Willie Walsh's CC plans
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
1. £35 CAT payment.
YES. THIS MAY GET THE CHOP IN THE LONG TERM.
2. Payment for working crew member down.
YES. AS PER VIRGIN AND MANY OTHER SCHEDULED AIRLINES.
3. Very generous box payments on long haul. VERY GENEROUS? MAYBE...IF YOU ARE LUCKY TO GET THE 'HIGHEST BOX' OR SEVERAL A MONTH. THESE ARE ONLY PAID FOR LONG RANGE FLIGHTS.
NO OTHER UK BASED AIRLINE HAS A SIMILAR ROUTE NETWORK TO BA SO YOU CAN'T REALLY MAKE COMPARISONS HERE. THANK GOD FOR THESE LONG RANGE PAYMENTS. PAID ON TOP OF OUR WHOOPING SALARY OF £10,500 P.A.
DON'T FORGET, FLIGHTS WITH 'BOX PAYMENTS' ARE IN THE MINORITY. MANY ROUTES HAVE DIRE ALLOWENCES. (EG. 3 DAY EAST COASTS APPROX £100. BOM/DEL APPROX £70 FOR A 3 DAY TRIP. MOST OF MIDDLE EAST/AFRICA: LOW ALLOWENCES, NO BOX PAYMENT)
4. Double Allowences paid/Disruption Agreement.
AGREED. MOST OF US WERE HAPPY THAT THE DISRUPTION AGREEMENT WAS RATIFIED BY MANAGEMENT AND THE UNIONS. WHAT CONSTITUTES 'DISRUPTION' IS DECIDED ON THE DAY BETWEEN THE UNIONS AND BA OPS. THE UNION HAS THE FINAL SAY AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THE DISRUPTION AGREEMENT IS IMPLEMENTED ON THE DAY.
5. A321 no CSD/CSD and Purser on B757.
TOTALLY AGREE. I THINK IT IS CRAZY TO NEED BOTH A CSD AND A PURSER ON A SINGLE AISLED A/C (ESPECIALLY WHEN BOTH OF THEM TAKE A/C OUT IN CHARGE).
Contrary to common belief, the unions are working well with BA management on most issues. Instead of management dictating where the cuts must be made, they have given the unions the amount that needs to be cut (£70M) and working together to decide where they want to make the cuts.
YES. THIS MAY GET THE CHOP IN THE LONG TERM.
2. Payment for working crew member down.
YES. AS PER VIRGIN AND MANY OTHER SCHEDULED AIRLINES.
3. Very generous box payments on long haul. VERY GENEROUS? MAYBE...IF YOU ARE LUCKY TO GET THE 'HIGHEST BOX' OR SEVERAL A MONTH. THESE ARE ONLY PAID FOR LONG RANGE FLIGHTS.
NO OTHER UK BASED AIRLINE HAS A SIMILAR ROUTE NETWORK TO BA SO YOU CAN'T REALLY MAKE COMPARISONS HERE. THANK GOD FOR THESE LONG RANGE PAYMENTS. PAID ON TOP OF OUR WHOOPING SALARY OF £10,500 P.A.
DON'T FORGET, FLIGHTS WITH 'BOX PAYMENTS' ARE IN THE MINORITY. MANY ROUTES HAVE DIRE ALLOWENCES. (EG. 3 DAY EAST COASTS APPROX £100. BOM/DEL APPROX £70 FOR A 3 DAY TRIP. MOST OF MIDDLE EAST/AFRICA: LOW ALLOWENCES, NO BOX PAYMENT)
4. Double Allowences paid/Disruption Agreement.
AGREED. MOST OF US WERE HAPPY THAT THE DISRUPTION AGREEMENT WAS RATIFIED BY MANAGEMENT AND THE UNIONS. WHAT CONSTITUTES 'DISRUPTION' IS DECIDED ON THE DAY BETWEEN THE UNIONS AND BA OPS. THE UNION HAS THE FINAL SAY AS TO WHETHER OR NOT THE DISRUPTION AGREEMENT IS IMPLEMENTED ON THE DAY.
5. A321 no CSD/CSD and Purser on B757.
TOTALLY AGREE. I THINK IT IS CRAZY TO NEED BOTH A CSD AND A PURSER ON A SINGLE AISLED A/C (ESPECIALLY WHEN BOTH OF THEM TAKE A/C OUT IN CHARGE).
