Ahhhh Austerrrrrrrrrr (Merged)
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Lowtimer.
According to the history books. When Beagle went tips up. It was only the models that Beagle had actually designed that went to SAL. ie. The pup/ aeirdale and basset.
The 'Auster' designs were sold seperatley to Hants and Sussex aviation (H&S), for £ 35K in 1969. This can be confirmed when I look in my old log books to see some repairs carried out in the very early seventies to a H & S repair spec.
It's after that things are not clear. I have heard mention of something going to Newark, or was that before H&S in Portsmouth. I also now understand that Light Aero Spares hold 'manufacturing' rights to the Auster series (don't know about beagle versions of same). But how this came about and what they actual hold, I don't know.
I have also been told that the Caa are the design authority for the type now. ?? (like the ARv)
As for DeHaviland support getting the Auster on the books. From my point of view this would be worst thing that could happen. As this would surely eliminate any chance of getting them on a PFA scheme ever again. Because they would then have manufacturers support, unlike now.
So can anyone clear up who holds rights to what....
According to the history books. When Beagle went tips up. It was only the models that Beagle had actually designed that went to SAL. ie. The pup/ aeirdale and basset.
The 'Auster' designs were sold seperatley to Hants and Sussex aviation (H&S), for £ 35K in 1969. This can be confirmed when I look in my old log books to see some repairs carried out in the very early seventies to a H & S repair spec.
It's after that things are not clear. I have heard mention of something going to Newark, or was that before H&S in Portsmouth. I also now understand that Light Aero Spares hold 'manufacturing' rights to the Auster series (don't know about beagle versions of same). But how this came about and what they actual hold, I don't know.
I have also been told that the Caa are the design authority for the type now. ?? (like the ARv)
As for DeHaviland support getting the Auster on the books. From my point of view this would be worst thing that could happen. As this would surely eliminate any chance of getting them on a PFA scheme ever again. Because they would then have manufacturers support, unlike now.
So can anyone clear up who holds rights to what....
Thread Starter
bingoboy I have heard of Austers being placed on Permits if they were being rebuilt from a collection of different airframes and / or the logbooks etc had gone missing. I think these aircraft are registered under the Permit system as Auster replicas but I am open to correction as usual 
Thread Starter
Nice photo Mr. G. I never realised that Austers / Beagles had wing to strut fillets fitted. Anybody out there got a set?
I've also got the spats and one part of the fitting kit. Anybody got the wheel nuts and mounting plates to go with them?
I've also got the spats and one part of the fitting kit. Anybody got the wheel nuts and mounting plates to go with them?
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OD,
errrrr... yes, sorry, I rather failed to cotton on to the full content of your question and went off half-cocked. "Engage brain before starting keyboard" is my motto from now on.
errrrr... yes, sorry, I rather failed to cotton on to the full content of your question and went off half-cocked. "Engage brain before starting keyboard" is my motto from now on.
Gnome de PPRuNe
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LowNSlow, I wonder if the spats and fairings were an attempt to "Americanise" the Beagle/Auster range. Looks like the inaugeral Air Fair, so possibly a demonstrator...
Wasn't there also an Auster Atlantic somewhere around 1960 - a nose wheel Auster 5 (?) that looked very similar to the Airedale?
Cheers
Treadders
Wasn't there also an Auster Atlantic somewhere around 1960 - a nose wheel Auster 5 (?) that looked very similar to the Airedale?
Cheers
Treadders
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Re Permit Austers
LownSlow... I know that some managed to go PFA permit route ages ago , not heard of any kits of unregistered parts being accepted though so am quite doubtful about this. (I did hear of a chap who had enough spare wings/fuse and parts to build a Beagle Pup and was told the only way forward was to find the paperwork from a writeoff and CAA Cof A it). I have no axe to grind either way but just feel that it's time the CAA allowed PFA type permits on these old birds and hope someone is actively lobbying.
