Qantas; the thread.
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Precious things
Don't be so precious little dears.
Theft is theft, wherever and whatever. We are discussing here searches of crew for alleged theft from aircraft. Nothing more, nothing less. If you want to vent your collective spleen about management and office staff stealing their employers material, do it elsewhere.
For the record and the uninformed, I am told that ground staff do work under a policy of no private phone calls, no private internet use, no stealing AND random bag searches. They are also reviewed for Staff Travel breaches. Don't think crew are being victimised - they are not.
Tow truck writes about long lunches and wandering around the office doing nothing. Is this theft the same as hanging around gallies etc, (for example, ignoring pax call buttons) instead of patrolling the cabin attending to customers needs?
Theft is theft, wherever and whatever. We are discussing here searches of crew for alleged theft from aircraft. Nothing more, nothing less. If you want to vent your collective spleen about management and office staff stealing their employers material, do it elsewhere.
For the record and the uninformed, I am told that ground staff do work under a policy of no private phone calls, no private internet use, no stealing AND random bag searches. They are also reviewed for Staff Travel breaches. Don't think crew are being victimised - they are not.
Tow truck writes about long lunches and wandering around the office doing nothing. Is this theft the same as hanging around gallies etc, (for example, ignoring pax call buttons) instead of patrolling the cabin attending to customers needs?
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they may work under this policy but they certainly don't adhere to it.
Esson, are you at work at the moment, if so what are you doing on the net, Oh that's right its your smoko time, or is it your long long early lunch.
Are you one of those QCC1 employees that ride up and down the elevator , and then catch the shuttle bus over to the domestic airport for a burger king, then you slowly wonder back, check you emails, then make a personal call, etc,
So, are you at work today!
Esson, are you at work at the moment, if so what are you doing on the net, Oh that's right its your smoko time, or is it your long long early lunch.
Are you one of those QCC1 employees that ride up and down the elevator , and then catch the shuttle bus over to the domestic airport for a burger king, then you slowly wonder back, check you emails, then make a personal call, etc,
So, are you at work today!
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Tow truck,
I really should ignore your spiteful bile but I will say that I have more taste and class than to eat at Burger King. As for my being at work, you'll just have to wonder.
I really should ignore your spiteful bile but I will say that I have more taste and class than to eat at Burger King. As for my being at work, you'll just have to wonder.
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Just received from office............
Rumour - 32 people have been held out of service as a result of Random
Security Searches up-line
Fact: No One has been stood down as a result of the security searches!
Background - As you all know we were advised some weeks ago that QF
security will be conducting random searches on all QF employees
around the network. This has begun, with random searches having taken
place in HKG, SIN, and the QF Jetbase this week.
Certainly to date, NO ONE has had any disciplinary against them as a
result of these searches.
There has also been concerns as to what constitutes "QF Premises" - the
definition is "any place or thing (whether or not owned by or within the
exclusive control of Qantas) used by Qantas in the course of conducting its
business and includes but is not limited to aircraft and vehicles.
Security have assured us that all care is being taken to ensure that the
crew members privacy is respected and searches are conducted in
discreet areas and not in public view and the searches may well take place
at the crew hotel in keeping with the above definition.
This is a Qantas Group Security Initiative, and affects ALL Qantas staff
ground and air.
Rumour - 32 people have been held out of service as a result of Random
Security Searches up-line
Fact: No One has been stood down as a result of the security searches!
Background - As you all know we were advised some weeks ago that QF
security will be conducting random searches on all QF employees
around the network. This has begun, with random searches having taken
place in HKG, SIN, and the QF Jetbase this week.
Certainly to date, NO ONE has had any disciplinary against them as a
result of these searches.
There has also been concerns as to what constitutes "QF Premises" - the
definition is "any place or thing (whether or not owned by or within the
exclusive control of Qantas) used by Qantas in the course of conducting its
business and includes but is not limited to aircraft and vehicles.
Security have assured us that all care is being taken to ensure that the
crew members privacy is respected and searches are conducted in
discreet areas and not in public view and the searches may well take place
at the crew hotel in keeping with the above definition.
This is a Qantas Group Security Initiative, and affects ALL Qantas staff
ground and air.