Contrary to common belief, the unions are working well with BA management on most issues. Instead of management dictating where the cuts must be made, they have given the unions the amount that needs to be cut (£70M) and working together to decide where they want to make the cuts.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
1. Might? There ain't no CAT lounge in T5!
2. I believe Virgin get £10 each way for every crew member they work down. One down on a jumbo they get £20 for the round trip. BA crew will only work one down, regardless of passenger load, and are paid £186 for the inconvenience. Pursers and CSDs get more.
3. £200 for an extra box on a HKG. I know because they keep asking me to slow down! As for "NO OTHER UK BASED AIRLINE HAS A SIMILAR ROUTE NETWORK TO BA SO YOU CAN'T REALLY MAKE COMPARISONS HERE. THANK GOD FOR THESE LONG RANGE PAYMENTS. PAID ON TOP OF OUR WHOOPING SALARY OF £10,500 P.A. " it would seem Virgin Atlantic have dissappeared between your responses to points 2 and 3. They don't get an extra £200 for being 15 minutes late. I think their basic is lower too. There are plenty of lucrative routes on BAs network. Box payments on NRTx2, PEK, PVG, HKG x3,SINx2, BKK, LAXx3, SFOx2, MEX, GRU, JNBx2 and CPTx2. The far east trips have very good allowances too.
2. I believe Virgin get £10 each way for every crew member they work down. One down on a jumbo they get £20 for the round trip. BA crew will only work one down, regardless of passenger load, and are paid £186 for the inconvenience. Pursers and CSDs get more.
3. £200 for an extra box on a HKG. I know because they keep asking me to slow down! As for "NO OTHER UK BASED AIRLINE HAS A SIMILAR ROUTE NETWORK TO BA SO YOU CAN'T REALLY MAKE COMPARISONS HERE. THANK GOD FOR THESE LONG RANGE PAYMENTS. PAID ON TOP OF OUR WHOOPING SALARY OF £10,500 P.A. " it would seem Virgin Atlantic have dissappeared between your responses to points 2 and 3. They don't get an extra £200 for being 15 minutes late. I think their basic is lower too. There are plenty of lucrative routes on BAs network. Box payments on NRTx2, PEK, PVG, HKG x3,SINx2, BKK, LAXx3, SFOx2, MEX, GRU, JNBx2 and CPTx2. The far east trips have very good allowances too.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
Cabin crew get paid extra according to how long a sector is. As you pass certain thresholds you trigger a box payment. The payments are based upon actual sector length rather than planned length. The shorthaul equivalent is the CAT payment. They require about 3.5 hours for a turnaround at LHR, but will reduce to about 2 if they go to the Central Area Turnaround (CAT) lounge and get a CAT payment. Again these payments are based on achieved, not planned schedule. This is why often the first words the pilots will hear from the cabin crew are not "Hello" but "We need to be 20 minutes late".
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
A 'box payment' is a payment made for a long range sector. It is on a sliding scale and paid per sector. It ranges from about £100 for the lowest box up to about £220 for the highest box. BA defines a long range duty as 12.00hrs+ (night duty) or 12.5hrs + (day duty).
Handsolo::
Firstly, I have not missed out Virgin in my examples. The general consensus on many a pprune thread is that Virgin are pretty damn underpaid as far as airlines go, with many LCC and charter crews walking away with more at the end of the month.
How could you possibly compare VS route network to ours??. Apart from the 1 x daily NRT/HKG/PVG/DEL/BOM/SYD which they operate (with a MUCH higher ICC locally based crew ratio than us) all their flights are either straight down on westwards. So please, they have no where near the amount of east-west flying we do. BA eastwards: 3 x daily to HKG, 2 x daily to NRT, 2 x daily to BOM, 2 x daily to SIN, BKK, Syd, MEL, pakistan, more cities in india, nearly every city in the middle east.......
As for the difference in 'crew member down' payments. Perhaps that is why they often work a crew member down and BA DO NOT.
I know this because I am ex Virgin myself. We were always crew members down, running around like crazy trying to get the job done. Being nable to deliver what VS promises and also bear the brunt of the passengers dissatisfaction.
Since I have been on WW LHR (2.5 years) I have never operated a crew member down.
And who benefits most for this? The customer! Have a look at the Skytrax website at airlinequality.com. Read the 'customer opinions' of both Virgin and BA and compare! When I was at Virgin we had some amazing crew but we could only do so much on the aircraft constantly working crew members down and receiving little rest and much disruption...all for peanuts!
Actually, the VS basic salary is quite a bit more than BA's now days although BA's allowences continue to be better.
