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Qantas to Increase Services to New York Latest News
Sydney, 30 November 2005
Qantas announced today that it would increase the number of services it operates to New York from three to five per week from 27 February 2006.
The Executive General Manager of Qantas, Mr John Borghetti, said the addition of two extra services each week, operating from Sydney via Los Angeles, would provide customers with additional choices for travel to New York.
"In particular, it will provide Australian businesses with better access to markets on the US East Coast."
Mr Borghetti said the additional New York services would operate into JFK Airport on Mondays and Saturdays using three-class Boeing 747-400 aircraft with Qantas' award winning Skybed in business class.
Qantas currently operates services to New York on Wednesdays, Fridays and Sundays.
Mr Borghetti said that in recent weeks Qantas had announced direct flights from Australia to San Francisco and had also added nine extra services from Sydney to Los Angeles between December 2005 and February 2006 to cater for peak season demand.
In addition to the 18 Qantas services operating between Los Angeles and Sydney each week, passengers travelling from New York to Los Angeles could also transfer to Qantas services operating to Brisbane and Melbourne.
Issued by Qantas Corporate Communication (Q3361)
Sydney, 30 November 2005
Qantas announced today that it would increase the number of services it operates to New York from three to five per week from 27 February 2006.
The Executive General Manager of Qantas, Mr John Borghetti, said the addition of two extra services each week, operating from Sydney via Los Angeles, would provide customers with additional choices for travel to New York.
"In particular, it will provide Australian businesses with better access to markets on the US East Coast."
Mr Borghetti said the additional New York services would operate into JFK Airport on Mondays and Saturdays using three-class Boeing 747-400 aircraft with Qantas' award winning Skybed in business class.
Qantas currently operates services to New York on Wednesdays, Fridays and Sundays.
Mr Borghetti said that in recent weeks Qantas had announced direct flights from Australia to San Francisco and had also added nine extra services from Sydney to Los Angeles between December 2005 and February 2006 to cater for peak season demand.
In addition to the 18 Qantas services operating between Los Angeles and Sydney each week, passengers travelling from New York to Los Angeles could also transfer to Qantas services operating to Brisbane and Melbourne.
Issued by Qantas Corporate Communication (Q3361)
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great...so no crew rest on flights under 6hrs?
OR...does that mean duty time. Just wondering because on a per return its an 11hr duty but both sectors are under 6hrs.
Or the nasty ADL - AKL returns that you get picked up at 9pm and dont get back into your hotel room till 10am the next day. Crew rest gone as well?!
Who makes these calls?? Someone who hasn't needed a crew rest i bet!
OR...does that mean duty time. Just wondering because on a per return its an 11hr duty but both sectors are under 6hrs.
Or the nasty ADL - AKL returns that you get picked up at 9pm and dont get back into your hotel room till 10am the next day. Crew rest gone as well?!
Who makes these calls?? Someone who hasn't needed a crew rest i bet!
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30 November 2005
Attention all Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
CROSS DIVISIONAL TRANSFERS OF CUSTOMER SERVICE MANAGERS - UPDATE
On 25 November we issued a newsletter on this subject. We have received a few queries about this issue, which sadly indicate crew are not taking the time to actually read newsletters, but seem satisfied to listen to rumour instead.
In simple terms the agreement by both Divisions of the FAAA and Qantas can be summed up in the following points:
1. THE AGREEMENT ONLY ALLOWS A CSM SWAP TO OCCUR BETWEEN DIVISIONS I.E. 1 CSM GOES FROM ONE DIVISION AND A CORRESPONDING CSM COMES OVER FROM THE OTHER DIVISION. PROMOTIONS AND BASE TRANSFERS WITHIN EACH DIVISION ARE TOTALLY UNAFFECTED BY THIS ARRANGEMENT.
2. A CSM cannot transfer over into another Division, under this arrangement, and take up a promotional vacancy in the other Division. THAT MEANS IF WE HAVE VACANCIES FOR CSM’S IN LONG HAUL, A SHORT HAUL CSM CANNOT TRANSFER OVER AND TAKE A PROMOTIONAL VACANCY SLOT OR VICE VERSA.
3. Promotional prospects are not affected in any way by the new agreement. Promotions continue to be governed by the agreed EBA mechanism.
4. Transfers between our bases will not be affected in any way either. They will continue to be done under the agreed process that has operated since our bases were established. THIS MEANS NO CSM IN SHORT HAUL CAN JUMP OVER SOMEONE IN THIS DIVISION WANTING TO TRANSFER TO ANOTHER LONG HAUL BASE OR VICE VERSA.