LownSlow... I know that some managed to go PFA permit route ages ago , not heard of any kits of unregistered parts being accepted though so am quite doubtful about this. (I did hear of a chap who had enough spare wings/fuse and parts to build a Beagle Pup and was told the only way forward was to find the paperwork from a writeoff and CAA Cof A it). I have no axe to grind either way but just feel that it's time the CAA allowed PFA type permits on these old birds and hope someone is actively lobbying.
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BingoBoy
Ref: Permits
The Caa did allow Austers to go onto a Pfa permit some years ago, but only the Autocrat models and resticted to 2 seats (as was pfa limit then). Not sure why was only these, as all technically have no manufactuere support in place.
From what I can find. There are only 6 still on this scheme (4 with original minor engines and 1 with a major) Plus of course my example that was put on the scheme to fit the Rover 3.5ltr V8 car engine. Why it was not a popular option to go pfa I don;t know. Could be the two seats or restictions on overseas flying back then.
Do I think they should be allowed back on the register. Yes along with imports of older cubs, lucombes etc.
Can people put 'kit' austers on a pfa scheme. Yes it's very straight forward. I know of one locally, a 'crofton' auster. But how is it legal you ask. Well what is a registered aircraft ? It's the largest individual mass, ie the fuselage. If you rebuild / restore a fuselage with a serial number that has flown before it must go back on a Caa licence. But with the demise of Beagle-Auster there where several different airframes around that had not been completed and never registered. Generally almost complete except a few holes or gussets. I know of 4 of these, 1 flying, 1 under build and 2 in storage. These can / have been rebuild using existing components on a pfa scheme. Although you do still have to meet a pfa approved design brief etc.
Why not with a pup as you mentioned. Has the fuselage ever flown / been registered. Plus they have manufacturer support, hence my comment in another post about my fears if Austers where past on to DSL.
Understood ??
Ref: Permits
The Caa did allow Austers to go onto a Pfa permit some years ago, but only the Autocrat models and resticted to 2 seats (as was pfa limit then). Not sure why was only these, as all technically have no manufactuere support in place.
From what I can find. There are only 6 still on this scheme (4 with original minor engines and 1 with a major) Plus of course my example that was put on the scheme to fit the Rover 3.5ltr V8 car engine. Why it was not a popular option to go pfa I don;t know. Could be the two seats or restictions on overseas flying back then.
Do I think they should be allowed back on the register. Yes along with imports of older cubs, lucombes etc.
Can people put 'kit' austers on a pfa scheme. Yes it's very straight forward. I know of one locally, a 'crofton' auster. But how is it legal you ask. Well what is a registered aircraft ? It's the largest individual mass, ie the fuselage. If you rebuild / restore a fuselage with a serial number that has flown before it must go back on a Caa licence. But with the demise of Beagle-Auster there where several different airframes around that had not been completed and never registered. Generally almost complete except a few holes or gussets. I know of 4 of these, 1 flying, 1 under build and 2 in storage. These can / have been rebuild using existing components on a pfa scheme. Although you do still have to meet a pfa approved design brief etc.
Why not with a pup as you mentioned. Has the fuselage ever flown / been registered. Plus they have manufacturer support, hence my comment in another post about my fears if Austers where past on to DSL.
Understood ??
Thread Starter
bingoboy I think it was to reduce the number of anomolies that the CAA stopped the import and PFA'ing of Cubs, Luscombes etc. There does seem to be a re-focusing of the PFA on it's original remit of "amateur" built aircraft, or is that just my perception of it?
Personally, I think that the CAA should devolve it's control of non-commercial light aviation to a PFA/BGA/BMAA combination. As the current PFA remit covers aircraft with 4 seats and 250 hp(?) I don't that this would need to be anything other than an expansion program for the PFA. This would allow a system based on annual inspections whithout the star annual every 3 years as per the current PFA system. It would also encourage owners of al kinds of aircraft to understand more of the actual mechanics of the them. The world of light aircraft maintenance (especially vintage) seems to be shrinking which does not bode well for he future IMHO.