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Hotbed of theft
QF Catering and the bondstore used to be the worst.Management were/are the greatest perpetrators.Booze ,food for private functions,parties etc left by the bootload on Friday nights for birthday parties,weddings over virtually any weekend.
A certain CEO uses the company apartment in the toaster to "entertain".The "Dame"has told him to move out and clean up his act...yes mummy.
A certain CEO uses the company apartment in the toaster to "entertain".The "Dame"has told him to move out and clean up his act...yes mummy.
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I'm wondering, in the eyes of QF, what constitutes stealing? Is something like a stip of Panamax stealing, or a QF pen or two, how about a bottle of water? I can understand someone being stood down for stealing a bottle of J/C wine or similar, but if it is going to be as petty as getting crew for the smallest of things, then it is time for war.
PS: Don Esson, why do you even bother coming to these forums, you blind, slimy little weasel?
PS: Don Esson, why do you even bother coming to these forums, you blind, slimy little weasel?
Last edited by Flugbegleiter; 21st Jul 2005 at 06:13.
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H20
Taking a bottle of water is considered stealing.Taking anything from your meal tray is also considered stealing.
Taking someone`s livelihood as Dixon is doing apparently is not.
It is either Australian apathy or enormous tolerance that has prevented this swine from being "mishandled"
Taking someone`s livelihood as Dixon is doing apparently is not.
It is either Australian apathy or enormous tolerance that has prevented this swine from being "mishandled"
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Don Esson
you better start cleaning out your drawers at work, whilst you are at it you should also clean out your glove box, word is security are about to hit little grovellers like you.
If they really want to stamp out thieving they should install electronic movement monitors at QCA to QCCD it would be interesting to see hom much time you spend at your desk doing work! and they should restrict access to the internet from your desk!, OMG what a boring day you would have then!
By the way, you're not in charge of making decisions are you!
God help us!
you better start cleaning out your drawers at work, whilst you are at it you should also clean out your glove box, word is security are about to hit little grovellers like you.
If they really want to stamp out thieving they should install electronic movement monitors at QCA to QCCD it would be interesting to see hom much time you spend at your desk doing work! and they should restrict access to the internet from your desk!, OMG what a boring day you would have then!
By the way, you're not in charge of making decisions are you!
God help us!
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Lowest Job In An Airline
Being a "security officer" for an airline and particularly QF would have to be the lowest job on the planet.
The preferred applicants must have:
1.An IQ smaller than their shoe size
2.A total disregard for other human beings
3.Have a prison record.
4.Be a disgraced former cop
5.Have no empathy.
6.Have no remorse
7.Have "chopper" tattooed on their derriere.
8.Be at least 89% dysfunctional
9.Not play well with others.
10.Enjoy being cruel to small defenseless animals
Come to think of it most of the criteria would apply to any senior management position in our national carrier.
Oh and
11. have had a recent personality by pass verifiable by the operating surgeon.
Using these citeria our nemesis Don Esson would be head of security in no time.
The preferred applicants must have:
1.An IQ smaller than their shoe size
2.A total disregard for other human beings
3.Have a prison record.
4.Be a disgraced former cop
5.Have no empathy.
6.Have no remorse
7.Have "chopper" tattooed on their derriere.
8.Be at least 89% dysfunctional
9.Not play well with others.
10.Enjoy being cruel to small defenseless animals
Come to think of it most of the criteria would apply to any senior management position in our national carrier.
Oh and
11. have had a recent personality by pass verifiable by the operating surgeon.
Using these citeria our nemesis Don Esson would be head of security in no time.
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With the IQ shown by some of the posters here, I'm surprised that any of you managed to get beyond the first vetting of job applications. It's a great shame a topic cannot be debated and discussed objectively and logically without resort to personal abuse. What a load of losers you are?
The moderators ought to have a look at some of the vitriolic, childish and defamatory stuff that's been posted here and take some action. It's not needed. If anyone doesn't like what's going at at Qantas, they can always resign and find something elsewhere that's more in keeping with their own personal standards.
The moderators ought to have a look at some of the vitriolic, childish and defamatory stuff that's been posted here and take some action. It's not needed. If anyone doesn't like what's going at at Qantas, they can always resign and find something elsewhere that's more in keeping with their own personal standards.
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ummmmm have a look at your previous posts Esson, I think you will see you're the one that started these personal attacks...
