Getting into Ag Flying

[VFE]

Hi folks,

Was just wondering whether this is still something that occurs in the UK? If so, how does one get into the insane game? If not, are there opportunities for hours builders to go abroad and earn a crust doing ag flying?

Thanks for any replies,

VFE.

[the wizard of auz]

Not really an industry to try and build hours in. Its usually a career choice as the requirements to get in and qualifications are pretty high and the path long and difficult to get a seat.

[tukituki]

ag flying

Ag flying down here is the sort of job that can take years to get a seat by the time you do loading etc and have to be in it for the long haul

[VFE]

Cheers for the replies guys.

VFE.

[multime]

No glamour

After 1o years and 1 divorce i can finally say its worth it.
Took some convincing though.
Goodluck M

[Pturn]

AG job again

Originally Posted by multime

After 1o years and 1 divorce i can finally say its worth it.
Took some convincing though.
Goodluck M

Fine, I have looked for 10 years I'm going to divorce ... still no job..see!
By the way where are you from, maybe I'm in the wrong place.

Take care
Pturn

[SNS3Guppy]

If so, how does one get into the insane game?

Ag flying is not a game, it is a profession. It is not an entry level job in any sense of the term. It is far from insane, but rather a calculated program involving trained, experienced professionals who have a background in all flight related theory, as well as entimology, chemistry, crop science, aircraft maintenance technology, and training in the particulars of low level precision application of chemicals to enhance crop growth, fight fire, protect or clear wildland, etc.

If not, are there opportunities for hours builders to go abroad and earn a crust doing ag flying?

No.

Don't build hours. Build experience. You can write all the hours you like in your logbook, and they are meaningless. Experience is priceless. Don't go in search of hours. If that's what you're after, save yourself some aggravation. Buy a good pen, spend a quite evening in front of a fireplace, and falsify it. it's just ink.

Experience, on the other hand, is hard earned, can't be bought, and can't be falsified or made up.

Two people can fly the same airplane for one hour, doing the same maneuvers, under the same conditions...one builds an hour of experience, the other logs an hour of time. The difference? You. Which one will you be?

Getting into ag flying isn't easy. Going abroad and hoping to get into ag flying is nearly impossible.

If you want to fly ag, it's certainly an attainable goal, but not an easy one. You're going to want a good aircraft maintenance background, preferably a mechanic certificate, at least a thousand hours of conventional gear (tailwheel) time in ag type or lager airplanes (not cubs or RV-4's), and these days, some good turbine time to get insured...and generally at least a thousand hours of ag time before anyone will hire you anyway. That's the catch 22, and it's hard to get hired without it. The question you need to ask is how badly you want to go this route?

As far as "building hours" doing ag...the number of hours you'll fly won't make it worth your while. Some years yes, some years no...but if you go after ag flying to fill or pad your logbook, you'll likely be sorely disappointed years down the line.

Personally, I've found little flying that's more fulfilling and enjoyable...but that's an entirely different reason to do it than building hours, and the reason that most do it is to put bread on the table. More than a game, it's a living...a hard working, hard earned living.

[AT502B]

Ag-flying

Well said, I don't know how many times I've been at an airport ferrying my ag-plane somewhere, and someone will run up and ask me: "how do I get into this game? It sure looks like fun! I'm looking for an easy way to build time."

This isn't a time building business anymore with million dollar airplanes and $70k /year insurance bills. It's a profession and theres no easy way to start, except at the bottom. It could take 10 years, a couple marriages and lots of heartache before you finally get into the good seats.
If that doesn't scare you off- welcome!
Don't get me wrong we need young blood in this business if we want it to survive- it should however, ONLY be for the right reasons.

[Ag2A320]

It isnt a game, and the reality is that unless one has over 500 hrs ag time, its next to impossible to get a seat flying Ag, I have had pilots come up and inquire, and as much i d love to give some of them a chance at my old seat, insurance dictates min 2500TTAg with 500 hrs on type, havent had any accidents in 15 yrs of operations but my premiums keep going up, id rather hire a old hand with no accidents or violations, than train a newbie and worry about him bending the airplane on the first load , with the costs of a new turbine @ $800K or a good old one inexcess of $260K, I just dont feel the risk is worth it. I'd rather get permission from day job to fly back up on my days off;when one of my guys needs time off etc ,than hire a newbie to the business, its the sad reality, we operators hashed it out at the 2006 NAAA convention in Orlando, that the average age of an Ag-pilot is 45 yrs old and the median is not getting any younger.

Funny thing got my Ag- seat withless than 600TT and 50 on type at 22, and flew D-C Bull/Turbo Thrushes for my first seat . Now i can't afford to give the same break to my loaders/ A&P apprentices whom i trust and have instructed the intricases of agflying; spoke to my insurance company and others till i'm blue in the face, the jump in premium is so horrendous for what i'd pay to cover him/her, we could purchase a spare -34 Thrush every 3 years till he/she gets to 2500 TTAG. I fly less than 50hrs a year ag, and even with airline job, the premiums work out more cost effective and have better liability coverage to keep myself listed as a relief pilot and contract other pilots with 3500 -17,000TT Ag as necessary, if the work cant be covered by the fulltime guys or myself.

The UK/CAA and UK/EPA conspired to kill the Agflying industry in the UK became heavily over regulated, which is a shame, because the UK consortium CropCulture/Micronair had a big influence on the ag flying worldwide. Cropculture was founded by Britten- Norman,McMahon and Mann in 195o's owned shares in Snow Aeronautical, Transland etc.Last based in Bembridge, Isle of Wight, went bust in 1985 with the demise of spraying in the UK, operated over 160 aircraft in 50 countries.

For training recommend Agflight in Bainbride Georgia USA, Orsmond Airspray in South Africa, Univ. Louisiana Ag-course, or any other advertised in AG-Airupdate. Stay away from Sam Riggs or any entity he's involved with. Ayres/Thrush shut down their school in the 1990's, not sure what Air Tractor does.Simcom's Ag course is a bit pricey, not required till getting into your first turbine seat.

Most likely first seat going to be a Pawnee or husky with luck AT-301 0r 600 Thrush. hope you can break in, sorry couldnt offer a Seat.