Coming back onto topic, this system would also allow my Auster to be a permit aeroplane, bonus
Oscar Deuce if I bought a new, unregistered fuselage frame (there was one advertised in PF) and rebuilt it using all the components of my current Auster, could I call it a 'LowNSlow' Auster and have it under a PFA permit with a new registration?
I don't think I'd bother for previously mentioned reasons but it would be nice to know that I could.
Personally, I think that the CAA should devolve it's control of non-commercial light aviation to a PFA/BGA/BMAA combination. As the current PFA remit covers aircraft with 4 seats and 250 hp(?) I don't that this would need to be anything other than an expansion program for the PFA. This would allow a system based on annual inspections whithout the star annual every 3 years as per the current PFA system. It would also encourage owners of al kinds of aircraft to understand more of the actual mechanics of the them. The world of light aircraft maintenance (especially vintage) seems to be shrinking which does not bode well for he future IMHO.
Coming back onto topic, this system would also allow my Auster to be a permit aeroplane, bonus
Oscar Deuce if I bought a new, unregistered fuselage frame (there was one advertised in PF) and rebuilt it using all the components of my current Auster, could I call it a 'LowNSlow' Auster and have it under a PFA permit with a new registration?
I don't think I'd bother for previously mentioned reasons but it would be nice to know that I could.
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LownSlow
Yes you could do just that. If you do a g-info search summary of austers (179 in total) it will show the crofton auster and I think a kingworthy ? (cont. 0200 powered). They were done just like this. All you have to do is present a design breif/ plan to the pfa about what you will build and how it will be safe (basically just copy an original model) and there you go. Don't know how economical it would be (buying wings, u/c, controls etc) seperately, as opposed to a complete project as I basically have.
Besides after you go through all that hassle and get the thing flying after a couple of years. The Caa with probably relent and allow others on the scheme....anyway- we hope.
Any info on this frame you saw advertised. Pm me...o2
Yes you could do just that. If you do a g-info search summary of austers (179 in total) it will show the crofton auster and I think a kingworthy ? (cont. 0200 powered). They were done just like this. All you have to do is present a design breif/ plan to the pfa about what you will build and how it will be safe (basically just copy an original model) and there you go. Don't know how economical it would be (buying wings, u/c, controls etc) seperately, as opposed to a complete project as I basically have.
Besides after you go through all that hassle and get the thing flying after a couple of years. The Caa with probably relent and allow others on the scheme....anyway- we hope.
Any info on this frame you saw advertised. Pm me...o2
Thread Starter
Q2 I'm sure it would be a lot of effort and would produce an aircraft that would be worth half of what it cost 
It would be nice to have the option of fitting adjustable (or more comfortable) seats, relocate the throttle quadrant so my right knee doesn't get trapped between it and the stick...... nah, I can live with these little niggles for the cost involved 
It would be nice to have the option of fitting adjustable (or more comfortable) seats, relocate the throttle quadrant so my right knee doesn't get trapped between it and the stick...... nah, I can live with these little niggles for the cost involved
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All the recent advice on picposting has encouraged me to have a go. Hope it works.
The photo was taken at Croft (S of Darlington) in June 1949 and shows an Auster fitted with a castoring undercarriage. It's display caused much amusement as it charged about the airfield in a series of sideslips with one wheel in contact with the ground occasionally lifting off the change direction/wheel.
The pilot was, I think, Ranald Porteus who also devised the avalanche aerobatic manoeuvre.
The photo was taken at Croft (S of Darlington) in June 1949 and shows an Auster fitted with a castoring undercarriage. It's display caused much amusement as it charged about the airfield in a series of sideslips with one wheel in contact with the ground occasionally lifting off the change direction/wheel.
The pilot was, I think, Ranald Porteus who also devised the avalanche aerobatic manoeuvre.
