Biz Jets, Ag Flying, GA etc. The place for discussion of issues related to corporate, Ag and GA aviation. If you're a professional pilot and don't fly for the airlines then try here.

Dassault Falcon 200

Old 8th Oct 2012, 23:51
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Belo Horizonte, Brazil
Age: 30
Posts: 10
Dassault Falcon 200


What can you say about Dassault Falcon 200?

I have been quoted for a job as a F/O in this type of plane, but at this time I can't access any type of content about the aircraft, like manuals, etc, from the employers, as I'm waiting for them to start my en-route only training.

So, I'm here requesting for the ones who fly/flew this type (and the Falcon 20 as they are very close to each other) any type of tips, documents, manuals, diagrams... or a word about flying this machine.

This is, also, my first post at PPRuNe

Best Regards,

Thales Coelho

Last edited by Thales Coelho; 12th Oct 2012 at 20:34.
Thales Coelho is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2012, 01:56
  #2 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Where the Quaboag River flows, USA
Age: 66
Posts: 3,332
There's still some flying?

galaxy flyer is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2012, 07:00
  #3 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Only upon request
Posts: 848
Never had the chance to fly one myself and I guess it will be a FAA registered Falcon 200 in your case.
About 30 F200s are still flying. I know one based in France (M-DEJB) and another in Moscow (VP-CCP).

A first introduction (although based on the Falcon 20).

Limitations for all Falcon 20s/200 (FAA type certificate)

Good luck!

Last edited by FLEXJET; 9th Oct 2012 at 07:03.
FLEXJET is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2012, 09:37
  #4 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 234
The US Coast Guard operated a fleet (about 40) of them but I believe they are in the process of being phased out. It is possible (?) that some on the private register are ex Coast Guard. Pilots loved to fly them as I understand they had all the good handling qualities of the Falcon 20's but the ATF3 Engine costs were well above horrendous. As said there are only a couple in Europe and support is minimal for the engine. I dread to think what the costs are now for the engine, that said the Coast Guard carried a large stock of spare engines which may be out on the market. The age of the aircraft tends to preclude electronic documents but Flight Safety still run F20 courses

Mike Echo
Mike Echo is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2012, 13:21
  #5 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Belo Horizonte, Brazil
Age: 30
Posts: 10
Oh thanks for everyone!

The airplane is currently in USA and will be exported to Brazil, under ANAC rules and register, it will be based in Brasilia (SBBR/BSB).

Unfortunately, as I will be the 3rd pilot (2 captains and 1 F/O), I`m totally uninformed about what`s happening. The jet will be operated under an Air Taxi, but as a private service. The only thing I know is that one of the captains is already doing his Type Rate in USA (how?)

The Airplane Driver website is a very good reading.

One more time, Thanks!

Best Regards

Thales Coelho
Thales Coelho is offline  
Old 9th Oct 2012, 15:28
  #6 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: California
Posts: 278

FSI has a Level D Falcon 20-F sim at the DFW facility.
ksjc is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2012, 07:28
  #7 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: France
Posts: 610
Falcon 200

Thales Coelho:

I cannot help with manuals for the 200, but have some manuals on the Falcon 20 E and F series, a lot of time on them in the past.


Tmbstory is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2012, 09:13
  #8 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Europe
Posts: 2
Falcon 200

The 200 is a marvellous aircraft marred (in my opinion) by those engines. They are not only horrendously expensive to maintain but also poor in operation when compared with modern, or for that matter even contemporarily available, power plants. If you need to go-around, you'll have time to push the levers forward and then pop down the back to make a cup of coffee and still be back up-front before anything happens.....!

Whilst it looks so very similar to a 20, it is oddly enough rather more like a 50 with one engine missing! The FAA, as far as I recall, regarded the 20 and 200 as different types.

The chap to contact for information is Darrell Rahn (Bizav Training?) in the States if he is still involved. He is 'Mr Falcon 200' and seems to do nearly all the training outside of the US Coastguard.

I've flown a few newer, shinier and more expensive aircraft but I don't think any of them handled better than a 200.
Justin Trim is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2012, 10:37
  #9 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Marriotts & Hiltons
Posts: 51
I have manuals for the 200 so pm me. Great airframe a two engined DA50 really , ATF Engines very unique ATF3 Online Museum
densityaltitude is offline  
Old 10th Oct 2012, 18:25
  #10 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Belo Horizonte, Brazil
Age: 30
Posts: 10
So the Falcon 200 is more to a Falcon 50 than a 20? Is better to study or try to understand the systems of a Falcon 50, for example, if I cannot get any material of Falcon 200?

densityaltitude and Tmbstory, I`ve pm you.
Thales Coelho is offline  
Old 12th Oct 2012, 18:36
  #11 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Far away from LA
Age: 99
Posts: 1,032
Everything is "special" on a 200; 3 spools engine, Falcon 50 parts, Riveted fuselage, full wing slats; "Analog DEEC".