You are very quick to point out all the routes we get a 'Box' for. The double daily NRT (with 4 Japanese based crew) the 3 x daily HKG etc etc.
But you conveniently forget the 7 x daily JFK flights, the 4 x daily EWR flights, the 3 x daily ORD flights, the 3 x daily BOS flights, the 2-3 x daily MIA flights, the 3 x daily IAD flights, flights to philly/baltimore/detroit, 2 x daily YYZ/ the YUL, daily flights to nearly every city in the mid-east, double daily to BOM, delhi, islamabad, cairo, much of africa. Box payments are not paid. Now what do you think our rosters mainly consist of? SIN followed by HKG followed by NRT??? Think again!
Its more like JFK followed by DTW follwed by BOM followed by MAYBE the sniff of a Box 1 LAX or something.
As for "I know this becuase they keep on asking me to slow down...." No we don't! We rather leave a fifteen minute delay to chance as we know soon as you guys are told you put your feet to the floor and speed up!
Handsolo::
Firstly, I have not missed out Virgin in my examples. The general consensus on many a pprune thread is that Virgin are pretty damn underpaid as far as airlines go, with many LCC and charter crews walking away with more at the end of the month.
How could you possibly compare VS route network to ours??. Apart from the 1 x daily NRT/HKG/PVG/DEL/BOM/SYD which they operate (with a MUCH higher ICC locally based crew ratio than us) all their flights are either straight down on westwards. So please, they have no where near the amount of east-west flying we do. BA eastwards: 3 x daily to HKG, 2 x daily to NRT, 2 x daily to BOM, 2 x daily to SIN, BKK, Syd, MEL, pakistan, more cities in india, nearly every city in the middle east.......
As for the difference in 'crew member down' payments. Perhaps that is why they often work a crew member down and BA DO NOT.
I know this because I am ex Virgin myself. We were always crew members down, running around like crazy trying to get the job done. Being nable to deliver what VS promises and also bear the brunt of the passengers dissatisfaction.
Since I have been on WW LHR (2.5 years) I have never operated a crew member down.
And who benefits most for this? The customer! Have a look at the Skytrax website at airlinequality.com. Read the 'customer opinions' of both Virgin and BA and compare! When I was at Virgin we had some amazing crew but we could only do so much on the aircraft constantly working crew members down and receiving little rest and much disruption...all for peanuts!
Actually, the VS basic salary is quite a bit more than BA's now days although BA's allowences continue to be better.
You are very quick to point out all the routes we get a 'Box' for. The double daily NRT (with 4 Japanese based crew) the 3 x daily HKG etc etc.
But you conveniently forget the 7 x daily JFK flights, the 4 x daily EWR flights, the 3 x daily ORD flights, the 3 x daily BOS flights, the 2-3 x daily MIA flights, the 3 x daily IAD flights, flights to philly/baltimore/detroit, 2 x daily YYZ/ the YUL, daily flights to nearly every city in the mid-east, double daily to BOM, delhi, islamabad, cairo, much of africa. Box payments are not paid. Now what do you think our rosters mainly consist of? SIN followed by HKG followed by NRT??? Think again!
Its more like JFK followed by DTW follwed by BOM followed by MAYBE the sniff of a Box 1 LAX or something.
As for "I know this becuase they keep on asking me to slow down...." No we don't! We rather leave a fifteen minute delay to chance as we know soon as you guys are told you put your feet to the floor and speed up!
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
PS. Didnt BA flight crew used to get box payments and CAT payments which they gave up in return for an increase in their basic pensionable pay?
How much does the average 747 captain earn?
How many days off per month (on average) does a S/H pilot get?
How much does the average 747 captain earn?
How many days off per month (on average) does a S/H pilot get?
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
There may have been box payments for flight crew but not in the last ten years. There were never CAT payments. The pay restructuring you allude to was funded by putting meal allowances into an hourly rate and resulted in adjustments (up and down) in gross but not pensionable pay.
The average 747 Captain earns the benchmark pay for a 747 Captain in KLM, Lufthansa and Air France but flies between 15 and 25% more hours p.a. compared to them.
I don't know how many days off per month a short haul pilot gets but I bet he flies a lot more hours per month and sectors (ie doing work) than the average short haul hostie.
You can't really compare BA to VS then say "apart from all the eastbound work they only go south or west". Virgins flying is as equally weighted to going west as hours, pus we fly to many middle east destinations which are 'easy' in jet lag terms. We also do much more of Africa than them. I can only speak for my personal experience but I regularly go east then west or vice versa with less than the 3 local nights you get for rest and it's really no bother.
