Waiting for windows....
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 12
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From: Always on the move....
Waiting for windows....
...but for how long should I wait?
'Auto Update' to win 8.1 last night followed by normal shutdown.
This morning on startup blue screen with message...
Getting Windows Ready
Don't Turn Off Your Computer
Left well alone for couple of hours, but no HD activity light flashing so...
After trying a couple of different style power-downs, pushing "off" button continuously, pulling the plug, pressing Esc, Ctrl-Alt-Del etc. message is variously as above or just...
Please Wait
Any one else experiencing this?
'Auto Update' to win 8.1 last night followed by normal shutdown.
This morning on startup blue screen with message...
Getting Windows Ready
Don't Turn Off Your Computer
Left well alone for couple of hours, but no HD activity light flashing so...
After trying a couple of different style power-downs, pushing "off" button continuously, pulling the plug, pressing Esc, Ctrl-Alt-Del etc. message is variously as above or just...
Please Wait
Any one else experiencing this?
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 186
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From: Midlands
On shutdown yesterday my W7 machine loaded 14 updates. This morning it took 20 minutes of disc driving before it would speak to me. I have absolutely no idea what it was doing, only 8 updates with yesterday's date showing. Odd behaviour or NFM (Normal for Microsoft)?
Resident insomniac
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,878
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From: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
W7 automatically applied updates just now despite me instructing it not to!
I now have IE11 despite specifically leaving it unchecked on the list of possible updates offered.
An extended period of 'do not switch off' here too . . .
Is there no limit to what these bastards inflict on us?
Edited to add:- 11 unauthorised updates applied today with 47 over the last month - added at a rate of about 1 a day despite me having disabled automatic updates.
I now have IE11 despite specifically leaving it unchecked on the list of possible updates offered.
An extended period of 'do not switch off' here too . . .
Is there no limit to what these bastards inflict on us?
Edited to add:- 11 unauthorised updates applied today with 47 over the last month - added at a rate of about 1 a day despite me having disabled automatic updates.
Joined: Jan 2008
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From: Timbuktu
New releases of IE are categorised by MS as "critical" updates (ostenstibly for security reasons), so if you have automatic updates switched on (and despite you saying they're not, it looks like they are) to even the basic level, you'll get them.
Tone: This is normal. If you don't like waiting when turning on your machine of a morning, suggest you disable automatic updates and only get reminders (or "download but don't install"). Then you can install & restart when you have the time to do so.
Tone: This is normal. If you don't like waiting when turning on your machine of a morning, suggest you disable automatic updates and only get reminders (or "download but don't install"). Then you can install & restart when you have the time to do so.
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: Inacave
No, because they know what you want better than you do- at least that seems to be how MS OS designers think 
The biggest problem I have with comp's is getting the tech person I'm working with to understand that I absolutely know what I want and I absolutely know what I don't want. They cannot understand that my priorities and wants are not the same as theirs or anyone else's, and that these priorities change with the situation. Let me decide what features I want running, and stop all the others from loading until I need them. Let me decide when I have time to install updates. I'm in charge here and it's supposed to be doing what I want it to do and not the other way around
The biggest problem I have with comp's is getting the tech person I'm working with to understand that I absolutely know what I want and I absolutely know what I don't want. They cannot understand that my priorities and wants are not the same as theirs or anyone else's, and that these priorities change with the situation. Let me decide what features I want running, and stop all the others from loading until I need them. Let me decide when I have time to install updates. I'm in charge here and it's supposed to be doing what I want it to do and not the other way around
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,663
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From: Earth
The biggest problem I have with comp's is getting the tech person I'm working with to understand that I absolutely know what I want and I absolutely know what I don't want.
I think you need to separate design & development from the techies you work with. The techies are merely making the worst of a bad job, working within the constraints of the software put in front of them. Poorly designed, bug riddled software frustrates techies as much as it does you.
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: Inacave
And the biggest problems techs have is dealing with people like you that have ambitious ideas above their station and who can never quite grasp why it's not quite possible to do things their way...
I think you need to separate design & development from the techies you work with. The techies are merely making the worst of a bad job, working within the constraints of the software put in front of them. Poorly designed, bug riddled software frustrates techies as much as it does you.
I think you need to separate design & development from the techies you work with. The techies are merely making the worst of a bad job, working within the constraints of the software put in front of them. Poorly designed, bug riddled software frustrates techies as much as it does you.
