EBA & IR Issues in Australia (Not for those easily offended!)
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Speedbirdhouse,
and those brand new posters have nothing to offer except the "company line", "if you don't want to do it don't bid for it".
Ridiculous assumption. As if we have a bid system that works!!!!!!
The vote won't get up so give up.
It's embarrasing listening to the drivel.
Jettlager
and those brand new posters have nothing to offer except the "company line", "if you don't want to do it don't bid for it".
Ridiculous assumption. As if we have a bid system that works!!!!!!
The vote won't get up so give up.
It's embarrasing listening to the drivel.
Jettlager
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speedbirdhouse....... its not the company line.
What does it take to get the point across?
The company doesnt care if we dont do the NY shuttle because they will use the Kiwi crew and will hire another 170 O/S based crew if necessary(currently QF are under the cap) to do the shuttles.
THE POINT IS IF THEY DO THAT, HIGHLY DESIRABLE LAX FLYING WILL BE TAKEN AWAY FROM US!!!!!
THIS IS THE POINT THAT THE FAAA HAS MADE SEVERAL TIMES TO EXPLAIN THE DISPENSATION.
WE ARE ALL ANGRY AT QF.... OVER LONG SERVICE LEAVE ETC...BUT CUTTING OFF OUR NOSES TO SPITE OUR FACES WOULD BE A DISASTER.
IF CREW DONT WANT THE FAAA TO CONTINUE THE DISPENSATION THEN WE MUST BE PREPARED TO TAKE THE CONSEQUENCES..
NO POINT CRYING AFTERWARDS AND THEN TRYING TO BLAME THE FAAA or qf or whoever. We can then blame ourselves as more international flying is done by others .
However, we can say we remained pure and SHOWED THE COMPANY AND AT THE SAME TIME enjoy the $40 allowances in JNB.
What does it take to get the point across?
The company doesnt care if we dont do the NY shuttle because they will use the Kiwi crew and will hire another 170 O/S based crew if necessary(currently QF are under the cap) to do the shuttles.
THE POINT IS IF THEY DO THAT, HIGHLY DESIRABLE LAX FLYING WILL BE TAKEN AWAY FROM US!!!!!
THIS IS THE POINT THAT THE FAAA HAS MADE SEVERAL TIMES TO EXPLAIN THE DISPENSATION.
WE ARE ALL ANGRY AT QF.... OVER LONG SERVICE LEAVE ETC...BUT CUTTING OFF OUR NOSES TO SPITE OUR FACES WOULD BE A DISASTER.
IF CREW DONT WANT THE FAAA TO CONTINUE THE DISPENSATION THEN WE MUST BE PREPARED TO TAKE THE CONSEQUENCES..
NO POINT CRYING AFTERWARDS AND THEN TRYING TO BLAME THE FAAA or qf or whoever. We can then blame ourselves as more international flying is done by others .
However, we can say we remained pure and SHOWED THE COMPANY AND AT THE SAME TIME enjoy the $40 allowances in JNB.
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Once again, the issues are about a tour of duty that puts at risk the health and safety of Qantas long haul cabin crew.
It's deamed illegal by US carriers for a reason!
Because it's unsafe under the circumstance their own crew find themselves let alone OURS.
Saying no isn't about cutting our noses off to spite our faces.
It's about refusing to be blackmailed into operating unsafely.
Simple, no?
Jettlager
It's deamed illegal by US carriers for a reason!
Because it's unsafe under the circumstance their own crew find themselves let alone OURS.
Saying no isn't about cutting our noses off to spite our faces.
It's about refusing to be blackmailed into operating unsafely.
Simple, no?
Jettlager
Last edited by jettlager; 14th Aug 2005 at 10:17.
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JETLAGGER...... what can be said to someone as blinkered and as wrong as you are.
The shuttle is tiring BUT it is not a threat to anyones health..... I have done it as many others have...have you?
It is on average a 15 hour tour of duty... you can confirm this with the FAAA as i have. We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation .... so cut the crap about it being dangerous.
If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA).
You continue to mislead people as you always do.... there is no US restriction on american crews to do this sector.
As mentioned by several on here already, no one is being forced to do this shuttle. People are happily and voluntarily bidding for it.