5. Ex Long Haul or Short Haul crew that went to LHR and were promoted to a CSM in LHR cannot come back to Long Haul as a CSM. ALSO, CSM’S FROM SHORT HAUL WHO WENT UP TO LHR CANNOT TRANSFER DIRECTLY INTO LONG HAUL AS A CSM UPON RETURNING FROM LHR.
6. No “precedents” of any type have been set by this agreement. The FAAA has lawyers that work for it and crew can be assured that all our agreements are screened from the legal perspective, that’s why we employ Industrial Specialists with legal qualifications.
Hopefully, this newsletter will now clear any confusion about this issue. The new arrangement is a good and logical arrangement that will give further choice to Qantas cabin crew, irrespective of Division.
It is sad that when both Divisions of the FAAA work jointly to advantage ALL its members that some individuals are actively spreading misinformation for their own purposes.
I urge crew from now on to take time to read FAAA newsletters and if you have concerns or questions to give us a call rather than being misled by listening to rumours and nonsense.
Written and authorised by – Secretary International Division.
Attention all Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
CROSS DIVISIONAL TRANSFERS OF CUSTOMER SERVICE MANAGERS - UPDATE
On 25 November we issued a newsletter on this subject. We have received a few queries about this issue, which sadly indicate crew are not taking the time to actually read newsletters, but seem satisfied to listen to rumour instead.
In simple terms the agreement by both Divisions of the FAAA and Qantas can be summed up in the following points:
1. THE AGREEMENT ONLY ALLOWS A CSM SWAP TO OCCUR BETWEEN DIVISIONS I.E. 1 CSM GOES FROM ONE DIVISION AND A CORRESPONDING CSM COMES OVER FROM THE OTHER DIVISION. PROMOTIONS AND BASE TRANSFERS WITHIN EACH DIVISION ARE TOTALLY UNAFFECTED BY THIS ARRANGEMENT.
2. A CSM cannot transfer over into another Division, under this arrangement, and take up a promotional vacancy in the other Division. THAT MEANS IF WE HAVE VACANCIES FOR CSM’S IN LONG HAUL, A SHORT HAUL CSM CANNOT TRANSFER OVER AND TAKE A PROMOTIONAL VACANCY SLOT OR VICE VERSA.
3. Promotional prospects are not affected in any way by the new agreement. Promotions continue to be governed by the agreed EBA mechanism.
4. Transfers between our bases will not be affected in any way either. They will continue to be done under the agreed process that has operated since our bases were established. THIS MEANS NO CSM IN SHORT HAUL CAN JUMP OVER SOMEONE IN THIS DIVISION WANTING TO TRANSFER TO ANOTHER LONG HAUL BASE OR VICE VERSA.
5. Ex Long Haul or Short Haul crew that went to LHR and were promoted to a CSM in LHR cannot come back to Long Haul as a CSM. ALSO, CSM’S FROM SHORT HAUL WHO WENT UP TO LHR CANNOT TRANSFER DIRECTLY INTO LONG HAUL AS A CSM UPON RETURNING FROM LHR.
6. No “precedents” of any type have been set by this agreement. The FAAA has lawyers that work for it and crew can be assured that all our agreements are screened from the legal perspective, that’s why we employ Industrial Specialists with legal qualifications.
Hopefully, this newsletter will now clear any confusion about this issue. The new arrangement is a good and logical arrangement that will give further choice to Qantas cabin crew, irrespective of Division.
It is sad that when both Divisions of the FAAA work jointly to advantage ALL its members that some individuals are actively spreading misinformation for their own purposes.
I urge crew from now on to take time to read FAAA newsletters and if you have concerns or questions to give us a call rather than being misled by listening to rumours and nonsense.
Written and authorised by – Secretary International Division.
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yes Biscuit Chucker
Its the PER airport manager that is pushing the issue, sand gropers have always tried to get us to sell the crew seats on DOM sectors.
NOthing from the FAAA and they have known about this for over a week.
Zilch, nothing,,,,, hello FAAA are you going to issue anything.
Hold on better check the net and see!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOpe nothing, yet they are so quick to put out the stocking survey...... hey sisters, this is important! get off your @rse
Its the PER airport manager that is pushing the issue, sand gropers have always tried to get us to sell the crew seats on DOM sectors.
NOthing from the FAAA and they have known about this for over a week.
Zilch, nothing,,,,, hello FAAA are you going to issue anything.
Hold on better check the net and see!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NOpe nothing, yet they are so quick to put out the stocking survey...... hey sisters, this is important! get off your @rse
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Well, it appears as though the strategy of the faaa to appease the company is as successful as Neville Chamberlains attempt to appease Hitler with the Munich agreement.
The Faaa told us that we had to grant temporary dispensation or we would lose our jobs. This was supposed to be for 2 bid periods, it has now been 4 bid periods and we still have not had a vote. Yet the faaa has just sent out a voting ballot for election of councillors, why didn’t they put the JFK vote out at the same time. They can do the re- election vote with no problems but cannot fulfill their promise to hold other votes
With the appeasement strategy in place, what has the company done for us!!!