Darrell is indeed the guy to speak with.

We got the world record between Gander and Paris in a 200; 4h24 minutes ! a blast !

Downside : it is more expensive to operate than a 900; burn the same amount of fuel, take half of the payload , and go halfway than a 900; but they cost nothing to buy, and may be you could find someone that will pay you to take it. There is virtually no loan engines ( they are different from the coast guard one's; UH25 have 5400 Lbs of thrust vs 5200 on the 200). if your plane has no reverses, tailwind start is a no-no.

The only "tip" i can give you , will be to be careful when setting take off power. 60% stabilized, 80% stabilized, then let go the brakes and firewall; caution with Xwind on power up. Then 800C of ITT is a good target for the initial thrust reduction ( noise and speed); it is barely stage 3.

You ill have a loads of fun, but the mechanics also..but it is a safe airframe; ALL the 200's are in a flyable condition now...

A falcon 50 sim can be used for training and the profiles, same avionics, the instructor is just "adjusting" the central engine thrust

Last edited by CL300; 12th Oct 2012 at 18:38.
CL300 is offline  
Old 4th Jun 2013, 19:48
  #12 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: France
Age: 63
Posts: 3
FALCON 200 - ATF3 engine


Is there someone who knows companies who do in Europe service and support for the ATF3 Engine for a Falcon 200?

Has far I know beside the M-DEJB there is also the VP-CCP (ex HB-VNG) the M-ENTA (ex EC-JBH) in Europe flying.

marcweis is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2013, 09:19
  #13 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Europe
Posts: 12
DFS at Paris used to have a couple of chaps that still knew the engines. Take a large pot of gold...(not cheap).
DefDefect is offline  
Old 5th Jun 2013, 14:06
  #14 (permalink)  

Don Quixote Impersonator
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: Australia
Age: 73
Posts: 3,408
Museum pieces now but as described F50 thru and thru. My advice is to buy one of those if you want a small Falcon. The F20 might work if range more than 1000nm isn't an issue.

If the owners don't have an MSP type plan on the engines they either have more money than God or need certifying.

There are no spare engines outside the plan and they are probably out on other frames.

The hourly MSP cost for both engines is horrendous. Memory fading but last i saw was USD$1850. Support outside the continental US will be a downtime problem.
Usual superb Falcon airframe and outstanding low level fuel economy as it was the commercial take on an aircraft (Guardian) developed for a USCG contract.

My advice would be ride it for as long as it lasts but be ready to bail when it turns to do do as it inevitably will unless the owners have very very deep pockets.

The usual motivation for purchase of said type is the cheap purchase price and that the owners will almost pay you to take it away.

You get exactly what you pay for, when it breaks donate it to the local kindergarten as a playground. Not one of M'sieu Dassaults best commercial efforts although the Guardian has done sterling service and USCG has deepish pockets.

best of luck
gaunty is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2013, 21:11
  #15 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: France
Age: 63
Posts: 3
Thanks DefD. So DFS in Paris is the only one in Europe.

Best regards
marcweis is offline  
Old 10th Jun 2013, 21:24
  #16 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: France
Age: 63
Posts: 3
Thanks gaunty.

You means the F20 retrofitted with TFE-731-5BR?

Best regards
marcweis is offline  
Old 15th Jun 2013, 14:02
  #17 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NW UK
Posts: 1
After 41 years in the business and many type ratings this is the best handling plane I've ever flown, however the cost of engine and air frame maintenance is horrific.
I have been flying VCCP recently and have plenty of relevant information on the aircraft.
If you get to fly it you will have a great time!
Bearb is offline  
Old 4th Apr 2014, 12:45
  #18 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Toulouse
Posts: 1

Hi all,

Does anyone have any contact info for these aircraft? (operator/owner)

bcatls is offline  
Old 25th Jun 2014, 17:11
  #19 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: BVI
Age: 33
Posts: 1
POH Falcon 20

Good day all,

I am flying in the BVI and a friend of me is starting operation on a DA20, we are looking for a POH of a Falcon 20 and/or an operational manual for the DA20.
If one of you is flying one somewhere in the world or have an operational manual even from years ago, I am interested.

Thanks a lot,

IslandJu is offline  
Old 26th Jun 2014, 12:58
  #20 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Ch.
Posts: 87
some more info ...

ericthepilot is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.