Furthemore, the only time a crew voted because they were going to go over 17 hours resulted in the crew voting to continue..So much for your crap that they are so soooo tired.
You are a joke and unfortunately if crew listed to you..we will be in all sorts of strife..
We can then bring back the former FAAA fools who can then organise a no smile day...cause we will have reason to not smile as overseas based crew do most of the LAX patterns.
The shuttle is tiring BUT it is not a threat to anyones health..... I have done it as many others have...have you?
It is on average a 15 hour tour of duty... you can confirm this with the FAAA as i have. We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation .... so cut the crap about it being dangerous.
If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA).
You continue to mislead people as you always do.... there is no US restriction on american crews to do this sector.
As mentioned by several on here already, no one is being forced to do this shuttle. People are happily and voluntarily bidding for it.
Furthemore, the only time a crew voted because they were going to go over 17 hours resulted in the crew voting to continue..So much for your crap that they are so soooo tired.
You are a joke and unfortunately if crew listed to you..we will be in all sorts of strife..
We can then bring back the former FAAA fools who can then organise a no smile day...cause we will have reason to not smile as overseas based crew do most of the LAX patterns.
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What is the truth to the rumour that the tech crew are about to reject their eba in a big way and completely sack their union and officials for so much as recommending a crap package to the membership for a vote? Heard there is mainly unhappiness with the current reps and president for being too cooperative with the company, and an alternative group is set to replace them all.
However, from what I can gather, their eba package is much better than ours ever was. The main sticking point is the Sing basing for new S/O's where they even get a pay raise to go up there (unlike others) and no foreigners are hired. But they are still unhappy with this.
Maybe people should watch and learn.
However, from what I can gather, their eba package is much better than ours ever was. The main sticking point is the Sing basing for new S/O's where they even get a pay raise to go up there (unlike others) and no foreigners are hired. But they are still unhappy with this.
Maybe people should watch and learn.
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"mmmmmmm...................
interesting to see lots of brand new posters pushing the company line re the JFK
dispensation.......................?"
-------------------
I thought it might be timely to cut and paste a recent post from Speedbirdhouse. [see above]
Desperate doesn't even come close.................
Jettlager
Oh BTW
" We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation"
The abovemtioned cut and paste indicates that QF's spin team ought to LOTS more OPERATIONAL homework when pushing the companie's line.
LAX-JFK-LAX is MULTI SECTOR...................
interesting to see lots of brand new posters pushing the company line re the JFK
dispensation.......................?"
-------------------
I thought it might be timely to cut and paste a recent post from Speedbirdhouse. [see above]
Desperate doesn't even come close.................
Jettlager
Oh BTW
" We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation"
The abovemtioned cut and paste indicates that QF's spin team ought to LOTS more OPERATIONAL homework when pushing the companie's line.
LAX-JFK-LAX is MULTI SECTOR...................
Last edited by jettlager; 14th Aug 2005 at 11:09.
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POOR JETLAGGER!!
Mate you truly are off with the pixies.
I understand our EBA beyond anything you will even remotely approach.
I said "We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation ".
"this" = new york shuttle i.e. the dispensation was given for the new york shuttle for 14'35" i.e 35" (minutes) above what QF can plan automatically for a multi sector i.e. 14" (hours).
My reference to 1 hour is the fact that on last years actual flight times to LAX-NYC-LAX the average was 15 hours i.e. 1 hour above what the company could have done without a dispensation.
I am not pro company...far from it... but i certainly know where we are headed if we listened to a flip like you.
Mate you must be a former FAAA screwball..... cause you certainly sound like it. They were a joke just like you and they managed to fool crew for a while until they were exposed for the snake oil merchants that they were. The current FAAA officials have been excellent.
They tell the truth, they reversed the failures of EBA6 , they communicate well to crew and they actually know what they are doing and above all ..the Company actually fears them..unlike the previous clowns.
I understand our EBA beyond anything you will even remotely approach.
I said "We can do 20 hours unplanned on a Longe range sector and this is only 1 hour above what the company could do anyway without a dispensation ".
"this" = new york shuttle i.e. the dispensation was given for the new york shuttle for 14'35" i.e 35" (minutes) above what QF can plan automatically for a multi sector i.e. 14" (hours).