1 :Reduced the LHR slip from 3 days to 2 days
2:Reduced the Singapore slip at the end of a FRA trip from 48 hours to 24 hours.
3:Started selling crew rest seats on flights under a certain time frame (Illegal under our ironclad EBA)
4:Now even after the faaa's great strategy if giving in so we don't lose jobs ,the company has replaced 6 Australian based crew with AKL crew on JFK shuttles anyway...
So as Herr Hitler did with the British prime Minister, the company is doing with us thanks to the effective strategy of the faaa .The union has been aware of the plan to sell crew rest seats apparently with a letter from Suzanne Holden for at least a number of days and perhaps a week but the faaa still has not mentioned any of this on the faaa web site. Maybe the union members are deemed not important enough to inform.
I will re-print the newsletter from the faaa regarding the JFK dispensation (supposedly temporary) dated march 2005
THE FAAA HAS AGREED TO PROVIDE DISPENSATION TO QANTAS ON THE FOLLOWING BASIS:
1. The dispensation will operate for 2 bid periods, BP 239 and BP 240.
2. Patterns can be planned up to 14 hours 35 minutes.
3. The slip in LAX following the shuttle cannot be below 36 hours.
4. That the Company maintains slips for BP 238 to allow those who wish to slip in New York to bid for these trips for 1 more bid period. This also allows for crew feedback to reach the FAAA.
5. Dispensation will be reviewed during the 2 bid periods. If cabin crew feedback indicates majority opposition to the dispensation, it will be revoked following the completion of BP 240. We will also be able to ascertain whether the shuttles will be desired trips and actually bid for, bearing in mind these patterns will be relatively high hour trips which are often keenly sought after.
So if the faaa can tell me how their strategy of giving in has worked,because I for one can't see it !!!!!
When will the FAAA learn that giving in to the company is an exercise in futility? If the FAAA think that the company thinks better of us for trying to accommodate them then they are deluding themselves .
The company is like a drug addict, they cannot stop and will not stop unless someone else shows them the folly of what they are doing and you cannot do that by giving them what they want because they will want more and more and more!!!!!!!
FAAA's new motto.....
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
The Faaa told us that we had to grant temporary dispensation or we would lose our jobs. This was supposed to be for 2 bid periods, it has now been 4 bid periods and we still have not had a vote. Yet the faaa has just sent out a voting ballot for election of councillors, why didn’t they put the JFK vote out at the same time. They can do the re- election vote with no problems but cannot fulfill their promise to hold other votes
With the appeasement strategy in place, what has the company done for us!!!
1 :Reduced the LHR slip from 3 days to 2 days
2:Reduced the Singapore slip at the end of a FRA trip from 48 hours to 24 hours.
3:Started selling crew rest seats on flights under a certain time frame (Illegal under our ironclad EBA)
4:Now even after the faaa's great strategy if giving in so we don't lose jobs ,the company has replaced 6 Australian based crew with AKL crew on JFK shuttles anyway...
So as Herr Hitler did with the British prime Minister, the company is doing with us thanks to the effective strategy of the faaa .The union has been aware of the plan to sell crew rest seats apparently with a letter from Suzanne Holden for at least a number of days and perhaps a week but the faaa still has not mentioned any of this on the faaa web site. Maybe the union members are deemed not important enough to inform.
I will re-print the newsletter from the faaa regarding the JFK dispensation (supposedly temporary) dated march 2005
THE FAAA HAS AGREED TO PROVIDE DISPENSATION TO QANTAS ON THE FOLLOWING BASIS:
1. The dispensation will operate for 2 bid periods, BP 239 and BP 240.
2. Patterns can be planned up to 14 hours 35 minutes.
3. The slip in LAX following the shuttle cannot be below 36 hours.
4. That the Company maintains slips for BP 238 to allow those who wish to slip in New York to bid for these trips for 1 more bid period. This also allows for crew feedback to reach the FAAA.
5. Dispensation will be reviewed during the 2 bid periods. If cabin crew feedback indicates majority opposition to the dispensation, it will be revoked following the completion of BP 240. We will also be able to ascertain whether the shuttles will be desired trips and actually bid for, bearing in mind these patterns will be relatively high hour trips which are often keenly sought after.
So if the faaa can tell me how their strategy of giving in has worked,because I for one can't see it !!!!!
When will the FAAA learn that giving in to the company is an exercise in futility? If the FAAA think that the company thinks better of us for trying to accommodate them then they are deluding themselves .
The company is like a drug addict, they cannot stop and will not stop unless someone else shows them the folly of what they are doing and you cannot do that by giving them what they want because they will want more and more and more!!!!!!!