Seems to me that you're one of the "wannabe" flight attendants.
Hmmmmm didnt make the grade eh!
Looks like the recruiters did their job properly for once.
Seems to me that you're one of the "wannabe" flight attendants.
Hmmmmm didnt make the grade eh!
Looks like the recruiters did their job properly for once.
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Hi Don,
I thought given that you are so interested in the subject of theft at Qantas that I might cut and paste one of your previous posts.
You know the one, surely? The one that outlines the company sanctioned theft carried out by our "trough feeding, pig swillers", who sometimes go by the title of, "Senior Executive Staff."
-------------
Quote- "Executive buy-up?
Maybe the bar shortages were the result of a buy-up by Qantas executive staff. A very jealously guarded perk not known by many is that enjoyed by all Executive staff that allows them to buy wine, liqour and beer (all classes) from catering at very discounted prices.. There is no limit to their avarice.. "
---------------
You seem to have an inside to the REAL thieves in Qantas.
In the interests of fairness/balance perhaps you would care to expand on your above, previous post?
Jettlager
I thought given that you are so interested in the subject of theft at Qantas that I might cut and paste one of your previous posts.
You know the one, surely? The one that outlines the company sanctioned theft carried out by our "trough feeding, pig swillers", who sometimes go by the title of, "Senior Executive Staff."
-------------
Quote- "Executive buy-up?
Maybe the bar shortages were the result of a buy-up by Qantas executive staff. A very jealously guarded perk not known by many is that enjoyed by all Executive staff that allows them to buy wine, liqour and beer (all classes) from catering at very discounted prices.. There is no limit to their avarice.. "
---------------
You seem to have an inside to the REAL thieves in Qantas.
In the interests of fairness/balance perhaps you would care to expand on your above, previous post?
Jettlager
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Real thieves?
Jetlagger,
Many will not agree, but where good money changes hands, theft is not committed. Please don't take posts out of context. The 'bar shortages' were not the kind of shortages you may have in mind!
Tow truck,
I've got to leave the creche and sand pit to others as its now approaching 4 o'clock and I have to go to my real job. No, I'm not a wannabe FA. I'm just a sensible person who knows right from wrong without personal prejudice, bias or other luggage. I believe in a fair go for all.
Many will not agree, but where good money changes hands, theft is not committed. Please don't take posts out of context. The 'bar shortages' were not the kind of shortages you may have in mind!
Tow truck,
I've got to leave the creche and sand pit to others as its now approaching 4 o'clock and I have to go to my real job. No, I'm not a wannabe FA. I'm just a sensible person who knows right from wrong without personal prejudice, bias or other luggage. I believe in a fair go for all.
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The following cut and paste is from the D&G forum and illustrates the actions of an airline attacking it's own OPERATIONAL staff.
QF mismanagement never have been leaders and have it seems morphed themselves into nothing more than fascist brownshirts.
There is NOTHING in the way of creative vision for this once proud company.
The article does explain the bullying, aggression and out and out fear campaign being waged against us.
Pass the info onto the troops.
support PPRuNe
posted 20th July 2005 09:37
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revealed: Aer Lingus 'quit or be pushed' plan
From Irish Independent:
(need to be registered)
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independ...&issue_id=12759
AER Lingus developed a 12-point plan to make life difficult for its employees in order to persuade 1,800 staff to accept voluntary redundancy.
The plan included:
* Suggesting the airline would introduce a tacky uniform for cabin crew.
* Tedious training programmes for some pilots.
* Deliberately changing shift patterns to make life at the company uncomfortable.
According to one informed source there was also a suggestion that cabin crew, including older air hostesses, would have to abandon their current uniform for jumpsuits and t-shirts.
The total plan is documented in a confidential Aer Lingus report called "Business Plan - HR (Human Resources) strategy 2004".
The 12 initiatives designed to make life difficult for staff are referred to in the documents as "environmental push factors".
A spokeswoman for the company acknowledged that the document had been drawn up by Aer Lingus but dismissed it as a "discussion document". She said: "Those tactics have never been embraced by either the past or present management team."
Nowhere in the 40-page report is there any suggestion that it is a draft or discussion paper.
It states that initiatives to make life uncomfortable for staff were essential to the success of the voluntary severance scheme which was, in turn, essential for the success of the business plan.