Thread Starter
gyp I hade heard of the infamous castoring (cross-wind) undercarriage but never seen a picture of it before. Apart from what appears to be a big hinge on the wheel hub it looks remarkably standard. As I understand it, this option was not the most popular one Auster ever offered
PS the Auster in the pic appears to be a Cirrus engined Autocrat with the bent steel Fairy-Reed prop. The wheel hub covers look neat, they tidy up the wheels very nicely. Mmmmm must speak to my friendly parts supplier and get some. Got to be easier than fitting spats...........
PS the Auster in the pic appears to be a Cirrus engined Autocrat with the bent steel Fairy-Reed prop. The wheel hub covers look neat, they tidy up the wheels very nicely. Mmmmm must speak to my friendly parts supplier and get some. Got to be easier than fitting spats...........
Thread Starter
Yahoo my Auster has been put back together after the Star Annual and now just needs a flight test to revalidate the C of A.
Hopefully this will be done before the Pprune Fly-in at Duxford on 5th April.........
AM has been flight tested by RE Bishop's son and pronounced fit to fly. All I have to do now is get home in time for the fly-in
Hopefully this will be done before the Pprune Fly-in at Duxford on 5th April.........
AM has been flight tested by RE Bishop's son and pronounced fit to fly. All I have to do now is get home in time for the fly-in
Last edited by LowNSlow; 28th Mar 2003 at 12:41.
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Anyone seen the latest issue of the club mag.
With reference to the 'rebuild in Sweeden' I notice this has what appears to be a three peice windshild. Something I have seen before.
Anyone know anything about them. Was It a factory item or an after market fit to avoid cost ??
With reference to the 'rebuild in Sweeden' I notice this has what appears to be a three peice windshild. Something I have seen before.
Anyone know anything about them. Was It a factory item or an after market fit to avoid cost ??
Thread Starter
O2 I think the three piece windscreen was the wartime pattern. I would imagine it would have been easier to repair / replace than the blown windscreen fitted post war (certainly as of 1946). It'd certainly be cheaper to replace, Light Aero are selling new windscreens for 450 GBP + VAT etc. ...........
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Lycomings in Austers
I posted earlier on this thread about G-AOFJ, an Auster 5. Sadly not airworthy at this time. I would like some info. on the Lycoming 0-290-3 fitted in her.
I understand these engines came to England as a result of the lease/lend program during WW 2 when no suitable British engine was available in quantity. How long had they been around in the USA ? Were they used as ground power units in grain hoists ? How many other Austers apart from G-AOFJ have these engines ? Is a different version of the engine, with higher compression, fitted to some older Aeronca or Stinson aircraft?
Thanks,
Mr G.
I understand these engines came to England as a result of the lease/lend program during WW 2 when no suitable British engine was available in quantity. How long had they been around in the USA ? Were they used as ground power units in grain hoists ? How many other Austers apart from G-AOFJ have these engines ? Is a different version of the engine, with higher compression, fitted to some older Aeronca or Stinson aircraft?
Thanks,
Mr G.
Thread Starter
Mr. G as far as I can tell from G-INFO, there are at least 20 O-290 engined Auster 5's out there. There is also one (G-AIKE) which doesn't have the engine type registered but it was previously USA registered so it could be a possibility. Looking at the dates these aircraft were registered (1957-1959), I don't think it was Lend-Lease. A lot of the wartime Austers were powered by American engines to ease the strain on the British war industry. However, the Lycoming(?) engined Auster 4 became the Cirrus engined Auster 5 Autocrat in 1946 as the supply of American engines had dried up. This rules out the Lend Lease agreement and the only other American support initiative I can think of was the Military Aid Program which wouldn't have applied to civilian aircraft.
I know that Continental O-200's were used as GPU's and I suspect that the Lyc O-290 may have been as well. I'll have a snout around on Google.
Does anybody know why Ms. Innocent deregistered poor old G-AOFJ exactly 4 years ago today?
I know that Continental O-200's were used as GPU's and I suspect that the Lyc O-290 may have been as well. I'll have a snout around on Google.
Does anybody know why Ms. Innocent deregistered poor old G-AOFJ exactly 4 years ago today?