FAAA's new motto.....
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
Last edited by lowerlobe; 30th Nov 2005 at 20:28.
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From the Financial review...
In rough terms a Jetstar pilot
earns $120,000 a year in base
pay, a Virgin pilot $150,000,a
Qantas pilot on the same route
$250,000, and a Qantas
International pilot up to $440,000.
Qantas plans to expand Jetstar to
so-called international leisure routes
like Vietnam, and if you wondered
how it cuts costs in doing so, the
rough estimates on pilot salaries are
a guide.
They also explain why the Qantas
pilots are readying for a fight on
their working agreements and why
Qantas is ready for them.
JOHN DURIE
The tech crew however like the faaa,threw in the towel and voted up their EBA...Darth Dixon is still laughing. Bring on Jet Star International and pay Jetstar techies to get a 3 week conversion and they can fly the A380 instead of mainline techies for less than half the pay
Her's another quote from a techie about pay scales...
"I find it an absolute disgrace that there are senior cabin attendants in long haul who are earning more than Dash 8 Captains. There are lessons to be learned there."
I think that they might have a bit more to worry about now than how much senior cabin crew make !!!
In rough terms a Jetstar pilot
earns $120,000 a year in base
pay, a Virgin pilot $150,000,a
Qantas pilot on the same route
$250,000, and a Qantas
International pilot up to $440,000.
Qantas plans to expand Jetstar to
so-called international leisure routes
like Vietnam, and if you wondered
how it cuts costs in doing so, the
rough estimates on pilot salaries are
a guide.
They also explain why the Qantas
pilots are readying for a fight on
their working agreements and why
Qantas is ready for them.
JOHN DURIE
The tech crew however like the faaa,threw in the towel and voted up their EBA...Darth Dixon is still laughing. Bring on Jet Star International and pay Jetstar techies to get a 3 week conversion and they can fly the A380 instead of mainline techies for less than half the pay
Her's another quote from a techie about pay scales...
"I find it an absolute disgrace that there are senior cabin attendants in long haul who are earning more than Dash 8 Captains. There are lessons to be learned there."
I think that they might have a bit more to worry about now than how much senior cabin crew make !!!
Last edited by lowerlobe; 30th Nov 2005 at 20:14.
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Qantas Jetconnect
Heard Qantas Long Haul (JC) Are recruiting for long haul flight Attendants, anyone know how much they pay per year?
Payed fortnightly or monthly,
Do they fly to other places apart from syd,bne,ADL, Mel, LAX,JO BERG, Shanghai, Hawaii?
Heard the conditions are really bad, not worth applying, get treated like crap, they call you on days off etc.
Qantas mainline treat kiwi base like crap, the way i see it, you are all a team, same uniform, us kiwis may talk funny.
Cheers
Payed fortnightly or monthly,
Do they fly to other places apart from syd,bne,ADL, Mel, LAX,JO BERG, Shanghai, Hawaii?
Heard the conditions are really bad, not worth applying, get treated like crap, they call you on days off etc.
Qantas mainline treat kiwi base like crap, the way i see it, you are all a team, same uniform, us kiwis may talk funny.
Cheers
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I had a dash8 first officer on a course i did one day and he told me that he only earnt $50,000/yr and it was bull**** that we earnt more than him (not sure if he wanted sympathy from me or what?!) - certainly wasn't going the right way about getting it!
Anyway...he then explained that flying the dash8's was a stepping stone for him to get into the big time stuff eg. 747-400's etc.. so it was kinda like a career progression - getting experiance, all that kinda stuff. And now i hear the the Capt's are getting up to $440,000!! Holy crap! Thats alot of $$! I wish i could have that sorta pay rise!
If only i could see that F/O now (who was only about 21yrs old) and have the same conversation with him. I would quite happily fly for $50g a yr for the longer term goal of earning nearly half a million bucks!
Anyway...he then explained that flying the dash8's was a stepping stone for him to get into the big time stuff eg. 747-400's etc.. so it was kinda like a career progression - getting experiance, all that kinda stuff. And now i hear the the Capt's are getting up to $440,000!! Holy crap! Thats alot of $$! I wish i could have that sorta pay rise!
If only i could see that F/O now (who was only about 21yrs old) and have the same conversation with him. I would quite happily fly for $50g a yr for the longer term goal of earning nearly half a million bucks!
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It’s funny but if a tech crew saw a cabin crew or a tea lady eating a kit kat then they would want 2 kit kat’s because they are senior airline management or at least they think they are and they base all their demands on what others get .
It’s just like having children really.. “I’m older than he is, I want a bigger and more expensive toy” !!!
