BA cabin crew to strike
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Nirvana
No-ones being nasty, I'm not. I'm just pointing out that most, if not all crew, are highly trained beyond that of the obvious customer service. When you see 6 crew hands on trying to save someone's life with equipment strewn everywhere, you might appreciate what I'm saying. Obviously, not everyone gets to see or experience that and let's hope not. That said, it happens fairly regularly in LH.
PDR's experiences and comments on the attitude of crew he has met has resulted in him having a blinkered opinion of the real value of the cabin crew. I'm not taking about pay and salaries, I'm talking about the training and ability to look after someone in need or save a life especially when time is crucial
We're trying to rid the industry of this attitude as it's clearly not helpful or appreciated. Let's not cloud opinions based on whether someone smiles or not when offering a drink. Still doesn't make them less capable of saving a life.
I trust this concludes the discussion
PDR's experiences and comments on the attitude of crew he has met has resulted in him having a blinkered opinion of the real value of the cabin crew. I'm not taking about pay and salaries, I'm talking about the training and ability to look after someone in need or save a life especially when time is crucial
We're trying to rid the industry of this attitude as it's clearly not helpful or appreciated. Let's not cloud opinions based on whether someone smiles or not when offering a drink. Still doesn't make them less capable of saving a life.
I trust this concludes the discussion
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Nirvana
I'm not. I took issue with PDR's personal opinion of cabin crew and responded accordingly. My argument isn't centred around pay or conditions. My argument is that PDR 1 totally underestimates the worth of a cabin crew member within their onboard role. To which, I have answered.
If you want me to express an opinion on BA MF terms and conditions, just say so. That said, that's about of much interest to me as your salary t&c's if you get my drift.
We're done I think
If you want me to express an opinion on BA MF terms and conditions, just say so. That said, that's about of much interest to me as your salary t&c's if you get my drift.
We're done I think
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 2,290
Likes: 9
From: BHX LXR ASW
£55K up to £75K to serve tea and coffee + massive FSP deals. Ryan and Easy thought that a little excessive. And you don't think that should have changed? The average is down to about £28K so not too bad ... except the old hands still keep theirs.
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 26
Likes: 6
From: Thailand
When you see 6 crew hands on trying to save someone's life with equipment strewn everywhere, you might appreciate what I'm saying.
There is nothing magical about being trained in how to do CPR and use a Defribillator. More employers should offer it.
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Nirvana
Fair point to a degree Chico however not in a metal tube, miles high in the sky with the nearest hospital potentially being hours away even if that airport can Handle that Aircraft type. Valid point about more employers jumping on board which I think is improving.
Tightslot - Ever the voice of reason. No worries
Tightslot - Ever the voice of reason. No worries
Joined: Aug 2001
Aviation Qualifications: Spotter
Posts: 1,829
Likes: 165
From: se england
I just think it is very sad that people here seem to glory in the idea of airline staff being employed on rubbish contracts with crap pay.
These people generally do a decent days work-they don't lie for a living like journos, they dont steal your pension money like banks and financial advisors and insurance companies, they don't run the NHS into the ground for the sake of their bonus like NHS managers, they don't chase ambulances or rip people off with fees like lawyers. They don't impact your lives much at all.
Its a free country-just about and if they want to strike to draw attention to their situation they are entitled to. If we keep on depressing the wages and conditions of people in jobs where they are one of several thousand like these folks, Amazon workers, council contractors you are creating a society out of Dickens where the majority cannot afford even the sinmplest luxury and that in itself is enough to destroy overall prosperity
These people generally do a decent days work-they don't lie for a living like journos, they dont steal your pension money like banks and financial advisors and insurance companies, they don't run the NHS into the ground for the sake of their bonus like NHS managers, they don't chase ambulances or rip people off with fees like lawyers. They don't impact your lives much at all.
Its a free country-just about and if they want to strike to draw attention to their situation they are entitled to. If we keep on depressing the wages and conditions of people in jobs where they are one of several thousand like these folks, Amazon workers, council contractors you are creating a society out of Dickens where the majority cannot afford even the sinmplest luxury and that in itself is enough to destroy overall prosperity
Uncle Pete
Joined: Jul 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 915
Likes: 0
From: Frodsham Cheshire
I started my career operating the Vickers Viscount in two roles, flight deck and cabin crew. I still think this taught me one heck of a lot about life in the industry. And as a bonus it was great fun, always being the 'baby' of the crew. Perhaps this should be made compulsory??
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
Likes: 6
From: York
Sky News are saying Xmas Day, and Boxing Day for the first strikes. BA "determined the strike will fail"!
Hope Unite have explained to these young folks how these things play out!
For example, they WILL be threatened with the sack. Though to be honest, I suspect this particular section of the workforce will be far less concerned with that prospect, than most BA have previously dealt with.