My reference to 1 hour is the fact that on last years actual flight times to LAX-NYC-LAX the average was 15 hours i.e. 1 hour above what the company could have done without a dispensation.
I am not pro company...far from it... but i certainly know where we are headed if we listened to a flip like you.
Mate you must be a former FAAA screwball..... cause you certainly sound like it. They were a joke just like you and they managed to fool crew for a while until they were exposed for the snake oil merchants that they were. The current FAAA officials have been excellent.
They tell the truth, they reversed the failures of EBA6 , they communicate well to crew and they actually know what they are doing and above all ..the Company actually fears them..unlike the previous clowns.
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Well said Guardian.
Some people like jetlagger must be on the funny stuff.
Its amazing how some just don't get it. Qantas is about to get a new generation of long range jets and if we listened to morons like jetlagger we should apparently say to Qantas.... F***k off..we won't fly your multi billion dollar jets because you are asking us to fly 60 mins above current maximums...
What a joke!!! surely our crew are not so stupid to think that is a tenable position? Qantas would then say goodbye to its Long Haul crew and give international flying to Short Haul, Australian Airlines and its O/S based crew.
We would be on the dole queue, while thousands of others would replace us at a drop of a hat since we have the best crew conditions in this country.
Id hate to be MM or AS and have to deal with morons like jetlagger.
BTW White pointer no truth to that rumour at all..... the pilots are not as stupid as some of our crew (jetlagger). That rumour is as credible as the 32 crew being dismissed.
Also 88% of our crew correctly supported EBA7 which dealt with the diasaster of EBA 6.
Some people like jetlagger must be on the funny stuff.
Its amazing how some just don't get it. Qantas is about to get a new generation of long range jets and if we listened to morons like jetlagger we should apparently say to Qantas.... F***k off..we won't fly your multi billion dollar jets because you are asking us to fly 60 mins above current maximums...
What a joke!!! surely our crew are not so stupid to think that is a tenable position? Qantas would then say goodbye to its Long Haul crew and give international flying to Short Haul, Australian Airlines and its O/S based crew.
We would be on the dole queue, while thousands of others would replace us at a drop of a hat since we have the best crew conditions in this country.
Id hate to be MM or AS and have to deal with morons like jetlagger.
BTW White pointer no truth to that rumour at all..... the pilots are not as stupid as some of our crew (jetlagger). That rumour is as credible as the 32 crew being dismissed.
Also 88% of our crew correctly supported EBA7 which dealt with the diasaster of EBA 6.
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Only a small percentage of what goes on with this thread remotely resembles the truth, but White Pointer may just be a bit closer to the mark than some would like to believe, particularly QF management (just ask the tech crew next time you go flying).
It will be very interesting to see how their situation is handled.
It will be very interesting to see how their situation is handled.
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mmhmmhh as i said before
warp57 the thais arent allowed to fly to the states.the yanks dont want to see them.
guardian1 made the comment " If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA)". it confirms to me that you are an faaa official peddling some amazing bulls**t.
there has been no representation made to casa regarding bad flying pattern from the faaa . just dont trust my word ring casa yourselfs and ask the question (131757). or better send them a copy of the pattern and ask for comments?
if anything under the "banner of protecting flying for longhaul" they roll over on any pattern. read my previous posting.
why arent the pilots doing it. its simple called fatigue management. they arent too happy about the eba but they are realistig enough to accept hardly any loss of conditions. the second officers overseas posting (at their own expense) isn't an issue. and yes the aipa's president is going to be challenged.
warp57 here is your choice regarding the future long range jets you assume qantas will get. if it lets say fly direct to london in 2008 the company gives the faaa a choice in the next eba. you do the sectors at the same rate as your lhr crews or you wont see them. what are you going to do?
guardian1 made the comment " If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA)". it confirms to me that you are an faaa official peddling some amazing bulls**t.
there has been no representation made to casa regarding bad flying pattern from the faaa . just dont trust my word ring casa yourselfs and ask the question (131757). or better send them a copy of the pattern and ask for comments?
if anything under the "banner of protecting flying for longhaul" they roll over on any pattern. read my previous posting.
why arent the pilots doing it. its simple called fatigue management. they arent too happy about the eba but they are realistig enough to accept hardly any loss of conditions. the second officers overseas posting (at their own expense) isn't an issue. and yes the aipa's president is going to be challenged.
warp57 here is your choice regarding the future long range jets you assume qantas will get. if it lets say fly direct to london in 2008 the company gives the faaa a choice in the next eba. you do the sectors at the same rate as your lhr crews or you wont see them. what are you going to do?