Anyway..back to the faaa
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
It’s just like having children really.. “I’m older than he is, I want a bigger and more expensive toy” !!!
Anyway..back to the faaa
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
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Straight after finding out about the crew seats being sold(not from the faaa as you would hope but from actual operating crew) ,I now hear that we have lost the CNS/NRT flights as of next year to AO.
Yep,this strategy of appeasment by the FAAA is working a treat , our flying is as safe as houses !!
Maybe the faaa is just trying to trick the company into falling asleep through inactivity..
Don't forget the FAAA motto
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
The 3 sisters running the faaa are striving to achieve that motto everyday
Yep,this strategy of appeasment by the FAAA is working a treat , our flying is as safe as houses !!
Maybe the faaa is just trying to trick the company into falling asleep through inactivity..
Don't forget the FAAA motto
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
The 3 sisters running the faaa are striving to achieve that motto everyday
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recruitment?
Hi all!
I'd love to find out what process is required for applying as cabin crew with QF, a friend of mine with previous airline experience has asked me to sniff around....
if you have any ideas, or email address's or people to see in QCC please PM me or tell me here...
thanks
I'd love to find out what process is required for applying as cabin crew with QF, a friend of mine with previous airline experience has asked me to sniff around....
if you have any ideas, or email address's or people to see in QCC please PM me or tell me here...
thanks
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Does your friend live in [or are prepared to move to] Thailand, New Zealand, or the UK.
Except for casual positions with our "domestic" operation these are the only countries "The Spirit Of Australia" now sources it's flight attendants from.
The extremely high attrition rate at these bases are a window into the quality of conditions on offer.........
Except for casual positions with our "domestic" operation these are the only countries "The Spirit Of Australia" now sources it's flight attendants from.
The extremely high attrition rate at these bases are a window into the quality of conditions on offer.........
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just astounding the silence from the FAAA over the crew rest seat issue!
Nothing..........hello this is important! its one of the most important events that I can recall.
Are you meeting with the company to discuss this?
Are you informing the crew that are operating these sectors what to expect ?
Have you told the crews that we should allow the sale or denial ?
What the faaaaaaaaaaaaaarrk are you lot doing!
Come on guys! how about a bit of urgent action on this.
At least come up with the compromise that these seats will be sold last and that all other seats have to be sold first!
Anything is better than this sand burial business.........
Nothing..........hello this is important! its one of the most important events that I can recall.
Are you meeting with the company to discuss this?
Are you informing the crew that are operating these sectors what to expect ?
Have you told the crews that we should allow the sale or denial ?
What the faaaaaaaaaaaaaarrk are you lot doing!
Come on guys! how about a bit of urgent action on this.
At least come up with the compromise that these seats will be sold last and that all other seats have to be sold first!
Anything is better than this sand burial business.........
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A window into the industrial climate once the IR changes are legislated.........
December 2005
Attention all Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
Crew Rest Seats
The Association and the Company are currently in dispute regarding the entitlement to crew rest seats on tours of duty planned under six hours. The Company has committed that where a tour of duty is planned at six hours or longer, it will continue to provide seats for crew rest. For example, this would include a SYD-PER-SYD return.
The Association’s position is that crew rest seats should be provided for flights with a duty planned under six hours due to factors such as unplanned circumstances which may delay the flight over six hours, the eating of crew meals and for potential sickness of crew members.
The Association and the Company met this morning to try to resolve this issue. Our position is that in accordance with the agreed dispute settlement procedure, the Company must continue to provide crew rest seats until this issue is resolved between the Association and the Company or the dispute is listed before the Australian Industrial Relations Commission.
The Company will review this issue and provide its position to the Association tomorrow. We will keep you informed of developments.
In the interim, operating crew should contact the FAAA for instructions if crew rests seats are sold on these Sydney to Perth patterns.
Written by Victoria Skinner - National Industrial Officer and
authorised by Michael Mijatov – Divisional Secretary - International
Attention all Qantas Long Haul Flight Attendants
Crew Rest Seats
The Association and the Company are currently in dispute regarding the entitlement to crew rest seats on tours of duty planned under six hours. The Company has committed that where a tour of duty is planned at six hours or longer, it will continue to provide seats for crew rest. For example, this would include a SYD-PER-SYD return.
The Association’s position is that crew rest seats should be provided for flights with a duty planned under six hours due to factors such as unplanned circumstances which may delay the flight over six hours, the eating of crew meals and for potential sickness of crew members.
The Association and the Company met this morning to try to resolve this issue. Our position is that in accordance with the agreed dispute settlement procedure, the Company must continue to provide crew rest seats until this issue is resolved between the Association and the Company or the dispute is listed before the Australian Industrial Relations Commission.
The Company will review this issue and provide its position to the Association tomorrow. We will keep you informed of developments.
