Disarming doors before ditching
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: About 3000 below Midhurst SID I reckon
Posts: 691
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The version I was led to believe....
On the first diversion demand, the pilots changed heading but on approach discovered they couldn't land there.
When the second diversion destination was demanded by the hijackers, the pilots pointed out they didnt have enough fuel to get there, the hijackers forced them to continue, and eventually the aircraft went in to ditch.
The Hijackers were convinced by now that the pilots were trying to trick them and one grabbed the controls as the aircraft was imminently ditching, just feet above the water. As a result, one wingtip hit the water first and was torn off, sending the aircraft into the water at a catastrophic angle.
Experts say ifit hadnt been caused to list, it looked like it would have been a succesful ditching.
On the first diversion demand, the pilots changed heading but on approach discovered they couldn't land there.
When the second diversion destination was demanded by the hijackers, the pilots pointed out they didnt have enough fuel to get there, the hijackers forced them to continue, and eventually the aircraft went in to ditch.
The Hijackers were convinced by now that the pilots were trying to trick them and one grabbed the controls as the aircraft was imminently ditching, just feet above the water. As a result, one wingtip hit the water first and was torn off, sending the aircraft into the water at a catastrophic angle.
Experts say ifit hadnt been caused to list, it looked like it would have been a succesful ditching.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Around
Age: 43
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Question - how many successful ditchings have cause all passenger to actually be able to exit the aircraft in the manner describe. Be realistic folks, the flight deck have to have a flat calm mill pond to land without loosing engines and clipping wings to get the a/c hull to land in one piece and deploy the shoots!
One has ones doubts about that, read the official report.
The reason for the suggestion it would be successful was shallow water but realistically
you are not going to be over those conditions in a normal situation.
Your training is there to make you feel comfortable in the situation and not alot more!
Experts say ifit hadnt been caused to list, it looked like it would have been a succesful ditching.
The reason for the suggestion it would be successful was shallow water but realistically
you are not going to be over those conditions in a normal situation.
Your training is there to make you feel comfortable in the situation and not alot more!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: here and there
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The procedures for ditching are diffrent from an a/c to another.
I don't fly 737, but I do fly B777, A330, 340, mostly long and ultra long haul. The rule is that if the door has a slideraft u keep it armed and u open it, as the slideraft cand be detached from the a/c and used a raft. If the door has just a slide, the drill says to disarm, block the doors and redirect the pax.
However, if the situation is catastrophic and you cannot open other doors, you open, for example, LR3 doors in 777 to evacuate. If u have to get "t.. h.." out of there you have to use any possible way.
I don't fly 737, but I do fly B777, A330, 340, mostly long and ultra long haul. The rule is that if the door has a slideraft u keep it armed and u open it, as the slideraft cand be detached from the a/c and used a raft. If the door has just a slide, the drill says to disarm, block the doors and redirect the pax.
However, if the situation is catastrophic and you cannot open other doors, you open, for example, LR3 doors in 777 to evacuate. If u have to get "t.. h.." out of there you have to use any possible way.
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In Frozen Chunks (Cloud Cuckoo Land)
Age: 17
Posts: 1,521
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There are a couple of thoughts with that 767 ditching accident.
1 - the captain was clobbered in the head with the crash axe
2- the 767 with dual engine flameout (due to fuel starvation in this case), has a RAT (Ram Air Turbine) which drops out to provide hydraulic power to the primary flight controls. To maintain sufficent hydraulic power there is a mimimum airspeed that has to be maintained ( I cant remember what that is). There was the possibility that combined with a wack to the head, and the hijackers on the flight deck with the struggle, that the airspeed dropped below the minimum, causing a wing drop.
1 - the captain was clobbered in the head with the crash axe
2- the 767 with dual engine flameout (due to fuel starvation in this case), has a RAT (Ram Air Turbine) which drops out to provide hydraulic power to the primary flight controls. To maintain sufficent hydraulic power there is a mimimum airspeed that has to be maintained ( I cant remember what that is). There was the possibility that combined with a wack to the head, and the hijackers on the flight deck with the struggle, that the airspeed dropped below the minimum, causing a wing drop.
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: here there and everywhere
Posts: 898
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by chadwick
Question - how many successful ditchings have cause all passenger to actually be able to exit the aircraft in the manner describe. Be realistic folks, the flight deck have to have a flat calm mill pond to land without loosing engines and clipping wings to get the a/c hull to land in one piece and deploy the shoots! One has ones doubts about that, read the official report.
The reason for the suggestion it would be successful was shallow water but realistically
you are not going to be over those conditions in a normal situation.
Your training is there to make you feel comfortable in the situation and not alot more!
The reason for the suggestion it would be successful was shallow water but realistically
you are not going to be over those conditions in a normal situation.
Your training is there to make you feel comfortable in the situation and not alot more!
I don' know (and don't want to try it either) whether it would work out this way, but boeing have created these guidelines for the possible attitude of the a/c in "a pond" so I believe that if the situation was much worse almost definitely the rear doors would be impossible to operate anyway.
I said it, the 737 is a funny aircraft, but very unlikely flies at a distance from the continent that would make you consider not being able to reach an airport during an emergency. Unless it's something clearly catastrophic and then it would be a good time to do some serious praying
FBW
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Going back to the EA762 Incident;
It was pretty successful given what was going on, though it could have gone better had the wings been level on landing, because when it hit the water, one of the wing-tips turned the a/c around.
Now that much Aircraft, doing a 360 at that speed, in such a short turning circle meant the ac broke up far more easily than it would have done, had just the engines touched the water and scooped up the water.
Although, like I said, I've not idea what was happening on the flight deck for the pilot to have turned the plane like that - one of the terrorists could have been up to no good, etc.
Though even more passengers than this could have survived, had it been made more clear to them that they shouldn't have inflated their life jackets until outside the a/c - it's vital the pax know just how important that is.
It was pretty successful given what was going on, though it could have gone better had the wings been level on landing, because when it hit the water, one of the wing-tips turned the a/c around.
Now that much Aircraft, doing a 360 at that speed, in such a short turning circle meant the ac broke up far more easily than it would have done, had just the engines touched the water and scooped up the water.
Although, like I said, I've not idea what was happening on the flight deck for the pilot to have turned the plane like that - one of the terrorists could have been up to no good, etc.
Though even more passengers than this could have survived, had it been made more clear to them that they shouldn't have inflated their life jackets until outside the a/c - it's vital the pax know just how important that is.
Thread Starter
Inflating the live vests
Regarding inflating the jackets. One of the things PPRuNe taught me is to watch the demostration of safety equipment.
One of the local airlines say nothing about when to inflate the jackets the other say "inflate as you leave the aircraft". It seems the first mentions about jackets inflation on the pre-ditching briefing.
My visit at the pool was useful for me because I have not realise the meaning of inflate the jacket as you leave the a/c. I thought it was ok to inflate once you were on the water but now I understand and have a visual on the notion of pulling the tabs as you step out of the sill.
Rwy in Sight
One of the local airlines say nothing about when to inflate the jackets the other say "inflate as you leave the aircraft". It seems the first mentions about jackets inflation on the pre-ditching briefing.
My visit at the pool was useful for me because I have not realise the meaning of inflate the jacket as you leave the a/c. I thought it was ok to inflate once you were on the water but now I understand and have a visual on the notion of pulling the tabs as you step out of the sill.
Rwy in Sight
