ago working at a big Swedish multinational telco when one of their retarded employees who wanted my job told me about a new super duper flight simulator to download. It was in RAR format which immediately raised my suspicions. He even downloaded it onto my work computer but he chose not to install it even though he was talking up its amazing appeal. See where this was going? I put the file on a usb key and stored it for posterity. 4 years later I decided to run a virus check on the RAR file and sure enough, just as I suspected there was a half recognised virus in it.

There are plenty of internet sites that invest a lot of time and effort to help you stay out of the dark side on the internet, use them and a lot of your net experience will be worry free.

[mixture]

As I said, updates in particular are not always to do with security related matters.

Anyway, I'm not being drawn into this one, so I'm not commenting any further other than to say your style of computing is very much questionable and not an example for others to follow.

One day it'll come bite you in the backside, don't come here looking for tea and sympathy.

[Pelikal]

Just curious, does anyone know what XP 'stands for'?

[mixture]

According to the press release way back in 2001....

The XP name is short for "experience," symbolizing the rich and extended user experiences Windows and Office can offer by embracing Web services that span a broad range of devices.

[henry_crun]

I thought it was originally to be called Windows 2000 but the code name was so good they kept it...

...around the same time the 586 became the Pentium. We were hoping the next in the series would be called Hex, but Terry Pratchett got there first.

[cattletruck]

Anyway, I'm not being drawn into this one, so I'm not commenting any further other than to say your style of computing is very much questionable and not an example for others to follow.

Well said. What I do here, which is motivated by dirt cheap computing and getting the biggest bang for your buck won't work for everyone. I am computer literate and can smash 'em and fix 'em anytime I like, well most of the time.

[FullOppositeRudder]

Thus spake Mixture:

I still have difficulty believing you have a genuine reason for running XP though .... print & file server is no excuse.... ;-)

It probably seems that way. However there is a reason - it's to do with space in the domestic office. The only physical option for my Canonscan 9000F is where it is. The only computer which can drive it in that location is the one at the amateur radio desk on the other side of the room. It presently runs on XP under which regime it operates the scanner.

Next month it will be a dual boot linux mint machine for the online AR requirements. But XP is still needed to operate the scanner and also for a very few quite specific offline AR requirements which W7 could not accommodate if it were to be installed.

Scanned files need almost always to be fed back to the (wired) local network printer which is connected to the new W7 machine at the main desk.

There is one other XP computer which has six years of emails on it (this one actually). They ain't being copied to the new W7 box which is getting a clean install of T'bird and Firefox. Only the AD book and the bookmarks are being imported to what will become the primary online desktop - running usually 15 hours a day. I still need access to those older emails from the older XP box from time to time - with facilities to produce hard copy. That machine also needs to be available to the local network, but nothing beyond that.

There might be other ways of doing this, but that's what the domestic situation will stand and I need to work with that. (I can't cook)

Apologies for the complexity, I can work with it, indeed I have to. And thank you for your helpful comments.

Rgds

FOR

[mixture]

However there is a reason - it's to do with space in the domestic office.

Huh ??!?!?

You have a machine running XP. You install Windows 7 or 8 on said machine.

Consumed office space remains unchanged.

[Fly-by-Wife]

I thought it was originally to be called Windows 2000

No, Windows 2000 was called Windows 2000. Something to do with the year it was released in, I believe.

XP was released in 2001, so Windows 2000 would hardly have been an appropriate name for it.

Of course, many people did say that XP was what Win2K should have been, rather like Win 7 and Vista, so perhaps that's where your confusion originates.

FBW

[BOAC]

Originally Posted by SD

Under Win7, you can run XP Mode, which is a Virtual PC running Windows XP
Yes, you can, but if it's internet connected it's just as vulnerable as any other instance of XP.

- this is where it is quite confusing! You are saying that if, in W7, I run an XP installed programme (or even one installed under W2000) which uses the internet, the Win7 'security', plus patches will not protect the machine?

Surely the onus is on M$ to ensure that any internet activity actioned via the W7 OS is protected as much as possible?

Recalling Pinguin's post earlier, why is 'dual-booting' relevant in all this? Surely as far as the machine is concerned it is running the selected OS and is technically 'oblivious' to any other installed OS, be it Mac or Linux etc?

[Andy_P]

- this is where it is quite confusing! You are saying that if, in W7, I run an XP installed programme (or even one installed under W2000) which uses the internet, the Win7 'security', plus patches will not protect the machine?

Surely the onus is on M$ to ensure that any internet activity actioned via the W7 OS is protected as much as possible?

Recalling Pinguin's post earlier, why is 'dual-booting' relevant in all this? Surely as far as the machine is concerned it is running the selected OS and is technically 'oblivious' to any other installed OS, be it Mac or Linux etc?

Ok, first things first. When you run a OS in a virtual machine, its a valid OS and is therefore vulnerable to all attacks. So you have to be careful.

Host OS = Windows 7
Guest OS = Windows XP (XP mode running under Win 7)

Win XP mode is 'sandboxed' which means its independent of the host OS (in this case win 7) and any vulnerabilities should remain in the 'sandboxed' guest OS.. However, XP mode maps all you host OS drives, so any corrupted files opened in XP mode can affect your host OS. BUT, if you are running a fully patched host OS with good virus protection, you host OS should be secure enough to prevent any attack. Your guest OS however still remains vulnerable.