In the interim, operating crew should contact the FAAA for instructions if crew rests seats are sold on these Sydney to Perth patterns.
Written by Victoria Skinner - National Industrial Officer and
authorised by Michael Mijatov – Divisional Secretary - International
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What is interesting is that the way I understand it, under the current EBA crew are entitled to have 20 minutes rest in the first 6 hours. This does not mean 20 minutes after 6 hours but within the first 6 hours.
Assuming that you divide the crew into 2 groups ex left and right sides ,then the first group has to commence time off no later than 5 hours and 20 minutes .the second group then starts their break at 5 hours and 40 so that both breaks are completed by the 6th hour.
If the company wants to get clever and sell seats less than 6 hours and force the issue, then we should go by the book .This means we start delaying meal services or bar services so that the rest breaks can be achieved.
Crew rest cannot be achieved on the ground as you have duties to attend to and with the noise of vacuum’s and cleaners in general and catering, rest is really not possible.
When a pax starts arguing that they have not had a meal yet or a drink, the company can deal with the complaint. This is just the latest attempt by the company or a pen pusher secreted in the office somewhere thinking of another idea so they can get a bonus.
As I mentioned before, the office staff have more breaks than Mick Doohan but they expect us to go without for more than 5 hours. How about everyone turns up for sign on at the exact time and we start delaying briefings as well as meal and bar services. The next time scheduling asks for a favour or wants to bend the rules DON”T.When the taxi turns up after you have been called out; insist that the driver does not travel over the speed limit, no matter how late you have been called.
I’m sorry ,I forgot the faaa’s strategy of just giving in ….forget all of the above
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
Assuming that you divide the crew into 2 groups ex left and right sides ,then the first group has to commence time off no later than 5 hours and 20 minutes .the second group then starts their break at 5 hours and 40 so that both breaks are completed by the 6th hour.
If the company wants to get clever and sell seats less than 6 hours and force the issue, then we should go by the book .This means we start delaying meal services or bar services so that the rest breaks can be achieved.
Crew rest cannot be achieved on the ground as you have duties to attend to and with the noise of vacuum’s and cleaners in general and catering, rest is really not possible.
When a pax starts arguing that they have not had a meal yet or a drink, the company can deal with the complaint. This is just the latest attempt by the company or a pen pusher secreted in the office somewhere thinking of another idea so they can get a bonus.
As I mentioned before, the office staff have more breaks than Mick Doohan but they expect us to go without for more than 5 hours. How about everyone turns up for sign on at the exact time and we start delaying briefings as well as meal and bar services. The next time scheduling asks for a favour or wants to bend the rules DON”T.When the taxi turns up after you have been called out; insist that the driver does not travel over the speed limit, no matter how late you have been called.
I’m sorry ,I forgot the faaa’s strategy of just giving in ….forget all of the above
"Asinus asinorum in saecula saeculorum"
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Unbelievable
What amazes me about a small number of flight attendants is their utter stupidity.
The world is closing in around us industrially, Governments that are so right wing that we are turning into Singapore, the majority of flight attendants voting liberal, and we are reaping what we have sewn.
Yet, do we become even slightly introspective and consider how we have all contributed to our dilemna and how we can work together to survive in a diabolical environment...NO!!!
Lets pick on the people we elected to do the best they can for us..The FAAA Exec team....
I dont mind critisising those that have choices and make bad ones, but what i wont do is criticise the only group of people standing up for us..
They put their names on newsletters and are not anonymous.
They risk their promotional opportunities to stand up against the company. One of the current exec had to apply 8 times to get the CSM job and i am sure that it wasnt coz he was incompetent, but maybe coz he stood up for flight attendants a little to well.
Get with the program, we as flight attendants can either be part of the solution or remain part of the problem.
We currently have about 30 FAAA elected officials who are all doing their best for us while continuing to manage work and family commitments like the rest of us.
I dont have the answers to be honest about whether we can save our jobs beyond the next couple of years but i know one thing...i wont be attacking the only people who are actively doing something to try and keep me in a job as a flight attendant.
I dont like some of the changes that have happened or will happen but i will do my best to adapt to the changes rather than try and find another job under howards grand new plan.
if anyone has something constructive to suggest as a way forward to PROTECT long haul jobs from AO Jetstar and Short Haul then i would be glad to hear it.
I dont think that all of us going sick on XMAS day will save our jobs either
The world is closing in around us industrially, Governments that are so right wing that we are turning into Singapore, the majority of flight attendants voting liberal, and we are reaping what we have sewn.
Yet, do we become even slightly introspective and consider how we have all contributed to our dilemna and how we can work together to survive in a diabolical environment...NO!!!
Lets pick on the people we elected to do the best they can for us..The FAAA Exec team....
