Poor Cabin Crew
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
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As a hostie who is lucky if she clears £1,200 pm LET ALONE £1,800, may I just say that I agree with pilotwolf. We will never get paid the sort of wages that we think we deserve in terms of hours, fatigue or even hard graft - I'm sure the aviation industry is not exclusive to that fact.
It's a shame that one shallow hostie's comments about being unable to survive on a bl**dy good monthly wage has sparked such a heated and offensive debate. No, it's not right that as a highly skilled engineer with years of training you are being paid less than the cabin crew, but is that really a call to belittle us and negate the job description that we fill?
I'm sure that said hostie's comments have infuriated you and highlighted an issue that you feel should be addressed, but shouldn't these pay issues be taken up with your employers?
And GIANNI, what a professional response. Aren't they the same tanks we use to make YOUR tea?
It's a shame that one shallow hostie's comments about being unable to survive on a bl**dy good monthly wage has sparked such a heated and offensive debate. No, it's not right that as a highly skilled engineer with years of training you are being paid less than the cabin crew, but is that really a call to belittle us and negate the job description that we fill?
I'm sure that said hostie's comments have infuriated you and highlighted an issue that you feel should be addressed, but shouldn't these pay issues be taken up with your employers?
And GIANNI, what a professional response. Aren't they the same tanks we use to make YOUR tea?
Join Date: Dec 2000
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What you fail to mention is that out of that £1800 , they may well have downroute expenses of approx £300 .
I don't believe that engineers should be paid badly, but having visited a vast BA hangar the other day, no-one there was in a hurry to do anything fast.
The role of cabin crew can be very demanding , and you do get alot of verbal from our lovely customers.
Besides ,if any BA engineer feels they are missing out on something, they are MORE than welcome to apply internally for cabin crew
Believe me , it does happen!
I don't believe that engineers should be paid badly, but having visited a vast BA hangar the other day, no-one there was in a hurry to do anything fast.
The role of cabin crew can be very demanding , and you do get alot of verbal from our lovely customers.
Besides ,if any BA engineer feels they are missing out on something, they are MORE than welcome to apply internally for cabin crew
Believe me , it does happen!
Join Date: Jan 2002
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hi!
Every so often someone coplains about cc pay. Leave your job and apply to be one if you aint happy!
Oh and the pilot/engineer/cabin crew/management pay argument can can be found here,
http://pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=124412
not sure how to link it but if you copy and paste you can read the 20 odd pages of it!!
kempus
oh! well there you go! bet it was an engineer that came up with that!
Every so often someone coplains about cc pay. Leave your job and apply to be one if you aint happy!
Oh and the pilot/engineer/cabin crew/management pay argument can can be found here,
http://pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=124412
not sure how to link it but if you copy and paste you can read the 20 odd pages of it!!
kempus
oh! well there you go! bet it was an engineer that came up with that!
Join Date: Nov 2003
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So Doggie ears, whats your job worth in India? The Aussie trolley dollies are taking industrial action to prevent the beginings of outsourcing. Good luck to them. If the bean counters have their way, all in flt announcements will begin with "Namasteh!".
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Does anyone else remember the occasion when the first officer on a BA flight was rescued by the cabin crew, when the window blew off on a particular 737? Maybe we should ask the pilots on that flight if we are overpaid, or if the engineers deserve their pay? HO HUM!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2001
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Which just goes to prove my point as the person certifying that windsreen job was in fact a manager who had been sat behind a desk for 10 years and only came out from behind it bacause the engineers at LHR where on strike to improve their conditions, unfortunately it resulted in a pilot nearly being killed.
So again are you happy flying around in an aircraft maintained by unhappy engineers who if conditions don't improve will more than likely leave the industry to fix the cabin crews BMW's, leaving the aircraft in the hands of managers or newly qualified engineers?
Will someone please answer the question?
So again are you happy flying around in an aircraft maintained by unhappy engineers who if conditions don't improve will more than likely leave the industry to fix the cabin crews BMW's, leaving the aircraft in the hands of managers or newly qualified engineers?
