Citation 750 down in Egelsbach.
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Marginal VFR turned out to be a few minutes later to be IFR...
Just a few minutes after the crash weather in EDDF was following
METAR EDDF 011920Z 02005KT 0400 R07R/0750VP2000D R07C/0700V1600D R07L/1100VP2000D FG BKN001 07/07 Q1025 NOSIG=
Maybe there was some fog around at the accidentplace which was not taken into account by the
AUTO Metar from Egelsbach...
I had been do EDFE several times, tough thing to get an X in there on 1400m - again under
these conditions. Citation X minimum landing distance 1000m. EDFE LDA on 27 1166m
LINK: Area Chart EDFE, to illustrate the position of EDFE an EDDF...
http://www.egelsbach-airport.com/_img/aip/dfs_07.jpg
While I never want to criticize colleagues, this approach under these met conditions seems
to me a bit useless as you have Frankfurt a few miles to the west which has all IFR approaches
you can dream about... CAT III was in prorgess there.
My condolences to the familys who beareved. Very sad!
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EDDF is really close by, 15 minutes drive
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Yes. But have you tried to get an airport slot there recently? On short notice maybe? At seven in the evening on a weekday? In a private aircraft?
But should that motivate one to seriously consider EDFE in a C750? Definitely not the right airplane for that airfield.
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An ILS can't even then be installed as EDDF is too close and there is no space to legally design IFR procedures to EDFE until a few rules are changed.
Anyway, with the weather during the time of accident (EDFE 011750Z AUTO 03003KT //// // /// 08/07 Q1025) it wasn't even good enough for a CAT I ILS, nevermind RNAV or other IFR procedures. And to fly VFR in that kind of weather, well....
Anyway, with the weather during the time of accident (EDFE 011750Z AUTO 03003KT //// // /// 08/07 Q1025) it wasn't even good enough for a CAT I ILS, nevermind RNAV or other IFR procedures. And to fly VFR in that kind of weather, well....
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EDFE 011820Z AUTO 06002KT //// R27/P2000N // /// 08/08 Q1025 [18:20 UTC / 19:20 LT: Automated weather report: Wind 060 degrees at 2 knots; Runway 27, touchdown zone visual range is more than 2000 meters; temperature 8°C, dew point 8°C; QNH 1025 mb]
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What are the minima for a non precision approach?
The slashes in the Metar replacing the values for visibility and clouds stand for "cannot be determined" which can mean anything. We will have to wait for reports from other pilots and witnesses on the ground what the met conditions were like at the time of the accident.
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Well, EDDF right next to EDFE had at least for some time low vis procedures in progress yesterday evening. The weather in quite a few areas in western germany was pretty unpleasant, very low ceiling if any, heavy mist or fog and so on.
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Yes. But have you tried to get an airport slot there recently? On short notice maybe? At seven in the evening on a weekday? In a private aircraft?
But should that motivate one to seriously consider EDFE in a C750? Definitely not the right airplane for that airfield.
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Gettheritis?
Going around @ Egelsbach is no fun at all, especially not in a Citation. Remember: you had cancelled IFR prior to landing, and Langen Radar has long forgotten about you. Now you find yourself caught in a small cage of airspace, max altitude 1.500ft. (3.500ft, respectively) with only Egelsbach Info, and the big jets lingering only 2000ft. above you.
What do you do?
-Circle and wait for the wx to approve?
-Divert, including a huge workload with Langen Radar, and all the
trouble after landing, because your company/boss/passengers won´t be amused?
-Close you eyes, pray, and try to make it anyway?
What do you do?
-Circle and wait for the wx to approve?
-Divert, including a huge workload with Langen Radar, and all the
trouble after landing, because your company/boss/passengers won´t be amused?-Close you eyes, pray, and try to make it anyway?
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not pretty....
Edit: photos removed...too many peeps reading too much into them, besides the press offers more
Edit: photos removed...too many peeps reading too much into them, besides the press offers more
Last edited by WestWind1950; 3rd Mar 2012 at 10:45.
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The airfield is owned by Netjets and is promoted for exactly this purpose.
The C750 definitely is not the kind of airplane to be operated into relatively short fields.
These pictures though give me the chills. I used to fly this particular one years ago (when it had a different tail number).