I dont mind critisising those that have choices and make bad ones, but what i wont do is criticise the only group of people standing up for us..
They put their names on newsletters and are not anonymous.
They risk their promotional opportunities to stand up against the company. One of the current exec had to apply 8 times to get the CSM job and i am sure that it wasnt coz he was incompetent, but maybe coz he stood up for flight attendants a little to well.
Get with the program, we as flight attendants can either be part of the solution or remain part of the problem.
We currently have about 30 FAAA elected officials who are all doing their best for us while continuing to manage work and family commitments like the rest of us.
I dont have the answers to be honest about whether we can save our jobs beyond the next couple of years but i know one thing...i wont be attacking the only people who are actively doing something to try and keep me in a job as a flight attendant.
I dont like some of the changes that have happened or will happen but i will do my best to adapt to the changes rather than try and find another job under howards grand new plan.
if anyone has something constructive to suggest as a way forward to PROTECT long haul jobs from AO Jetstar and Short Haul then i would be glad to hear it.
I dont think that all of us going sick on XMAS day will save our jobs either
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As usual, your first line is not factual but abuse as usual .Here is some facts without abuse.
1: I have criticised the company and faaa equally
2: Apart from the failure of the FAAA to carry out one of its promises to have a ballot for the JFK dispensation, it has been neglect (and I have been diplomatic here) to communicate with the members of it’s intentions and of proposals put forward by other parties. the JFK issue is one ,the crew rest issue is the latest !!
3:Quote “ They risk their promotional prospects to stand up to the company”
Why is it then that most union officials are promoted to CSM. All of the current leadership has not yet been promoted because there have not been any vacancies to date but most usually are ….I wonder why???
4: I have made some constructive suggestions, firstly, a media campaign as the government and the ACTU are engaged in but the faaa don’t believe in and the other where we do not negotiate from a position of weakness. The faaa has said that we should give in and give permanent dispensation or we will lose our jobs. I have listed in a previous post how unsuccessful that has been, with the sale of crew seats as the latest proof of how the company rewards our attempts to be conciliatory.
5:I have never said to go sick on Christmas day ,I have said however, to remove any co-operation with the company if they continue to harass our working life.
The faaa’s strategy is not working ,the company is continually attacking our conditions and appeasement is not working and secondly the faaa is not communicating with it’s members in an efficient manner. I believe in collective bargaining and that means unions but I am not happy with either the company or the current faaa’s planning and procedures
1: I have criticised the company and faaa equally
2: Apart from the failure of the FAAA to carry out one of its promises to have a ballot for the JFK dispensation, it has been neglect (and I have been diplomatic here) to communicate with the members of it’s intentions and of proposals put forward by other parties. the JFK issue is one ,the crew rest issue is the latest !!
3:Quote “ They risk their promotional prospects to stand up to the company”
Why is it then that most union officials are promoted to CSM. All of the current leadership has not yet been promoted because there have not been any vacancies to date but most usually are ….I wonder why???
4: I have made some constructive suggestions, firstly, a media campaign as the government and the ACTU are engaged in but the faaa don’t believe in and the other where we do not negotiate from a position of weakness. The faaa has said that we should give in and give permanent dispensation or we will lose our jobs. I have listed in a previous post how unsuccessful that has been, with the sale of crew seats as the latest proof of how the company rewards our attempts to be conciliatory.
5:I have never said to go sick on Christmas day ,I have said however, to remove any co-operation with the company if they continue to harass our working life.
The faaa’s strategy is not working ,the company is continually attacking our conditions and appeasement is not working and secondly the faaa is not communicating with it’s members in an efficient manner. I believe in collective bargaining and that means unions but I am not happy with either the company or the current faaa’s planning and procedures
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lowerlobe
i didnt mention you in my previous post but i can understand how you would feel that it might include you from some of your posts.
It's entirely plausible that the FAAA made a considerable financial contribution to the collective unions and ACTU campaign about the proposed IR laws .
I would think that individual unions pushing individual barrows would be far less successful in the public arena and demonstrably so in hindsight than the collective union approach that seems to be having a great effect on public opinion.
When the FAAA started the most intensive media campaign ever in relation to the overseas base issue, it was not enuf to get public opinion changed enough to stop the Qantas London Agenda.
I think that the general overall union approach to the IR laws is the right one. Although when at previous Federal Elections the FAAA has issued a recommendation on voting based on Union concerns about The Conservative parties approach to IR, there have been flight attendants that have abused officials for interfereing and using their money for so called political purposes.
The greatest danger facing Long Haul Flight attendants is not actually Qantas management its a small element of flight attendants that are incapable of change.
Lowerlobe, i actually have a some views that are in agreement with some of yours. I too am concerned about the fact that every concession we make may not be the last.