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The pilots will not accept any loss of conditions, as well a a meagre 3% pay rise. The Singapore basing is a big sticking point (once these things start, then where do they stop - look what happened to you guys). The eba will be voted down in a big way, and the aipa reform group will be swept to power in a landslide.
And the tech crew still slip in NY as they have to operate to CAO limits which the company cannot ask for an extension on (in fact the company and pilot will potentially be prosecuted with a resulting probable loss of the crew licence if they do break their set limits). Even putting on extra crew and making it a 4man trip still looks like coming into troubles due to delays in winter more often than not. The company have looked at it for the tech crew, but have found it will cost more than it will save.
And the tech crew still slip in NY as they have to operate to CAO limits which the company cannot ask for an extension on (in fact the company and pilot will potentially be prosecuted with a resulting probable loss of the crew licence if they do break their set limits). Even putting on extra crew and making it a 4man trip still looks like coming into troubles due to delays in winter more often than not. The company have looked at it for the tech crew, but have found it will cost more than it will save.
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QCC2
you really must be 1 of the old union that we turfed because you have no idea whatsoever.
ALL patterns that we currently do are legal.... they all comply with our EBA requirements. The NY dispensation is done through our EBA provisions (the facilitative provision).
CASA regulates the safety regulations that apply to airlines that operate out of this country and there is no issue with the NY shuttle you dimwit.
Why don't you initiate an action with CASA over the NY shuttle? You would be laughed out of their office. There is no breach of CASA requirements and furthermore it would be interesting trying to make out some non existent fatigue argument, when crew are happily bidding for the high value and high money NY shuttles and furthemore voting to continue beyond 17 hours on the rare ocassion it arises!
This constant reference to pilots is verging on the ridiculous... we are not pilots...we are not technically skilled like they are...we are not licensed like they are.... CASA applies rules to them because they are DIFFERENT to us....... THEY FLY THE PLANES.
The level of stupidity on the part of certain people like QCC2 knows no bounds. You sit on the sidelines and spew forth a torrent of uninformed drivel. Of course they do it because they have an agenda - they are ex FAAA officials hiding under the cloak of anonymity - still cringing because they were turfed out.
QCC2 is also clueless about the ability to "challenge" patterns etc..How can you challenge patterns that comply with our Simplified Award and our EBA.... THE AIRC(Commission) would laugh at you.
Just further demonstrates that some in here are deliberately trying to cause mischief but the sad thing is if they were in a position to try to implement their nonsense we would be carved up... the same way we were over EBA6 when QCC2 and peanut pusher's mates told us to vote for EBA6 that didnt even give us access to A330 and A380 flying or a continuing cap on overseas bases.
TALK ABOUT INCOMPETENT AND DUMB.
you really must be 1 of the old union that we turfed because you have no idea whatsoever.
ALL patterns that we currently do are legal.... they all comply with our EBA requirements. The NY dispensation is done through our EBA provisions (the facilitative provision).
CASA regulates the safety regulations that apply to airlines that operate out of this country and there is no issue with the NY shuttle you dimwit.
Why don't you initiate an action with CASA over the NY shuttle? You would be laughed out of their office. There is no breach of CASA requirements and furthermore it would be interesting trying to make out some non existent fatigue argument, when crew are happily bidding for the high value and high money NY shuttles and furthemore voting to continue beyond 17 hours on the rare ocassion it arises!
This constant reference to pilots is verging on the ridiculous... we are not pilots...we are not technically skilled like they are...we are not licensed like they are.... CASA applies rules to them because they are DIFFERENT to us....... THEY FLY THE PLANES.
The level of stupidity on the part of certain people like QCC2 knows no bounds. You sit on the sidelines and spew forth a torrent of uninformed drivel. Of course they do it because they have an agenda - they are ex FAAA officials hiding under the cloak of anonymity - still cringing because they were turfed out.