BTW, you forget to mention the B2B payment for doing all those east coasters. Destination payments too.
The average 747 Captain earns the benchmark pay for a 747 Captain in KLM, Lufthansa and Air France but flies between 15 and 25% more hours p.a. compared to them.
I don't know how many days off per month a short haul pilot gets but I bet he flies a lot more hours per month and sectors (ie doing work) than the average short haul hostie.
You can't really compare BA to VS then say "apart from all the eastbound work they only go south or west". Virgins flying is as equally weighted to going west as hours, pus we fly to many middle east destinations which are 'easy' in jet lag terms. We also do much more of Africa than them. I can only speak for my personal experience but I regularly go east then west or vice versa with less than the 3 local nights you get for rest and it's really no bother.
BTW, you forget to mention the B2B payment for doing all those east coasters. Destination payments too.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
I believe our (cabin crew) salaries would also be in the region of our collegues at KLM, Air France, Iberia and Lufthansa. Actually, I know AF's are considerably better, not just in money terms but also in conditions.
But that is the irony....when comparisons are made with cabin crew money/t&c's its always VIRGIN stews only get paid this much and do that much work....'.
When comparing the flight crews its a "benchmark to KL, AF and LH".
I was not suggesting that we do more eastbound flying than west, I was just pointing out that the majority of the flying we do has no Box payments.
Ahh bugger it, I think i should just give up and start a new post: "Why do BA Flight Crew hate their Cabin crew so much and feel the need to complain about their T&C's??
Handsolo we all know that their are some selfish prima donnas in the cabin crew community, and us hosties will be the FIRST to cringe when they start off about how over-worked and under-paid they are. And yes, they can leave a sour taste in the mouth.
But the majority of us these days have come to BA from other airlines and truely appreciate the company we work for and are just trying to do a good job, and yes we are paid more than the industry average, but maybe thats why so many of us leave other airlines to come to BA? Maybe thats why so many stay at BA and give their all to keep passengers coming back and making a sustainable future for ourselves and BA?
We all know that changes will come, many will be inevitable. Not just for us, but you as well. For reservations, airport staff, baggage handlers and drivers.
Just don't throw us all in the same batch. The majority of us are not all about 'take take take'. We all want jobs in ten years time. But by the same token we don't want to be taken the p*ss out of either.
But that is the irony....when comparisons are made with cabin crew money/t&c's its always VIRGIN stews only get paid this much and do that much work....'.
When comparing the flight crews its a "benchmark to KL, AF and LH".
I was not suggesting that we do more eastbound flying than west, I was just pointing out that the majority of the flying we do has no Box payments.
Ahh bugger it, I think i should just give up and start a new post: "Why do BA Flight Crew hate their Cabin crew so much and feel the need to complain about their T&C's??
Handsolo we all know that their are some selfish prima donnas in the cabin crew community, and us hosties will be the FIRST to cringe when they start off about how over-worked and under-paid they are. And yes, they can leave a sour taste in the mouth.
But the majority of us these days have come to BA from other airlines and truely appreciate the company we work for and are just trying to do a good job, and yes we are paid more than the industry average, but maybe thats why so many of us leave other airlines to come to BA? Maybe thats why so many stay at BA and give their all to keep passengers coming back and making a sustainable future for ourselves and BA?
We all know that changes will come, many will be inevitable. Not just for us, but you as well. For reservations, airport staff, baggage handlers and drivers.
Just don't throw us all in the same batch. The majority of us are not all about 'take take take'. We all want jobs in ten years time. But by the same token we don't want to be taken the p*ss out of either.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
I would just like to point out to those who are reading this thread whatever we call certain types of payment is irrelevant,they made no sense to me when I started either!!.
I would also like to point out that it was BA management who asked the Unions both CC89 and BASSA to sign both the Long Range and Back to Back agreements.
Yes I feel very lucky for the pay I get and the T&C's (and need to fight to hold on to!!)I have and maybe that's still why many crew from other airlines apply to BA.
In general I feel I work with very professional crew who I feel are mature and will react well in an emergency,but there are always the few who need a rocket up their ****!!
.
The one thing I won't do on an open forum is come into someone's part of the forum and constantly take swipes at my own colleagues.As regards asking for 15 minutes for this and that payment a Captain made it very claer to my crew when he said ''I fly to get passengers from A to B on time if not early''.I could only agree.I have never seen any pilot from BA openly talk about how much they get paid on DRAFT or FORCED DRAFT.I think all would find those figures even more breathtaking than the figures for the above mentioned cabin crew payments
.