But what is the solution? Do we attempt to negotiate change or make some sort of stand and hasten our own demise.
What would a stand be if we were to make one??? How would it manifest itself and what would be the consequences?
These are all things that we need to have open discussion about and what are the long term and short term consequences of anything that we do or dont do?
Can i suggest that perhaps most of us have little idea of the type of negotiations we will have to enter into to ensure our job security.
I put my faith in the current leadership of the FAAA rather than any of the previous ones. There may be times when we would like more imformation but i think we have to accept that they are doing a pretty good job under the circumstances.
They have my total support and from what i can understand most of the crew as well hope they do the best they can for us.
Given that in the most recent elections only one person stood for office other than the current officials indicates what a poison challice it is and no one wants the responsibility.
If anyone has some contructive ideas about achieving job security then write to the FAAA
It's entirely plausible that the FAAA made a considerable financial contribution to the collective unions and ACTU campaign about the proposed IR laws .
I would think that individual unions pushing individual barrows would be far less successful in the public arena and demonstrably so in hindsight than the collective union approach that seems to be having a great effect on public opinion.
When the FAAA started the most intensive media campaign ever in relation to the overseas base issue, it was not enuf to get public opinion changed enough to stop the Qantas London Agenda.
I think that the general overall union approach to the IR laws is the right one. Although when at previous Federal Elections the FAAA has issued a recommendation on voting based on Union concerns about The Conservative parties approach to IR, there have been flight attendants that have abused officials for interfereing and using their money for so called political purposes.
The greatest danger facing Long Haul Flight attendants is not actually Qantas management its a small element of flight attendants that are incapable of change.
Lowerlobe, i actually have a some views that are in agreement with some of yours. I too am concerned about the fact that every concession we make may not be the last.
But what is the solution? Do we attempt to negotiate change or make some sort of stand and hasten our own demise.
What would a stand be if we were to make one??? How would it manifest itself and what would be the consequences?
These are all things that we need to have open discussion about and what are the long term and short term consequences of anything that we do or dont do?
Can i suggest that perhaps most of us have little idea of the type of negotiations we will have to enter into to ensure our job security.
I put my faith in the current leadership of the FAAA rather than any of the previous ones. There may be times when we would like more imformation but i think we have to accept that they are doing a pretty good job under the circumstances.
They have my total support and from what i can understand most of the crew as well hope they do the best they can for us.
Given that in the most recent elections only one person stood for office other than the current officials indicates what a poison challice it is and no one wants the responsibility.
If anyone has some contructive ideas about achieving job security then write to the FAAA
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This is your life......
SO i guess some of you watched Qantas on This is Your Life on channel 9.
I enjoyed it...especially when Nancy Bird Walton got up and said no more overseas intervention!
I know a few of you probably bagged it but i reckon it was quite enjoyable to watch...and i never saw Geoff!
I enjoyed it...especially when Nancy Bird Walton got up and said no more overseas intervention!
I know a few of you probably bagged it but i reckon it was quite enjoyable to watch...and i never saw Geoff!
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I TOLD YOU SO!
there you go - the loss of the CNS -NRT trips to AO sounds the death knell for the BNE base
CNS -NRT patterns would have to make up 30-40% of the BNE base flying
the beginning of the end - just like they did with the PER base- slowly took all the flying away and gave it to short haul or jet *
the company has got the most senior crew right in their gun sights -it will soon be put to their head and it will either be
1. short haul - 246 hrs per roster & no allowances (and you'll be flying to NRT again!)
2. or the highway -there will be no VR package offered under the new IR laws
it will be interesting listening to some our most senior CSMs squealing like stuff pigs to be allowed to cross over to S/H in category. from what I'm hearing from the fat, selfish & senior gooses of SYD - no such consideration or empathy has been given to our L/H colleagues in PER who are already dealing with the shafting.
who wants to make a bet that a major announcement will soon be made about Jet* International flying the MEL -LAX route.......
CNS -NRT patterns would have to make up 30-40% of the BNE base flying
the beginning of the end - just like they did with the PER base- slowly took all the flying away and gave it to short haul or jet *
the company has got the most senior crew right in their gun sights -it will soon be put to their head and it will either be
1. short haul - 246 hrs per roster & no allowances (and you'll be flying to NRT again!)
2. or the highway -there will be no VR package offered under the new IR laws
it will be interesting listening to some our most senior CSMs squealing like stuff pigs to be allowed to cross over to S/H in category. from what I'm hearing from the fat, selfish & senior gooses of SYD - no such consideration or empathy has been given to our L/H colleagues in PER who are already dealing with the shafting.
who wants to make a bet that a major announcement will soon be made about Jet* International flying the MEL -LAX route.......
Last edited by lurker@R5; 2nd Dec 2005 at 16:44.