QCC2 is also clueless about the ability to "challenge" patterns etc..How can you challenge patterns that comply with our Simplified Award and our EBA.... THE AIRC(Commission) would laugh at you.
Just further demonstrates that some in here are deliberately trying to cause mischief but the sad thing is if they were in a position to try to implement their nonsense we would be carved up... the same way we were over EBA6 when QCC2 and peanut pusher's mates told us to vote for EBA6 that didnt even give us access to A330 and A380 flying or a continuing cap on overseas bases.
TALK ABOUT INCOMPETENT AND DUMB.
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4 the record
guardian1 you are not sticking to the facts. as always your emotion and ill informed views and pure hatred to crew who pull people like you up for spreading wrong info gets the better of you
you posted
If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA). as an union official have you ever dicussed the issue with casa?
You continue to mislead people as you always do.... there is no US restriction on american crews to do this sector
FAA Section 121.467 Flight attendant duty period limitations and rest requirements: Domestic, flag, and supplemental operations.
. . . . .
(b)(1) Except as provided in paragraphs (b)(4), (b)(5), and (b)(6) of this section, no certificate holder conducting domestic, flag, or supplemental operations may assign a flight attendant to a scheduled duty period of more than 14 hours.
rest my case
you posted
If it was dangerous the Aussie authorities would not allow it (CASA). as an union official have you ever dicussed the issue with casa?
You continue to mislead people as you always do.... there is no US restriction on american crews to do this sector
FAA Section 121.467 Flight attendant duty period limitations and rest requirements: Domestic, flag, and supplemental operations.
. . . . .
(b)(1) Except as provided in paragraphs (b)(4), (b)(5), and (b)(6) of this section, no certificate holder conducting domestic, flag, or supplemental operations may assign a flight attendant to a scheduled duty period of more than 14 hours.
rest my case
All other factors aside (legality, who gets what etc), what should really matter is how you feel at the end of a multi sector 15hour duty.
At my last airline, we regularly did up to 16 hours, sometimes with minimum crew and no rest period - and occasionally this was extended. Our rest period after that duty would be as little as 12 hours sometimes, and it was not uncommon to do back to back days of 14hours, 14 hours, and 12 hours, all 4 sector days.
I certainly know that I felt like absolute crap after just one of these, let alone being able to look forward to the next two days.
(on a side note the destinations and pay were no where near as nice as QF LH).
The important issue is fatigue, and I thought that airlines were going to have to introduce a fatigue managment system?
The point is, how would you feel evacuating a full flight in the rain, in the dark, after 15hours at work. Or how would you feel fighting a fire, or dealing with a medical emergency, or responding to a depressurisation after 15hours at work?
From my experience, I can honestly say it wasnt nice.
Now CASA may say it is legal, but its only legal if the crew are not fatigued. This is where the company i worked for made it difficult - there were very few people that had the guts to say 'I am too fatigued, I am not fit for duty'. They put the fear of rotten rosters, job loss the next time things slow down, and so on. I only ever saw one FA do it - with minimum crew he had been at work 15hours and had another 3 to go after a weather diversion and a tech delay.
CASA also get it wrong sometimes! And they will never know until its pointed out to them, be it through crew who approach them, or through an accident/incident as in my case.
At my last airline, we regularly did up to 16 hours, sometimes with minimum crew and no rest period - and occasionally this was extended. Our rest period after that duty would be as little as 12 hours sometimes, and it was not uncommon to do back to back days of 14hours, 14 hours, and 12 hours, all 4 sector days.
I certainly know that I felt like absolute crap after just one of these, let alone being able to look forward to the next two days.
(on a side note the destinations and pay were no where near as nice as QF LH).
The important issue is fatigue, and I thought that airlines were going to have to introduce a fatigue managment system?
The point is, how would you feel evacuating a full flight in the rain, in the dark, after 15hours at work. Or how would you feel fighting a fire, or dealing with a medical emergency, or responding to a depressurisation after 15hours at work?
From my experience, I can honestly say it wasnt nice.
Now CASA may say it is legal, but its only legal if the crew are not fatigued. This is where the company i worked for made it difficult - there were very few people that had the guts to say 'I am too fatigued, I am not fit for duty'. They put the fear of rotten rosters, job loss the next time things slow down, and so on. I only ever saw one FA do it - with minimum crew he had been at work 15hours and had another 3 to go after a weather diversion and a tech delay.