I fully understand that to run certain programs etc, they sometimes require that other programs run first so they can access them to make the whole mess work. Which is not the problem here. What I speak of is when the tech comes along and I find that I've now got programs installed that I don't want because "everybody has that" or "everybody uses that". As you can tell, I am NOT everybody. And I don't care how everyone else does anything. Or they reconfigure things because they find them easier to access that way, even if I don't. In this, I am not referring to that which cannot be done any other way because of how the OS was designed, but the person whose usage is far different than mine who can't get it through their thick skull that I know what I want and it's not what they want. More than one tech has been surprised that when done my way, I can take my old clunker and go from off to any webpage faster than their newer, hotter machine can. I still keep up with them when I need any other program loaded after I'm started. And that is exactly what I most want- speed, not flash or fancy.
Back to MS OS's, they want you to use certain things as default, and they can be persistent buggers to get rid of so that you can use what you prefer instead they way they are bundled. Even doing a 'custom install' doesn't give you an option of not having them unless you dump the whole bundle. All you can do is go in and uninstall or delete the offenders after you load all their crap and load what you want afterward. How about an option of installing just the OS with nothing else packaged in with it? I've never seen that option, something is always hidden in there which you can do without. The nice part is that once their chosen crap is gone, everything loads faster and works better than ever.
I'm lucky that I have access to a few guys who really know their stuff and will listen to 'dummies' like me. They've done well helping me get what I want and nothing else. Only one is stuck with MS, the others have gone to LINUX and when I have time to learn it, I'm following them. It can't worse than trying to learn yet another MS OS which is totally unlike the one before it. And then I'll be done with those folks who can't understand that we're not all alike and that some of us have minds of our own.
Official PPRuNe Chaplain
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,498
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From: Witnesham, Suffolk
Hmmm. My PC doesn't update automatically. It tells me when updates are available, divided between "essential" and "optional". I decide when to install, and what. I usually go with the essential and pick and choose from the optional.
Internet Explorer is still there, for those very rare occasions when I need it (the former company website, for ordering a new car). It's on version 9. I've declined updates, with no further ado from MS.
I also go into msconfig about once every three months, and clear out the tat that seems to accumulate in there. The worst offender seems to be Apple, who assume that since I'm stuck with iTunes for backup/update of the iThings, I also want that and all their other rubbish (Quicktime, iCloud Service Manager, and more) to be running all the time. I remove those, and they stay gone until the next iTunes software update, when they reappear. iTunes updates are also on "manual" and don't get taken up very often.
Internet Explorer is still there, for those very rare occasions when I need it (the former company website, for ordering a new car). It's on version 9. I've declined updates, with no further ado from MS.
I also go into msconfig about once every three months, and clear out the tat that seems to accumulate in there. The worst offender seems to be Apple, who assume that since I'm stuck with iTunes for backup/update of the iThings, I also want that and all their other rubbish (Quicktime, iCloud Service Manager, and more) to be running all the time. I remove those, and they stay gone until the next iTunes software update, when they reappear. iTunes updates are also on "manual" and don't get taken up very often.
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 647
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keef
Because of my own stupidity (the details are embarrising) I have had to bring forward my "plans" to upgrade from XP SP2 to another Version of MS Windows.
In my case its Vista Business SP2 (a Dell and Vista 32 Bit ) the disk came with the P.C with XP as an extra paid for upgrade.
I'm relatively experenced as an end user but its a "Sea change" dealing with the visittudes of an unfamiliar operating system and its upgrade habits - this applies to Win 7 (I'm familiar with it) and perhaps windows 8 & 8.1 too
Through time, end users do change program associations and preferences for a variety of reasons in a personal context - In Business things are often different (VPN's and System enforced user policies) constrain modifications.
Support specialists often come from an industrial context supporting a product via a structured menu driven algorithmic process unlike the old days where sweat & intutition ruled the roost.
Because of the sheer numbers - Microsoft I think, do enforce urgent security fixes - even if you have chosen to select the download and notify me option.
This is confusing.
The experts will be able to confirm this. For non business end users.
Again Business users benefit from the delay and validation process by the IT department before fixes/updates are released at a site.
CAT III
[Edit: I'm on IE9 too and its slow.......]
In my case its Vista Business SP2 (a Dell and Vista 32 Bit ) the disk came with the P.C with XP as an extra paid for upgrade.
I'm relatively experenced as an end user but its a "Sea change" dealing with the visittudes of an unfamiliar operating system and its upgrade habits - this applies to Win 7 (I'm familiar with it) and perhaps windows 8 & 8.1 too
Through time, end users do change program associations and preferences for a variety of reasons in a personal context - In Business things are often different (VPN's and System enforced user policies) constrain modifications.
Support specialists often come from an industrial context supporting a product via a structured menu driven algorithmic process unlike the old days where sweat & intutition ruled the roost.
