Turbulence in CYYT
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4
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From: Seville (Spain)
Turbulence in CYYT
Hi pals,
Anyone familiar with approaches to CYYT?
I read in my charts the following CAUTION note, "Precipitous terrain on APCH. Moderate to severe turbulence, windshear and downdrafts may be encountered".
I'm used to operate ETOPS with CYYT as ERA, and would like to have some more complimentary information about this particularity due to the orography of St John's. In other airports you can find some information regarding wind directions and speed range that makes it more likely to find this type of turbulence. Does anyone have information for CYYT?
Thank you!
Anyone familiar with approaches to CYYT?
I read in my charts the following CAUTION note, "Precipitous terrain on APCH. Moderate to severe turbulence, windshear and downdrafts may be encountered".
I'm used to operate ETOPS with CYYT as ERA, and would like to have some more complimentary information about this particularity due to the orography of St John's. In other airports you can find some information regarding wind directions and speed range that makes it more likely to find this type of turbulence. Does anyone have information for CYYT?
Thank you!
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 71
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From: Canada
Historic wx and almanac info
I am on the ground here at CYYT.
Try this link, there is a link to historic wind speed and direction - it may help. The folks who publish it are Environment Canada, you might get exactly what you need by contacting them directly if these data are insufficient.
Almanac Averages and Extremes for February 06 - Climate - Environment and Climate Change Canada
Best,
Pete
Try this link, there is a link to historic wind speed and direction - it may help. The folks who publish it are Environment Canada, you might get exactly what you need by contacting them directly if these data are insufficient.
Almanac Averages and Extremes for February 06 - Climate - Environment and Climate Change Canada
Best,
Pete
Last edited by Viper 7; 7th February 2018 at 16:33. Reason: splelling
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4
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From: Seville (Spain)
Dear Pete,
Thank you very much for your answer.
Unfortunately I can't find here the information I'm seeking for. I'm sure I didn't explain myself properly. I try again with an example.
In Bilbao (Spain) LEBB, we can find the following company published information,
"[I]When wind direction is between 160 and 230 degrees and with an intensity of more than 15KT expect moderate to severe turbulence and vertical windshear. If intensity is more than 20KT from this direction, it
is not recommended to operate at this airport without favorable PIREPS."[/I]
As CYYT looks an airdrome where you have a high probability of encountering MOD-SEV turbulence, I thought there could be any publication (maybe Air Canada?) refering wind direction and intensity that makes more probable of resulting in turbulence during approach, or even, as in LEBB, unrecommending to operate.
Thank you!
Jesús.
Thank you very much for your answer.
Unfortunately I can't find here the information I'm seeking for. I'm sure I didn't explain myself properly. I try again with an example.
In Bilbao (Spain) LEBB, we can find the following company published information,
"[I]When wind direction is between 160 and 230 degrees and with an intensity of more than 15KT expect moderate to severe turbulence and vertical windshear. If intensity is more than 20KT from this direction, it
is not recommended to operate at this airport without favorable PIREPS."[/I]
As CYYT looks an airdrome where you have a high probability of encountering MOD-SEV turbulence, I thought there could be any publication (maybe Air Canada?) refering wind direction and intensity that makes more probable of resulting in turbulence during approach, or even, as in LEBB, unrecommending to operate.
Thank you!
Jesús.
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 450
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From: BC
Flown there a lot. RWY 11, expect severe downdrafts with a strong West/NW wind. Severe subsiding air as it passes over the airport and spills down the cliffs at the approach end. Rock and Roll! You need to have some good 'hands and feet' skills. All in a day's fun.
Joined: Apr 2000
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From: BC
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 71
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From: Canada
I am not aware of any published warnings with that level of detail for CYYT.
It is a very windy location, that is for certain, particularly in the winter. Here is our METAR at the moment for instance:
METAR CYYT 081300Z 20030G42KT 15SM -RA SCT040 OVC076 05/04 A2987 RMK
SC3AC5 SLP121=
I expect approaches to 29 would be similarly challenging with winds over 40 knots given the terrain on short final. I fly a jet ranger from a private pad in those hills just short final on 29 and we watch the winds very carefully indeed.
It is a very windy location, that is for certain, particularly in the winter. Here is our METAR at the moment for instance:
METAR CYYT 081300Z 20030G42KT 15SM -RA SCT040 OVC076 05/04 A2987 RMK
SC3AC5 SLP121=
I expect approaches to 29 would be similarly challenging with winds over 40 knots given the terrain on short final. I fly a jet ranger from a private pad in those hills just short final on 29 and we watch the winds very carefully indeed.
Joined: Jun 2006
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From: Canada
Things do get a bit breezy on the "Rock", however if one keeps a firm hand on the throttle's {Thrust levers to the collage grads!} and get rid of auto throttles all will be well, the only aircraft I have had any problem holding the glide path when IMC was the Viscount when fully loaded, but it never got to the point of having to overshoot, its a great place for spending a layover and the population are the friendliest and most welcoming in the world!
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4
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From: Seville (Spain)
Thank you all for the feedback
Dear ALL,
Thank you very much for all this valuable feedback. I got it! Though I understand it's not more detailly published, ok, with your experience feedback I can figure out how it is a windy (usual) day approach into St John's.
Thanks!
Thank you very much for all this valuable feedback. I got it! Though I understand it's not more detailly published, ok, with your experience feedback I can figure out how it is a windy (usual) day approach into St John's.
Thanks!
Thread Starter
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 4
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From: Seville (Spain)
Thank you vary much for your feedback.
Yes, sometimes Gander is our first decision for ETOPS planning according to WX minima, as well as CYJT or CYHZ, for example. None of this other airports have the singularity of the "you may expect turbulence during approach" published for CYYT, and though that's not a regulated determining WX condition for ETOPS planning, I think it should be very seriously taken into account. It's not very smart to divert your flight with one engine out to an airport where you'll probably encounter severe turbulence. CRM should start at the office, right?
Yes, sometimes Gander is our first decision for ETOPS planning according to WX minima, as well as CYJT or CYHZ, for example. None of this other airports have the singularity of the "you may expect turbulence during approach" published for CYYT, and though that's not a regulated determining WX condition for ETOPS planning, I think it should be very seriously taken into account. It's not very smart to divert your flight with one engine out to an airport where you'll probably encounter severe turbulence. CRM should start at the office, right?
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 141
Likes: 15
From: yyz
My record is 55 direct,in yhz sporting to the extreme(right after MK airlines). My F/O's(JB) leg into deer lake ydf was 48G63 at 30 off. Carried lots of extra as our ASI went from Vref to Vfe continuously 115-170. we touched down at about 70kts on the gps and 140 indicated. Most fun as you can have with yer clothes on