Yes we get good box and B2B payments because we don't sell our conditions too easily.Maybe if we had some of our extras included into our basic we may now be on the hourly rate(which I am not against).BA would not even consider a chock to chock payment for cabin crew like the pilots, just the flat rate.
As Keeperboy has said there have been plenty of positive talks between both cabin crew unions and BA and there are some more going on at the moment.All sides must realise change is needed and we as cabin crew must realise that we will lose money when T5 arrives, with reducion in box payments.Yes the few quid we lose personally will be felt by all but if the overall savings made by the company together with things like missed connections keep us in business,then we all get paid next month.BA is still not out of the mess.Don't forget when we mess up we don't have Chapter 11 to bail us out year after year!!.
Cabin crew have been asking for a better choice of lifestyle more to the point some sort of say in what they do.WorldWide have asked for a bid system similar to flight crew and an ability to bid for a single days laeve rather than blocks of four when you don't need them.However BA will not even look at this until we accept the hourly rate.Hopefully both sides can make some headway on this.
The refreshing thing is when downroute 99.9% of our pilots if they have an opinion on the earnings of the cabin crew do not express it because they're either very polite and know it's not their concern anyway or as normal getting the first round in
.Mine's normally the second.
In-fighting on an open forum does not show us in a good light,in fact a false light.
WTDWL.
I would also like to point out that it was BA management who asked the Unions both CC89 and BASSA to sign both the Long Range and Back to Back agreements.
Yes I feel very lucky for the pay I get and the T&C's (and need to fight to hold on to!!)I have and maybe that's still why many crew from other airlines apply to BA.
In general I feel I work with very professional crew who I feel are mature and will react well in an emergency,but there are always the few who need a rocket up their ****!!
.The one thing I won't do on an open forum is come into someone's part of the forum and constantly take swipes at my own colleagues.As regards asking for 15 minutes for this and that payment a Captain made it very claer to my crew when he said ''I fly to get passengers from A to B on time if not early''.I could only agree.I have never seen any pilot from BA openly talk about how much they get paid on DRAFT or FORCED DRAFT.I think all would find those figures even more breathtaking than the figures for the above mentioned cabin crew payments
.Yes we get good box and B2B payments because we don't sell our conditions too easily.Maybe if we had some of our extras included into our basic we may now be on the hourly rate(which I am not against).BA would not even consider a chock to chock payment for cabin crew like the pilots, just the flat rate.
As Keeperboy has said there have been plenty of positive talks between both cabin crew unions and BA and there are some more going on at the moment.All sides must realise change is needed and we as cabin crew must realise that we will lose money when T5 arrives, with reducion in box payments.Yes the few quid we lose personally will be felt by all but if the overall savings made by the company together with things like missed connections keep us in business,then we all get paid next month.BA is still not out of the mess.Don't forget when we mess up we don't have Chapter 11 to bail us out year after year!!.
Cabin crew have been asking for a better choice of lifestyle more to the point some sort of say in what they do.WorldWide have asked for a bid system similar to flight crew and an ability to bid for a single days laeve rather than blocks of four when you don't need them.However BA will not even look at this until we accept the hourly rate.Hopefully both sides can make some headway on this.
The refreshing thing is when downroute 99.9% of our pilots if they have an opinion on the earnings of the cabin crew do not express it because they're either very polite and know it's not their concern anyway or as normal getting the first round in
.Mine's normally the second. In-fighting on an open forum does not show us in a good light,in fact a false light.
WTDWL.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
You'll find the rates for draft and force draft are exactly the same. They are both time and a half, which is not unreasonable for overtime, especially as it may be compulsory overtime. Incidentally, my hourly rate for flying a 747 is £8 per hour more than I paid the VW technician for fixing my car!
Robbing gits!
Anyway, the second round isn't yours, it's mine. And a couple of later ones when people are flagging a bit. And a nightcap in my room for everyone (no I don't want to shag you, it really is just a drink).
Robbing gits!Anyway, the second round isn't yours, it's mine.
And a couple of later ones when people are flagging a bit. And a nightcap in my room for everyone (no I don't want to shag you, it really is just a drink).
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
No shagging Solo ,I keep to the saying ''don't dip the payslip''.
You sound like good value on a nightstop,maybe a couple of late one's in 'Andys Bar' SFO
.
Who's engines do you feel better with is the question,the one in your overpriced VW or the RR's strapped to the wings?.
WTDWL.