The report states: "Environment (sic) push factors are key to driving applications (for the voluntary severance scheme)". The document then details the 12 "push factors".
Top of the list is: " 'Tap on the shoulder' of all relevant superintendents." This is understood to be a reference to 200 supervisor-grade employees who were individually approached by senior management and told they had no future with the company.
The second "push" factor listed calls for performance improvement plans. Sources said these were designed to put staff under pressure at work. The third push factor listed is "attendance management".
One of the more controversial initiatives in the plan comes in at number four and is titled "adverse changes in work/shift patterns". Adverse shift changes would make life at Aer Lingus particularly difficult for employees with families.
The fifth of the strategies outlined is "called lack of availability of IWSL". This is a reference to "In Week Special Leave" which gives cabin crew the option of flexible working arrangements.
The ninth "push factor" is called "assignment to resource centre". It is understood this initiative was aimed at surplus pilots who would be assigned to the centre, known by some staff as 'Guantanemo Bay', where they would spend weeks on training modules which, according to one source, were considered by pilots to be boring and tedious.
A number of the 12 points have already been implemented. These include number 10, "no transport", which is a reference to the abolition of the special bus which ferried cabin crew working unsociable shifts to and from airport car parks.
Other initiatives include "closure/reduction of bases", "significantly reduced overtime" and "working contracted hours".
The HR strategy also deals with plans to reduce employment levels by outsourcing services such as catering and cleaning. Under the terms of an EU regulation written in to Irish law, the 1977 Transfer of Undertaking Protection of Employment (TUPE), the new contractor is obliged re-employ existing staff.
According to the report the way to avoid transfers is to make TUPE offers "unattractive". It states: "An 'unattractive' TUPE offer will give surplus staff the option to transfer to new service provider with no exit package, reduced pension rights and lessened security of employment."
Tom McEnaney
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| From: Dublin, Ireland | Registered: Jan 2001 | Status: Offline | IP: Logged
Shamjet
Instead of being 'just another number' I could order a Personal Title and help support PPRuNe
posted 20th July 2005 09:38
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Intimidation not just at Ryanair - ALT too!!
Looks like Aer Lingus have been sucked into the world of systematic intimidation of staff. Check out the links below in the "Quit or be pushed " tactics employed by the Human relations nazi's in Aer Lingus.
I remember the cabin panicing about their garish polo shirts with big dots on them thy'd be wearing in the new Willie walsh airline.
ALT are denying all at moment, saying the proposals were never implemented, however i remember also the attempts to redeploy those commuter pilots who ended up sitting on their arse's for nine months.
This can only be good news for the Knight in shinning armour dermot Mannion about to come over the hill to save the besieged Castle Shamrock!
RTE link
QF mismanagement never have been leaders and have it seems morphed themselves into nothing more than fascist brownshirts.
There is NOTHING in the way of creative vision for this once proud company.
The article does explain the bullying, aggression and out and out fear campaign being waged against us.
Pass the info onto the troops.
support PPRuNe
posted 20th July 2005 09:37
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Revealed: Aer Lingus 'quit or be pushed' plan
From Irish Independent:
(need to be registered)
http://www.unison.ie/irish_independ...&issue_id=12759
AER Lingus developed a 12-point plan to make life difficult for its employees in order to persuade 1,800 staff to accept voluntary redundancy.
The plan included:
* Suggesting the airline would introduce a tacky uniform for cabin crew.
* Tedious training programmes for some pilots.
* Deliberately changing shift patterns to make life at the company uncomfortable.
According to one informed source there was also a suggestion that cabin crew, including older air hostesses, would have to abandon their current uniform for jumpsuits and t-shirts.
The total plan is documented in a confidential Aer Lingus report called "Business Plan - HR (Human Resources) strategy 2004".
The 12 initiatives designed to make life difficult for staff are referred to in the documents as "environmental push factors".
A spokeswoman for the company acknowledged that the document had been drawn up by Aer Lingus but dismissed it as a "discussion document". She said: "Those tactics have never been embraced by either the past or present management team."
Nowhere in the 40-page report is there any suggestion that it is a draft or discussion paper.
It states that initiatives to make life uncomfortable for staff were essential to the success of the voluntary severance scheme which was, in turn, essential for the success of the business plan.
