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BA LHR Mix Fleet?

Old 1st Oct 2010, 11:31
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BA LHR Mix Fleet?

Hiya guys just wondering if anyone can give me some info, I have been looking at the future talent crew jobs with the new mix fleet at lhr. I think this will be similar to what they have at lgw, but i have heard a rumour that days off will be used up downroute during actual trips rather than being allocated between trips back at base. Anyone know for sure? Thanks
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Old 1st Oct 2010, 19:52
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Angel

BA have said that, that wont be happening. I think days off per month are reduced if you have annual leave in a months roster. I don't know the details tho of how many days off are removed for how much leave.
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Old 20th Oct 2010, 22:39
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Just to let you know about something in the contract that would worry me.

BA can give you 7 days notice and place you on upto 6 months unpaid leave.
So another ash cloud, swine flu, 9/11 and your skint for 6 months, but since your technically employed not sure how it goes claiming JSA!
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Old 21st Oct 2010, 17:58
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In the world outside BA what employers do when a downturn strikes is make people compulsorily redundant, so I don't think a stand down clause, if it exists in that highly questionable form, places you in any worse position than anywhere else.
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Old 21st Oct 2010, 18:50
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Hand Solo
ever hear of redundancy payments? In the real world if u are laid off there is a statutory formula for calculating your redundancy payment.You would get a lump sum and could move on. In a worse case scenario BA could lay you off for up to six months , take you back and lay u off again ad infinitum.A very unsecure position....n'est pas?
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Old 21st Oct 2010, 19:46
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I'd say it's a highly tenous position legally too! Has anyone actually seen one of these contracts or is this yet more crewmour? One of the basic tenets of contract law is that the contract has to be fair to both parties. Should BA attempt to enforce a contract which allows them to lay people off, without pay, for 6 months but retain contractual control over them throughout it would be laughed out of the first court or tribunal it came to. Furthermore, how would BA attempt to get around the requirement to pay a legal minimum wage to it's employees? That is a fundamental right and cannot be signed away by contract. Until such time as somebody provides us with the actual text of the contract rather than some hearsay spread by BASSA acolytes who desperately want it to be true then I'm afraid that claim will warrant a high score on the BS scale.
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 15:03
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It's on the other forum cc.com BA page 2 MF Contract/ Clause 3 and Clause 13
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 19:45
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Um... no. what is on the CCforum is someone's posting about the contract. I'd be wary about jumping to conclusions without seeing the actual text and context. There is also what purports to be a response from someone in BA that suggests that in the past 10 years there have been no lay-offs
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 20:02
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No, there haven't been lay offs but there have been a number of times where, given the opportunity, there would have been, eg: post 9/11.

The concern is that these clauses will allow the company to do with MF crews that they could not do in the past.
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 20:30
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Angel

Colonel White,
These people are not BA employees and have no axe to grind. They are showing genuine concern for a contract that does have a layoff clause in it.
It also has a one week notice clause by BA but the crew member has to give 4 weeks and it also has a clause in it that the crew can be used to work on the ground if BA requires it.
Many people are signing it because they want to be cabin crew but many who work for other airlines, like Virgin, are worried about these clauses, as are some of the BA temps.
I am sure there will be a never ending supply of people that want to be crew but I can assure you that some people have been put off by these clauses and some people have actually left the training courses already because they are unhappy with the Mixed Fleet regime and that is something that I don't think has ever happened before.
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 20:40
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It seems a bit premature to dislike the mixed-fleet 'regime' when it's not even flying yet. I know there's a crewmour going round BASSA circles about a manager being given a hard time at Cranebank by some trainees, however it there's any truth in it it seems to me to be the trainees fault for not adequately researching what they signed up for! The clauses in the contract are most interesting and I shall ask some employment lawyer contacts of mine for their general view, but as I said earlier, an employment contract must be fair to both parties. BA can write as many lopsided notice and stand down clauses in as they like, but if the contract does not appear fair to a tribunal or judge then it will not be enforceable.
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Old 22nd Oct 2010, 22:00
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Angel

The 'regime' starts from day one of the training course. I have no idea personally what it is like on Mixed fleet only what I have heard and that is that they are constantly being told that they are 'the elite' and that it is very strict.
All I can say is that these clauses are in the contract and some crew have left.
I am sure that there are many that are very happy and I hope it is great for them. I personally know some really nice crew that have gone over as CSMs so I want it to be good for them.
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Old 30th Oct 2010, 22:35
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I can tell you now, at no point what so ever during my training on Mixed Fleet have I, or any other of my fellow trainees been told we are 'elite' (or special, more important or better than anyone else) We dont feel like we are either. We look up to current crew and admire them as experienced professionals.

The uniform standards are very strict and we aren't allowed certain things like trousers for the girls anymore. The hats.... well, we all know how each other feels about them. Personally I would rather MF, WW & EF could either all have them or not at all. I see the hats as being an easy and obvious way to segregate us from each other which in my mind is causing unnecessary 'us and them' feelings.

We were all in the hold pool for 1-2 years and applied for this job before Mixed Fleet was an option (our only option now). Some have been re interviewed and been accepted,some were interviewed and unfortunately weren't successful. Some didnt even bother going to second interviews when they saw the pay scale. We just want to work for BA, like all of you. No, the pays not great - but that's the offer, take it or leave it! The contract is what it is, we took it at face value and signed the dotted line, I still see it as a good opportunity.

Thats all I have to say, I cant wait to start flying

*Edited to add, I am training as Cabin Crew!!
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Old 31st Oct 2010, 07:27
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Angel

elldee,
Welcome to BA and I truly wish you a great and enjoyable career in BA.

I have been in BA for 22 years and loved every minute of it.

I hope you enjoy working as cabin crew too.

I am glad you enjoyed your course and I look forward to seeing you in the CRC. What I said about MFCrew being told they were elite did happen to someone I know but maybe they were on a different training course to you. No offence meant to any Mixed Fleet Crew.
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Old 31st Oct 2010, 09:34
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Elldee - are you saying that the clause does exist in the contract? Can you post it here for us to read directly?


I doubt very much any Employment lawyer worth their salt would suggest that anyone signs a contract on the basis that they can always take it to court at a later date! It is ludicrous to suggest people be so naive about signing a legal document.
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Old 1st Nov 2010, 10:33
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I agree, no employment lawyer would be likely to suggest that course of action, but that is an entirely different issue to whether the contract is fair or not. If it's the only contract available to you right now what you do?
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Old 1st Nov 2010, 12:36
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There were 2 groups on day 1 of MF, and I can assure you all that in my group we were told that we were the "elite' crew! I completely disagree with us been
brainwashed to think that we are elite as there are some excellent main crew out there!
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Old 1st Nov 2010, 12:46
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If it's the only contract available to you right now what you do?
Either sign it or don't. No one is being forced to sign it simply because no one is being forced to join. If you want the job, you'll sign it. Simples.
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Old 1st Nov 2010, 14:26
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ptc


well you have said it... there are SOME brilliant crew on current fleets... on MF everyone will be brilliant. And if this brings on the adjective "elite" following our fleet, so be it.

the s word didn't seem to bother people, why should the "elite" do???
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Old 1st Nov 2010, 16:43
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blue
you are having a laugh ? No? Could you just explain to us why BA think that you, as cabincrew who have probably just accepted the worst employment contract on the market, could be described as "elite".Have they taken the S.A.S on to train you?
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