Will someone please answer the question?
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Of course, but please answer mine first:
who do the unhappy engineers expect will fight their battle for pay rise?
We sympathize, we are on your side, but what do you expect from us? Want us to demand a pay cut to raise the engineers pay? Well, after you so graciously came here telling us we don't deserve our salary, we are really tempted, honest.
who do the unhappy engineers expect will fight their battle for pay rise?
We sympathize, we are on your side, but what do you expect from us? Want us to demand a pay cut to raise the engineers pay? Well, after you so graciously came here telling us we don't deserve our salary, we are really tempted, honest.
Join Date: Nov 2001
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tewkesbury,
unfortunatly, reason has nothing in common with airlines.
The book bashers sitting in an office are making the decisions, and not for the safe and well being of aviation employees, or pax, it sucks but its the way it is.
the industry is such that CC are getting paid better than a lot of brand new pilots, engineers, etc.
Is it scary that Engineers are not happy in there job... of course, is it scarier that companies are putting F/O's in the right seat with only 200 flying hours... and are the accountants going to listen until one of our beloved aircraft goes down due pilot/mechanical failure....NO,
It is a sad fact but this industry is F###ed up at the moment and doesnt seem to be in a hurry to sort itself out.
unfortunatly, reason has nothing in common with airlines.
The book bashers sitting in an office are making the decisions, and not for the safe and well being of aviation employees, or pax, it sucks but its the way it is.
the industry is such that CC are getting paid better than a lot of brand new pilots, engineers, etc.
Is it scary that Engineers are not happy in there job... of course, is it scarier that companies are putting F/O's in the right seat with only 200 flying hours... and are the accountants going to listen until one of our beloved aircraft goes down due pilot/mechanical failure....NO,
It is a sad fact but this industry is F###ed up at the moment and doesnt seem to be in a hurry to sort itself out.
Join Date: Jul 2003
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Flyblue...I could not agree more! Fight your own battles..and if your union is not strong enough..do something about i! Rise to our level..dont let us come down to your own! SORRY!
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Well I don't think anyone actually thinks you might really lower your conditions (at airlines where hosty pay is ridiculously high, I know this isn't the case at all airlines). You've got it, you might as well hang onto it. And why not?
But in all honesty, how about YOU answer THIS question:
Taking into account qualifications, training and the ease of replacement of crew, do you really think the job demands the high salary?
Or look at it this way... if you were an impartial arbitrator in charge of dictating salary levels for a new airline, could you honestly look the staff in the eye and tell them you were going to pay the hosties more than the engineers?
Be honest.
If yes, I'd be interested to see the "justification" without resorting to slanging, threats of banning, coffee-tampering, etc.
But in all honesty, how about YOU answer THIS question:
Taking into account qualifications, training and the ease of replacement of crew, do you really think the job demands the high salary?
Or look at it this way... if you were an impartial arbitrator in charge of dictating salary levels for a new airline, could you honestly look the staff in the eye and tell them you were going to pay the hosties more than the engineers?
Be honest.
If yes, I'd be interested to see the "justification" without resorting to slanging, threats of banning, coffee-tampering, etc.
Join Date: Mar 2004
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I'm not sure there is any justification, but if it's a mere question of higher qualifications/training = higher salary, why is it that a lot of major airlines worldwide pay their F/As more than the engineers and in some cases F/Os? Does this not say a lot about how highly (or lowly) rated the engineers/F/Os actually are by the companies for which they work?
Join Date: Nov 2000
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Honestly, taking into account my qualifications, personal qualities, experience and continuous training, I feel I am definitely underpaid (but happy nonetheless on the whole).
It doesn't work this way, and nothing of the sort would ever happen: YOU as a cathegory have to negotiate your salary. If your salary is what it is, you have no one to blame than yourselves. Especially not Flight Attendants.
if you were an impartial arbitrator in charge of dictating salary levels for a new airline, could you honestly look the staff in the eye and tell them you were going to pay the hosties more than the engineers?