.You sound like good value on a nightstop,maybe a couple of late one's in 'Andys Bar' SFO
.Who's engines do you feel better with is the question,the one in your overpriced VW or the RR's strapped to the wings?.
WTDWL.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
I did a FCO there and back not long ago and the Captain had been force drafted. He happily told us that he was getting a GRAND for 8 hours work. He also told us that the 3 day trip he had on volontary draft was going to pay for his skiing holiday.
Just to clarify something for some of the people who post here without having a clue what they are talking about, CAT payments do not exist! We are not paid for going to the CAT lounge. They are Short Turnaround Payments and we will continue to get them in T5 unless there is a major change in agreements. Even if, as threatened, we start getting fixed link, we will still be getting the payment.
As for the bit about CSDs and pursers on A321 and 757, I have to agree there that it is not neccesary to have 2 senior crew on those aircraft. Last time I worked with a purser at the back of a 757 it was a disaster, he simply didn't have a clue what to do as he wasn't used to an economy service, we could have coped much better alone as we usually do.
Just to clarify something for some of the people who post here without having a clue what they are talking about, CAT payments do not exist! We are not paid for going to the CAT lounge. They are Short Turnaround Payments and we will continue to get them in T5 unless there is a major change in agreements. Even if, as threatened, we start getting fixed link, we will still be getting the payment.
As for the bit about CSDs and pursers on A321 and 757, I have to agree there that it is not neccesary to have 2 senior crew on those aircraft. Last time I worked with a purser at the back of a 757 it was a disaster, he simply didn't have a clue what to do as he wasn't used to an economy service, we could have coped much better alone as we usually do.
Junior trash
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
I did a FCO there and back not long ago and the Captain had been force drafted. He happily told us that he was getting a GRAND for 8 hours work.
500 quid if was lucky, before tax. He's only be paid for the flying not duty. Draft is 1.5 x hourly rate which is basically pensionable salary /1043. He'd have to have been on over 250000 for that to work for a 5hr rome. And he must have been skiing at the local dry slopes too!
How much is your day off worth?
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
They are Short Turnaround Payments and we will continue to get them in T5 unless there is a major change in agreements.
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Solo, 'competent' and 'negotiator/manager' at BA, are like 'happily' and 'married', a total contradiction.
Calm down it's no good for your blood pressure .
WTDWL.
Calm down it's no good for your blood pressure
.WTDWL.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
[QUOTE=Hand Solo]Exactly. Your agreement says you go to Compass[QUOTE]
Total rubbish, the agreement says nothing of the sort. I'm not going into details (none of your business) but I will say that the agreement is to do with the amount of time between sectors, not where the crew go for their break.
Total rubbish, the agreement says nothing of the sort. I'm not going into details (none of your business) but I will say that the agreement is to do with the amount of time between sectors, not where the crew go for their break.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
Fair enough. You'll have no objection to going to CAT every turnaround then, no matter how long? That'll save some bus drivers. Where does your agreement say you report and clear? Still think it won't need a re-write?
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
Hand solo, what does "where we report and clear" have to do with anything?
Personally I would happily go to the CAT every turnaround, it would mean we'd have less messing about with buses and more time to eat/sleep/watch TV etc...
Personally I would happily go to the CAT every turnaround, it would mean we'd have less messing about with buses and more time to eat/sleep/watch TV etc...
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
If it says Compass in your agreement then your agreement gets rewritten when we go to T5. Then we're back to the position of two posts ago when the horse-trading starts. You didn't really expect them to just take out the old agreement, cross out where it says Compass and replace it with T5 did you? Or have you missed the 'Fit for 5' slogans that have been plastered around BA premises for the last 3 years? That applies to you too.
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Re: Willie Walsh's CC plans
The EF CC, when asked, often cite the need to have a break from the passengers as the reason why they need to go to Compass/CAT lounge when transitting LHR.
I ask one question, why then can you do a LHR-ARN-LHR (for example) with a 40 minute turnaround, but not a ARN-LHR-ARN (for example) with the same 40 minute turnaround?
Clearly the break in LHR has absolutely nothing to do with the need to get away from passengers for a while and everything to do with archaic practises of the type WW is vowed torid the airline.
I ask one question, why then can you do a LHR-ARN-LHR (for example) with a 40 minute turnaround, but not a ARN-LHR-ARN (for example) with the same 40 minute turnaround?
Clearly the break in LHR has absolutely nothing to do with the need to get away from passengers for a while and everything to do with archaic practises of the type WW is vowed torid the airline.