CASA also get it wrong sometimes! And they will never know until its pointed out to them, be it through crew who approach them, or through an accident/incident as in my case.
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Safety and fatigue....
Already in a jetlagged state in LAX and then do a fourteen(+)hour tour of duty.Response times are slower than normal., decision making process impaired= a compromise of safety.Get in touch with the "sleep" unit in ADL hospital/university and you will find that this is correct.
Compromising safety to cut costs was never the Qantas way.
It is now.
Some of the other cost cutting measures caused the BKK "incident".The Swiss Cheese Principal.
Lets hope that cost cutting doesn`t cost any lives.
QF were lucky in BKK .They may not be so lucky next time.
There will be a next time.
Technology has now outstripped human physical limitations.
Be concerned ...be very concerned.We are now swimming in untested/untried waters.
Qf management you have been warned.
One person dies and all hell will break loose.
All the bonuses will be spent on defense litigation.
Dixon and his cronies will crucified and the mindless chattering class in these forums will fall silent and be forced to contemplate their uninformed/misinformed stupidity.
CASA will be exposed for what it is ...a bureaucratic, useless puppet.
Compromising safety to cut costs was never the Qantas way.
It is now.
Some of the other cost cutting measures caused the BKK "incident".The Swiss Cheese Principal.
Lets hope that cost cutting doesn`t cost any lives.
QF were lucky in BKK .They may not be so lucky next time.
There will be a next time.
Technology has now outstripped human physical limitations.
Be concerned ...be very concerned.We are now swimming in untested/untried waters.
Qf management you have been warned.
One person dies and all hell will break loose.
All the bonuses will be spent on defense litigation.
Dixon and his cronies will crucified and the mindless chattering class in these forums will fall silent and be forced to contemplate their uninformed/misinformed stupidity.
CASA will be exposed for what it is ...a bureaucratic, useless puppet.
Last edited by jetjockey7; 15th Aug 2005 at 01:57.
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Send in the clowns...........dont worry they're here........
The strident, abusive and disingenuous rubbish peddled by the QF spin team gets more and more tragic as the days go by.
Can't you clowns get your head around the fact that the sector in question is a MULTI SECTOR and as such unplanned extension beyond 17 is subject to a FA majority vote?
Can't you clowns make the distinction between the rest afforded FA's on this MULTI SECTOR horror with that afforded on a long range SINGLE SECTOR?
Can't you clowns get your heads around the fact that people's health, welfare and safety are more important than money............?
Can't you clowns get your head around the fact that this sector is illegal for the US carriers to impose on their own FA's for a reason?
We all know too well that the only people who know ANYTHING about the airline industry in QANTAS are operational but you clowns really are unbelievable.
Jettlager
Can't you clowns get your head around the fact that the sector in question is a MULTI SECTOR and as such unplanned extension beyond 17 is subject to a FA majority vote?
Can't you clowns make the distinction between the rest afforded FA's on this MULTI SECTOR horror with that afforded on a long range SINGLE SECTOR?
Can't you clowns get your heads around the fact that people's health, welfare and safety are more important than money............?
Can't you clowns get your head around the fact that this sector is illegal for the US carriers to impose on their own FA's for a reason?
We all know too well that the only people who know ANYTHING about the airline industry in QANTAS are operational but you clowns really are unbelievable.
Jettlager
Last edited by jettlager; 15th Aug 2005 at 06:30.
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Employee Cost/Value
There are some here(Peanut Pusher,Bad Adventures etc.)who have the misconception that they are worth something to their employer.That they are somehow valuable and indispensable.This misconception perpetuates an ill founded need to defend their employer.
Reality:
Your employer cares zilch about you.You are a number attached to a cost centre.You are not a person but a commodity to be cost analysed.You have had a dollar and cents figure attached to you.They don`t care about you,your family,your mortgage or your wellbeing except if it affects KPIs.
They have determined how much you are worth:alive injured or dead.
Your employer makes decisions on cost and probability of events...If you are killed or injured at work,the lost time and its cost have all been considered.Not how you are feeling and the impact on your family,but dollars and cents.You are as indispensable as a stapler or an A4 size piece of copier paper.