I still support them though!!!
Hope Unite have explained to these young folks how these things play out!
For example, they WILL be threatened with the sack. Though to be honest, I suspect this particular section of the workforce will be far less concerned with that prospect, than most BA have previously dealt with.
I still support them though!!!
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 706
Likes: 0
From: SALISBURY
It's such a shame for these youngsters who are being used as cannon fodder by Len McClunky & his bunch of Unite thugs.
The last time that they tried to take on WW they lost as they will again.
It's just a shame that 1,000s of pax will be caused unnecessary worry & stress & the CC members will have their careers ruined by union militancy.
The last time that they tried to take on WW they lost as they will again.
It's just a shame that 1,000s of pax will be caused unnecessary worry & stress & the CC members will have their careers ruined by union militancy.
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 308
Likes: 20
From: London
MF earn more than £12k. That's the basic salary and then they are paid an hourly rate for the duration of their trip and receive bonuses for attendance etc.
Soundings are that a lot of the union concerns are more to do with the rostering and rest periods rather than pay itself.
It seems that calling a strike on Christmas Day and Boxing Day is more to do with putting PR pressure on BA rather than causing disruption. A very reduced schedule operates on Christmas Day in any event and BA seem pretty confident they can cover most of the schedule, including all long-haul flights.
Soundings are that a lot of the union concerns are more to do with the rostering and rest periods rather than pay itself.
It seems that calling a strike on Christmas Day and Boxing Day is more to do with putting PR pressure on BA rather than causing disruption. A very reduced schedule operates on Christmas Day in any event and BA seem pretty confident they can cover most of the schedule, including all long-haul flights.
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 739
Likes: 6
From: York
A very reduced schedule operates on Christmas Day in any event and BA seem pretty confident they can cover most of the schedule, including all long-haul flights.
Bear in mind the recent 'Which' survey in which BA are slipping down the customer satisfaction tables. That's BEFORE any industrial unrest!
It might be reasonable to ponder why????? Or who is responsible??
I imagine T&Cs on mixed fleet, might be a reflection of something much more significant for this particular company??
Last edited by 4468; 17th December 2016 at 21:25.
Joined: Jun 2016
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
From: Scotland
Yep, I may well be one of the old 'grumps' who did the job during the best of times, but...
We were payed very well but we stayed and made a career of it. We knew the job inside out, we were fully conversant of the menu, the wine etc. in F and J. We called PAX by their titles and had great conversations with them. In those days we were sent on wine and cookery courses in order to improve the service. We went on paid language courses, I learnt both French and German. All in order to improve service in our job. We were proud of our job and, I think, gave great service. Oh, and we also saved a few lives and delivered a few baby's too. I agree, BA is pretty poor these days, Quantas and Emirates are better, but I am not surprised. Treat you staff badly and it's no surprise they are poor, it's not a career anymore it's a job to do for a year or two then leave when you are burnt out. That is the point I am trying to make. Treat your staff with respect, pay them a good wage and give them a career structure. Then, and only then, will you get CC doing a great job and bringing repeat business.
And one last point, it's not like other jobs as some are trying to point out. It's physically exhausting. You are working at altitude for hours on end, the relentless jet lag plays havoc with your body. You are away so much you have little private life, you are a barman, waiter, security guard, nurse, travel agent, nursemaid, tour guide, handyman,, translator etc. All rolled up into one. Most folk get to go home every night to their families and friends. They don't. They work longer hours than most, at constant risk of disruption and to do that whilst treated poorly? I don't think so
We were payed very well but we stayed and made a career of it. We knew the job inside out, we were fully conversant of the menu, the wine etc. in F and J. We called PAX by their titles and had great conversations with them. In those days we were sent on wine and cookery courses in order to improve the service. We went on paid language courses, I learnt both French and German. All in order to improve service in our job. We were proud of our job and, I think, gave great service. Oh, and we also saved a few lives and delivered a few baby's too. I agree, BA is pretty poor these days, Quantas and Emirates are better, but I am not surprised. Treat you staff badly and it's no surprise they are poor, it's not a career anymore it's a job to do for a year or two then leave when you are burnt out. That is the point I am trying to make. Treat your staff with respect, pay them a good wage and give them a career structure. Then, and only then, will you get CC doing a great job and bringing repeat business.
And one last point, it's not like other jobs as some are trying to point out. It's physically exhausting. You are working at altitude for hours on end, the relentless jet lag plays havoc with your body. You are away so much you have little private life, you are a barman, waiter, security guard, nurse, travel agent, nursemaid, tour guide, handyman,, translator etc. All rolled up into one. Most folk get to go home every night to their families and friends. They don't. They work longer hours than most, at constant risk of disruption and to do that whilst treated poorly? I don't think so
Last edited by expurser; 17th December 2016 at 12:46. Reason: Last thoughts