The report states: "Environment (sic) push factors are key to driving applications (for the voluntary severance scheme)". The document then details the 12 "push factors".
Top of the list is: " 'Tap on the shoulder' of all relevant superintendents." This is understood to be a reference to 200 supervisor-grade employees who were individually approached by senior management and told they had no future with the company.
The second "push" factor listed calls for performance improvement plans. Sources said these were designed to put staff under pressure at work. The third push factor listed is "attendance management".
One of the more controversial initiatives in the plan comes in at number four and is titled "adverse changes in work/shift patterns". Adverse shift changes would make life at Aer Lingus particularly difficult for employees with families.
The fifth of the strategies outlined is "called lack of availability of IWSL". This is a reference to "In Week Special Leave" which gives cabin crew the option of flexible working arrangements.
The ninth "push factor" is called "assignment to resource centre". It is understood this initiative was aimed at surplus pilots who would be assigned to the centre, known by some staff as 'Guantanemo Bay', where they would spend weeks on training modules which, according to one source, were considered by pilots to be boring and tedious.
A number of the 12 points have already been implemented. These include number 10, "no transport", which is a reference to the abolition of the special bus which ferried cabin crew working unsociable shifts to and from airport car parks.
Other initiatives include "closure/reduction of bases", "significantly reduced overtime" and "working contracted hours".
The HR strategy also deals with plans to reduce employment levels by outsourcing services such as catering and cleaning. Under the terms of an EU regulation written in to Irish law, the 1977 Transfer of Undertaking Protection of Employment (TUPE), the new contractor is obliged re-employ existing staff.
According to the report the way to avoid transfers is to make TUPE offers "unattractive". It states: "An 'unattractive' TUPE offer will give surplus staff the option to transfer to new service provider with no exit package, reduced pension rights and lessened security of employment."
Tom McEnaney
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| From: Dublin, Ireland | Registered: Jan 2001 | Status: Offline | IP: Logged
Shamjet
Instead of being 'just another number' I could order a Personal Title and help support PPRuNe
posted 20th July 2005 09:38
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Intimidation not just at Ryanair - ALT too!!
Looks like Aer Lingus have been sucked into the world of systematic intimidation of staff. Check out the links below in the "Quit or be pushed " tactics employed by the Human relations nazi's in Aer Lingus.
I remember the cabin panicing about their garish polo shirts with big dots on them thy'd be wearing in the new Willie walsh airline.
ALT are denying all at moment, saying the proposals were never implemented, however i remember also the attempts to redeploy those commuter pilots who ended up sitting on their arse's for nine months.
This can only be good news for the Knight in shinning armour dermot Mannion about to come over the hill to save the besieged Castle Shamrock!
RTE link
Last edited by jettlager; 21st Jul 2005 at 06:59.
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re: Lowest job in an airline
Posted by surfside6:
Lowest Job In An Airline
Being a "security officer" for an airline and particularly QF would have to be the lowest job on the planet...
Lowest Job In An Airline
Being a "security officer" for an airline and particularly QF would have to be the lowest job on the planet...
A friend of mine just had a QF security officer on her flight from SIN-SYD. He confirmed he had been in SIN for security searches and, of course, it is something he doesn't like to have to do.
I'm sure there are decent security officers just as there are some F/As who are arseholes.
I just hope no one gets the sack over anything petty.
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Flug,
I know what you mean but I have spoken to a few crew that have been searched and the security "people" have been real arseholes.
They are company stooges, following their orders blindly....
Compare a bottle of water to the unlimited hours wasted by office staff......that is theft not water.
I worked in QCC for a few months once, I know what goes on.
I was astounded! if crew wasted that much time hiding in the galleys as has been suggested by Esson, then the meal service would take 15 minutes and it would be 8 hours in the galley.
I know what you mean but I have spoken to a few crew that have been searched and the security "people" have been real arseholes.
They are company stooges, following their orders blindly....
Compare a bottle of water to the unlimited hours wasted by office staff......that is theft not water.
I worked in QCC for a few months once, I know what goes on.
I was astounded! if crew wasted that much time hiding in the galleys as has been suggested by Esson, then the meal service would take 15 minutes and it would be 8 hours in the galley.