Because of the sheer numbers - Microsoft I think, do enforce urgent security fixes - even if you have chosen to select the download and notify me option.
This is confusing.
The experts will be able to confirm this. For non business end users.
Again Business users benefit from the delay and validation process by the IT department before fixes/updates are released at a site.
CAT III
[Edit: I'm on IE9 too and its slow.......]
Administrator
Joined: Mar 2001
Aviation Qualifications: PPL
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From: Twickenham, home of rugby
Because of the sheer numbers - Microsoft I think, do enforce urgent security fixes - even if you have chosen to select the download and notify me option.
This is confusing.
The experts will be able to confirm this. For non business end users.
This is confusing.
The experts will be able to confirm this. For non business end users.
I can't speak about Win 7 Home or Vista, but I'd be surprised if they are very different.
SD
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Granada, Spain
A ssalutory lesson... If it aint broke....
Last week I experienced a couple of problems that appeared more or less simultaneously... one was my optical mouse that suddenly developed a mind of its own dashing around the screen undemanded opening and closing widows all over the place and generally misbehaving itself. The other was a problem with Photobucket telling me that I had deleted or moved 95% of my 400 or so pics held on their servers. Both of these snags appeared after downloading and installing three security patches from MS. Thinking initially that my PB account had been hijacked and or I had picked up some sort of malware I got in touch with a computer help forum that I have used in the past.
I sent them a couple of scans and was severely chastised bythem for not having SP1 and SP2 applied to my basic Vista Home Premium OS. ive always been supporter of the 'If it aint broke don't fix it' brigade and indeed this basic Vista had served me well for 5 years.
It later transpired that the runaway mouse needed its software updating and the photobucket problem was a known server problem at their end.
Following thegeeks dire warnings about running vista in it basic form, reluctantly I downloaded and installed the two long outstanding service packs. It took all afternoon to do this but they both installed and configured correctly and the computer worked properly afterwards.
So... bang up to date, I thought as I switched off last night... but not so it seemed because as I went to switch off I found no less than 18 'security' patches waiting to be downloaded. I selected the 'download then switch off 'option and left it to its own devices and went to bed.
When I switched the PC on this morning it booted up OK and set about configuring the changes. Then it found three more and downloaded them and started the config process for them... four hours later and the damn thing still hadn't finished, it stalled at 62% of the second patch... with the message 'do not switch off during the config process'... eventually after 6 hours the PC threw some kind of a wobbly and turned itself off. I switched it back on and now it will not boot up... have tried Safe Mode, last known good config, nothing will make it change its mind.
To my way of thinking this problem has to be due to one or more of the 21 patches and its subsequent config given that it was working fine prior to their download but I cant find a way back because I cant get past the DOS type error screen.
Wish to hell I'd stuck with my original gut feeling and not messed with it because I don't have a recovery repair disc or installation disc to use to go to the next step. I'm using wifeys 10 years 'olde worlde' XP machine, again no SP's applied, to draft this post. Ive been in touch with Acer Europe support to see if they can provide a recovery repair or an installation disc but with Christmas at hand I doubt I'll hear anything soon.
Don't know just what to do about the Vista machine... if the hard drive is kaput or the OS corrupt whats next? Apart from buying a new computer?
Your thoughts gentlemen?
I sent them a couple of scans and was severely chastised bythem for not having SP1 and SP2 applied to my basic Vista Home Premium OS. ive always been supporter of the 'If it aint broke don't fix it' brigade and indeed this basic Vista had served me well for 5 years.
It later transpired that the runaway mouse needed its software updating and the photobucket problem was a known server problem at their end.
Following thegeeks dire warnings about running vista in it basic form, reluctantly I downloaded and installed the two long outstanding service packs. It took all afternoon to do this but they both installed and configured correctly and the computer worked properly afterwards.
So... bang up to date, I thought as I switched off last night... but not so it seemed because as I went to switch off I found no less than 18 'security' patches waiting to be downloaded. I selected the 'download then switch off 'option and left it to its own devices and went to bed.
When I switched the PC on this morning it booted up OK and set about configuring the changes. Then it found three more and downloaded them and started the config process for them... four hours later and the damn thing still hadn't finished, it stalled at 62% of the second patch... with the message 'do not switch off during the config process'... eventually after 6 hours the PC threw some kind of a wobbly and turned itself off. I switched it back on and now it will not boot up... have tried Safe Mode, last known good config, nothing will make it change its mind.
To my way of thinking this problem has to be due to one or more of the 21 patches and its subsequent config given that it was working fine prior to their download but I cant find a way back because I cant get past the DOS type error screen.