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Mr tewkesbury, you write that your whinge is not about cabincrew but about the broader picture of a reduction in Maintenance Standards on aircraft. A worthy concern, and one which all of us in the industry most decidedly share with you if such a reduction can be proven to exist. Is there anything substantial you would like to share with us here? Some proof, something you see happening daily? I would be very interested to hear from you on that. As you so rightly point out, proper maintance is a matter of the gravest concern for all of us. self centred cabin crew or not. 
Sharing your concern the way I do, and not doubting your motives for a second, I am somewhat mystified that you should voice your concern on the Cabin Crew forum. Since, according to your good self, your whinge is not about Cabincrew why have you chosen to unburden yourself on this particular foum? Would not your very valid concern for a percieved dropping of maintenance standards have reached a larger and more useful audience on a more widely read PPRuNe forum?
What exactly lead you to our humble Cabin crew forum if I may ask?
Oh and about ever disilusioned ; I do so sympathise.
Again a trend shared by many of us in the industry.
Small example; the company whose uniform I have proudly worn for most of my working life has just been sold wing, flap and rivet to the mob that employs Flyblue.
Am I disillusioned?
You bet!
Do I blame the folks at the cleverly run company that bought us or do I blame our own weaselfaced top management?
Mr tewkesbury, you only get one guess.
Sharing your concern the way I do, and not doubting your motives for a second, I am somewhat mystified that you should voice your concern on the Cabin Crew forum. Since, according to your good self, your whinge is not about Cabincrew why have you chosen to unburden yourself on this particular foum? Would not your very valid concern for a percieved dropping of maintenance standards have reached a larger and more useful audience on a more widely read PPRuNe forum?
What exactly lead you to our humble Cabin crew forum if I may ask?
Oh and about ever disilusioned ; I do so sympathise.
Again a trend shared by many of us in the industry.
Small example; the company whose uniform I have proudly worn for most of my working life has just been sold wing, flap and rivet to the mob that employs Flyblue.
Am I disillusioned?
You bet!
Do I blame the folks at the cleverly run company that bought us or do I blame our own weaselfaced top management?
Mr tewkesbury, you only get one guess.
Join Date: Jul 2002
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I am pleased for anyone who can get a decent wage out of the airlines. It doesn't matter what the position is.
I have to admit, however, it is a bit hard on the new flight deck crew who have to live on about £20,000 a year before tax etc and pay back the loans that they had to take out to get where they are now. It is very tough for them to make ends meet, so often get into more debt.
xx
I have to admit, however, it is a bit hard on the new flight deck crew who have to live on about £20,000 a year before tax etc and pay back the loans that they had to take out to get where they are now. It is very tough for them to make ends meet, so often get into more debt.
xx
Join Date: Aug 2003
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To slightly set the balance right, can I just point out that I joined BA in 1998, on the "new pay scale" and , working long-haul out of LGW, was lucky to take home £1100 a month. We just didn't get the lucrative destinations of LHR, and those we did have -- all one of them -- went not long after I joined. So the formula BA Cabin Crew = Terrific Pay baffles me.
I know that's not what this thread is primarily about, but hope that might put a bit more perspective on the debate.
I know that's not what this thread is primarily about, but hope that might put a bit more perspective on the debate.
Join Date: May 2004
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MY GOD! I thought an aircraft was meant to be a team thing! Obviously depends upon the airline with you are employed.
If you need to criticise any group in the industry, why not attack the cleaners? caterers? accountants? I'm sure some of them earn more $s than you do, but then again they perform tasks that you may not wish to perform.
It's that whole thing called division of (skilled) labour, and obviously your skills are with the inanimate parts of the aircraft, and not relating to the SLF.
If you need to criticise any group in the industry, why not attack the cleaners? caterers? accountants? I'm sure some of them earn more $s than you do, but then again they perform tasks that you may not wish to perform.
It's that whole thing called division of (skilled) labour, and obviously your skills are with the inanimate parts of the aircraft, and not relating to the SLF.