You don`t have a name.They don`t know who you are,nor do they care.
Cost risk analysis determines the probability of events occurring and the financial impact on the business.If the cost saving is greater than the probability of your death or injury the cost saving measure will be initiated.If they have made an error in their calculations and you die or are injured as a result this is still acceptable risk.
You are not important,your opinion is not important you are a data entry.Your defense of them here earns you no promotion,none of their loyalty or gratitude.
Agreeing with them at company forums and pushing the "company line" will not earn you a promotion.
You are deluding yourself that you have some worth or value...you don`t.
Fawning flight attendants who rise to their own level of incompetence, line managers.Group General Cabin Crew managers come and go.The ones that felt that they were most indispensable got the greatest shock when told to leave.No one is safe.
Your point of view will change when your turn comes around...and it will.
Sell your labour for what you think its worth,enjoy the benefits of working in the aviation industry.Your employment and benefits can be shortlived.
You can and will be retrenched in an instant.Your employer has no remorse or empathy.
Your loyalty and viewpoint ,here, are valued at minus zero.
Bear this in mind and re evaluate your point of view.
This is todays employee reality:look after you and yours because your employer doesn`t give a rats rissole about you.
There is no you (U)in Qantas...and for good reason
Reality:
Your employer cares zilch about you.You are a number attached to a cost centre.You are not a person but a commodity to be cost analysed.You have had a dollar and cents figure attached to you.They don`t care about you,your family,your mortgage or your wellbeing except if it affects KPIs.
They have determined how much you are worth:alive injured or dead.
Your employer makes decisions on cost and probability of events...If you are killed or injured at work,the lost time and its cost have all been considered.Not how you are feeling and the impact on your family,but dollars and cents.You are as indispensable as a stapler or an A4 size piece of copier paper.
You don`t have a name.They don`t know who you are,nor do they care.
Cost risk analysis determines the probability of events occurring and the financial impact on the business.If the cost saving is greater than the probability of your death or injury the cost saving measure will be initiated.If they have made an error in their calculations and you die or are injured as a result this is still acceptable risk.
You are not important,your opinion is not important you are a data entry.Your defense of them here earns you no promotion,none of their loyalty or gratitude.
Agreeing with them at company forums and pushing the "company line" will not earn you a promotion.
You are deluding yourself that you have some worth or value...you don`t.
Fawning flight attendants who rise to their own level of incompetence, line managers.Group General Cabin Crew managers come and go.The ones that felt that they were most indispensable got the greatest shock when told to leave.No one is safe.
Your point of view will change when your turn comes around...and it will.
Sell your labour for what you think its worth,enjoy the benefits of working in the aviation industry.Your employment and benefits can be shortlived.
You can and will be retrenched in an instant.Your employer has no remorse or empathy.
Your loyalty and viewpoint ,here, are valued at minus zero.
Bear this in mind and re evaluate your point of view.
This is todays employee reality:look after you and yours because your employer doesn`t give a rats rissole about you.
There is no you (U)in Qantas...and for good reason
Last edited by captainrats; 15th Aug 2005 at 05:38.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Tightslot`s Place
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Epiphany
Qantas is strewn with the carcasses of those who thought they were special.Broken marriages and ruined careers are all part of the deal.
Stanbridge couldn`t believe she was being retrenched .Even Shear Nylon was in denial when her turn came.
Dave Hine was devastated ...it cost him his marriage and his health.
Captainrats has provided insight into a ruthless uncaring corporation that protects the bonuses of those at the very top.
Hassell and Grant, be careful, when Dixon leaves, your umbrella goes with him.
To the "chattering class"that post pro company diatribe,I would love to be around when you get bent over...no foreplay and no K Y..hope you are into pain.
It won`t happen overnight...but it will happen!!
Stanbridge couldn`t believe she was being retrenched .Even Shear Nylon was in denial when her turn came.
Dave Hine was devastated ...it cost him his marriage and his health.
Captainrats has provided insight into a ruthless uncaring corporation that protects the bonuses of those at the very top.
Hassell and Grant, be careful, when Dixon leaves, your umbrella goes with him.
To the "chattering class"that post pro company diatribe,I would love to be around when you get bent over...no foreplay and no K Y..hope you are into pain.
It won`t happen overnight...but it will happen!!