Wish to hell I'd stuck with my original gut feeling and not messed with it because I don't have a recovery repair disc or installation disc to use to go to the next step. I'm using wifeys 10 years 'olde worlde' XP machine, again no SP's applied, to draft this post. Ive been in touch with Acer Europe support to see if they can provide a recovery repair or an installation disc but with Christmas at hand I doubt I'll hear anything soon.
Don't know just what to do about the Vista machine... if the hard drive is kaput or the OS corrupt whats next? Apart from buying a new computer?
Your thoughts gentlemen?
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 647
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Phalconphixer
Is the DOS Type error screen giving you the option to start windows normally after an abnormal shut down.
If so, select start windows normally and let the updates re commence - otherwise tell us what is happening.
? or a C\> type prompt or a blue screen with white lettering ? a BSOD screen
Those Vista Patches are not so easy to apply: I know re another thread.
However they are needed to fix weeknesses and bugs in the system.
I'm using the Business version that came with my Dell but the home version will not be espcially different. Click the Orb and type Windows Update, view the history and update any missing elements.
I have found out Vista will not allow you to install SP2 untill all the fixes for Vista SP1 are installed.
Use Google to try and identify the Micrsoft help pages needed for SP2 and please be patient with it.
It does take ages for the updates to apply. Vista will also look for uptodate windows drivers - special programs that manage the components of your P.C working away in the back ground this all takes time.
As for the XP P.C without the patches - I think that SP1 for XP Home may be no longer available - SP2 may still be around. XP support ends in a few months. Are you using any anti virus programs on either P.C ? - Has the Vista P.C suggested that you defragment the hard drive ?
Please see the other threads re XP on Pprune computer threads.
CAT III
If so, select start windows normally and let the updates re commence - otherwise tell us what is happening.
? or a C\> type prompt or a blue screen with white lettering ? a BSOD screen
Those Vista Patches are not so easy to apply: I know re another thread.
However they are needed to fix weeknesses and bugs in the system.
I'm using the Business version that came with my Dell but the home version will not be espcially different. Click the Orb and type Windows Update, view the history and update any missing elements.
I have found out Vista will not allow you to install SP2 untill all the fixes for Vista SP1 are installed.
Use Google to try and identify the Micrsoft help pages needed for SP2 and please be patient with it.
It does take ages for the updates to apply. Vista will also look for uptodate windows drivers - special programs that manage the components of your P.C working away in the back ground this all takes time.
As for the XP P.C without the patches - I think that SP1 for XP Home may be no longer available - SP2 may still be around. XP support ends in a few months. Are you using any anti virus programs on either P.C ? - Has the Vista P.C suggested that you defragment the hard drive ?
Please see the other threads re XP on Pprune computer threads.
CAT III
Last edited by Guest 112233; 21st December 2013 at 23:47.
Joined: Aug 2002
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From: Earth
Your thoughts gentlemen?
If patches have not applied properly and you're seeing issues with safe mode, the OS sounds corrupt too. This may be an unfortunate side effect of the dying hard drive.
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Granada, Spain
CAT111 and mixture... thanks for your suggestions...
The DOS type screen is white on black and gives the options
Start in safe mode
Start in safe mode with command prompt
Start in safe mode with internet access
Start normally
Selecting any of these options causes to the computer to think about it for a moment before returning to the same error screen.
The primary suggestions are Install recovery or repair disc and
If you don't have a disc *and I haven't* consult your administrator or the equipment manufacturer. I contacted Acer-Europe last night by email asking if they can supply a disc and am waiting to hear back from them.
In the event of a hard drive failure what happens next? Obviously a shop bought replacement item wont have an OS so would I need to buy an OS to go with it and if this is the case isn't there a question of compatibility with the mother board?
This morning I stripped, cleaned and reassembled the computer, something I routinely do every three months or so... having six dogs in the house generates a lot of street dust and dead skin cells most of which gets sucked up into the machine.
In the next village there is a Spanish owned Computer spares and repair shop, I will go see him tomorrow, he is currently repairing a lcd monitor power supply for me, I will ask him if he can loan or sell me a Vista repair recovery disc or an installation disc.
pp
The DOS type screen is white on black and gives the options
Start in safe mode
Start in safe mode with command prompt
Start in safe mode with internet access
Start normally
Selecting any of these options causes to the computer to think about it for a moment before returning to the same error screen.
The primary suggestions are Install recovery or repair disc and
If you don't have a disc *and I haven't* consult your administrator or the equipment manufacturer. I contacted Acer-Europe last night by email asking if they can supply a disc and am waiting to hear back from them.
In the event of a hard drive failure what happens next? Obviously a shop bought replacement item wont have an OS so would I need to buy an OS to go with it and if this is the case isn't there a question of compatibility with the mother board?
This morning I stripped, cleaned and reassembled the computer, something I routinely do every three months or so... having six dogs in the house generates a lot of street dust and dead skin cells most of which gets sucked up into the machine.
In the next village there is a Spanish owned Computer spares and repair shop, I will go see him tomorrow, he is currently repairing a lcd monitor power supply for me, I will ask him if he can loan or sell me a Vista repair recovery disc or an installation disc.
pp
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 647
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Phalconphixer
Seeing the person at the repair shop seems a good idea. I do not think all is lost at this stage.
My Vista sys (Age 7) was an emergency install from a recovery disk supplied with the computer. My system drive was in good shape a Segate 160 Gb SATA if this helps.
Un luckelley - The Hard disk may have been quietly failing for some time - PS I sympathise re the Dog hair problem.
The fact that you can at least get to the menu option means that you may be able to copy your critical data off the drive.
With help - use a "linux" boot CD disk to allow the system to boot the computer, the repair shop will have this and using a USB stick copy your vital data to USB.
As Mixture advises it looks as if the HD is failing. Do not keep re trying to boot from the HD - Time is of the essence.
CAT III
My Vista sys (Age 7) was an emergency install from a recovery disk supplied with the computer. My system drive was in good shape a Segate 160 Gb SATA if this helps.
Un luckelley - The Hard disk may have been quietly failing for some time - PS I sympathise re the Dog hair problem.
The fact that you can at least get to the menu option means that you may be able to copy your critical data off the drive.
With help - use a "linux" boot CD disk to allow the system to boot the computer, the repair shop will have this and using a USB stick copy your vital data to USB.
As Mixture advises it looks as if the HD is failing. Do not keep re trying to boot from the HD - Time is of the essence.
CAT III
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Granada, Spain
CAT111... thanks a lot for your help. I will use my best Spanglish on the shopkeeper tomorrow! in fact using this olde worlde XP machine and google translate I will draft him a letter explaining all that has happened. My HD is a 250Gb Seagate Sata...
pp
pp
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,663
Likes: 0
From: Earth
Obviously a shop bought replacement item wont have an OS so would I need to buy an OS to go with it and if this is the case isn't there a question of compatibility with the mother board?
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Uk
I guess I'm another who is confused by these 'important updates'. I have disabled install updates automatically, ever since one just seemed to hangup the whole machine. I have an idea this update was discussed here at some length a few months ago.
I have 7 ready to be installed and I'm really nervous about just letting it go and do it's thing.
I have 7 ready to be installed and I'm really nervous about just letting it go and do it's thing.
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 218
Likes: 0
From: Granada, Spain
Further to my last post...
Right then... I have found, buried at the bottom of a box assorted junk what appears to be two DVD's relating to the Acer marked Recovery Disc 1 and 2...Choosing the F12 boot option 'Boot from CD' brings the Acer recovery system into play and offers two options.
Recover the whole system to Manufactures original default state which loses all data stored on drive C pictures, music etc
OR Restore the OS only, in which case all other files, good or infected, are moved to C\Backup.
I tried the second option and it after it goes into copy mode, after 10 seconds or so the DVD tray opens and I am asked to insert a 'disco de imagen correcto' by which I can only assume they are talking about Clean Blank DVD, it doesn't translate very well... I don't have any blank DVD-Rs in the house at the moment so before I progress any further down this route I have to ask "is this a reasonable supposition" on my part? It's certainly not the other recovery DVD, that just gets spat out again with a request to install disc one and start again... does it have to be a DVD or could I use some blank space on a spare HD driven by USB that I use for bulk file storage...
pp
Right then... I have found, buried at the bottom of a box assorted junk what appears to be two DVD's relating to the Acer marked Recovery Disc 1 and 2...Choosing the F12 boot option 'Boot from CD' brings the Acer recovery system into play and offers two options.
Recover the whole system to Manufactures original default state which loses all data stored on drive C pictures, music etc
OR Restore the OS only, in which case all other files, good or infected, are moved to C\Backup.
I tried the second option and it after it goes into copy mode, after 10 seconds or so the DVD tray opens and I am asked to insert a 'disco de imagen correcto' by which I can only assume they are talking about Clean Blank DVD, it doesn't translate very well... I don't have any blank DVD-Rs in the house at the moment so before I progress any further down this route I have to ask "is this a reasonable supposition" on my part? It's certainly not the other recovery DVD, that just gets spat out again with a request to install disc one and start again... does it have to be a DVD or could I use some blank space on a spare HD driven by USB that I use for bulk file storage...
pp
