Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Misc. Forums > Aviation History and Nostalgia
Reload this Page >

Adios, Queen of the Sky!

Aviation History and Nostalgia Whether working in aviation, retired, wannabee or just plain fascinated this forum welcomes all with a love of flight.

Adios, Queen of the Sky!

Old 5th Jul 2020, 02:46
  #21 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Middle East
Posts: 398
Interesting to see that Lufthansa’s A380s are heading out of the door but the 748s seemingly will stay. There’s no question that the 380 is fantastic from a pax perspective but it seems ironic that a simple stretch and re-engine of a 50 year old design won the day against Airbus’ half billion dollar behemoth.
reverserunlocked is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 06:24
  #22 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: USA
Posts: 1,870
Any lessons from the past?

In the wake of 9/11 (or maybe it was the 08 financial crisis), demand for the 757 was low, and Boeing pulled the plug, only to find there was a huge demand for it once the industry picked up steam again. Airlines have had to get used airplanes. I wonder if they're considering that. Boeing is a business, but my inner child doesn't want to see the 747 go.
Check Airman is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 07:32
  #23 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: attitude is nominal
Posts: 987
With older nose door 747s to be retired this might pretty much change the air cargo industry as we know it. Are those oil and gas guys aware of this?
Less Hair is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 16:37
  #24 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: London UK
Posts: 6,517
Hasn't this ad-hoc oversize business been significantly lost already to Antonov 124 operators ?
WHBM is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 18:51
  #25 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: attitude is nominal
Posts: 987
If you go charter to wild places and for real outsize stuff for sure but not on the main routes.
Less Hair is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 20:01
  #26 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Oil Capital of Central Scotland
Age: 53
Posts: 448
Hi Less, Yes we are aware, broadly via our regular outsize shippers, that the nose door fleet is starting to wind down. Having said that the amount of tooling that HAS to be shipped as one long length has diminished considerably since the earlier days. Even now, the modern equivalent of the kit we had to use a 124 to fly it to Cape Town is around 60% of the previous linear sizes with a commensurate reduction in dead weight is a major reduction in heartache when you have to ship it to the ar$e-end of nowhere.

The previous shipments we did with the 124 had much less than 25mm height clearance to get into the beast and required us to partially dismantle the kit after functional testing, so that we didn't over stress the floor. with an excessively concentrated load, so it's in everyone's interest if we can get the sizes and weight slimmed down but still do the same job, especially as most of the production sites are far, far away from major airstrips, never mind well-equipped highly international cargo hubs.
Donkey497 is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2020, 23:45
  #27 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Dunda
Posts: 127
Originally Posted by Check Airman View Post
In the wake of 9/11 (or maybe it was the 08 financial crisis), demand for the 757 was low, and Boeing pulled the plug, only to find there was a huge demand for it
You seem awfully sure of your story for someone with doubtful timeframes!!

Check the 757 orders and deliveries on wiki. Hardly anyone wanted it pre-9/11 and after that it was show over.
patty50 is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 00:09
  #28 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Everett, WA
Age: 65
Posts: 2,940
I've posted this before, but it apparently needs repeating:
The 737-900ER is what killed the 757. Aside from some range, the 737-900ER could do pretty much anything the 757-200 could, cost less to operate, and it cost much less to build (and hence Boeing could charge significantly less for it and still make money. The airlines simply did not see enough value in the extra range of the 757 to offset it's much higher price. Boeing tried to save the 757 with the 757-300, but it flopped big time (costing Boeing a big chunk of change in the process).
By the time Boeing pulled the plug on the 757, the production rate had gotten so slow that the factory overhead was a killer. Boeing repurposed the factory space that was producing ~1 757/month into a 737 line cranking out 14 highly profitable aircraft per month.
tdracer is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 08:06
  #29 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 98
Lufthansa 747-200F


First 747F, 747-230F, D-ABYE, line number 168, delivered, Sept 3, 1972
airman1900 is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 15:05
  #30 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: The Back of Beyond
Posts: 399
What was the rush in getting these Beetles to their destination I wonder? Or maybe just a publicity pic/stunt..
Flying Clog is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 17:30
  #31 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 12,158
Publicity shot, obviously. It's not a coincidence that they are mostly blue with a few yellow ones (geddit?).

Apparently a 747F can swallow 72 Beetles:


DaveReidUK is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 18:58
  #32 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 1,925

I always loved these ads ! I even still have a yellow T-shirt with that tagline in some drawer.
172driver is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2020, 19:31
  #33 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: attitude is nominal
Posts: 987
Lufthansa has been quite innovative with the then new 747: First cargo, first tourist charter use (Condor), contributing quite a bit to the successful 747-400 concept. They even operate the -8.
Less Hair is offline  
Old 9th Jul 2020, 16:55
  #34 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Shoreham
Age: 68
Posts: 34
In the 1980s Lockheed explored the possibility of a hydrogen powered Tristar but the large tanks required proved a problem.
I always thought hydrogen was the future and the upper deck of the 747 the possible tank solution.
The 747 freighters will be around for many more years and maybe the ideal test aircraft for hydrogen.
Possibly a hybrid with 2 engines on Jet A1 and 2 engines on hydrogen?
B744IRE is offline  
Old 14th Jul 2020, 10:35
  #35 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Europe
Posts: 22
Originally Posted by Less Hair View Post
Lufthansa has been quite innovative with the then new 747: First cargo, first tourist charter use (Condor), contributing quite a bit to the successful 747-400 concept. They even operate the -8.
Before the COVID-19 crisis LH was very happy even with economy of the 747-8, on their routes. And at the beginning of the crisis this type was very asked again. Seems like a niche.

Nevertheless, I learned that 2 engines are the future and meanwhile I'm convinced.
Ray_Y is offline  
Old 17th Jul 2020, 07:19
  #36 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Shoreham
Age: 68
Posts: 34
1969

In 1969 the first B747 flew...in 1969 men walked on the moon...in 1969 the first Concorde flew...in 1969 I completed my RAF Flying Scholarship and got my PPL.
15,800 hours on the B747 and 1,690 Atlantic crossings later...
In 2020 the B747 is on the scrap heap and so am I...that's progress I suppose.
Happy landings everyone.

Last edited by B744IRE; 17th Jul 2020 at 08:01.
B744IRE is offline  
Old 17th Jul 2020, 07:30
  #37 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Europe
Posts: 22
Originally Posted by B744IRE View Post
In 1969 the first B747 flew...in 1969 men walked on the moon...in 1969 the first Concorde flew...in 1969 I completed my RAF Flying Scholarship and got my PPL. 15,800 hours on the B747 and 1,690 Atlantic crossings later...
In 2020 the B747 is on the scrap heap and so am I...that’s progress I suppose.
Happy landings everyone.
Have you also suffered from its initial P&W engine problems? Or have you been in RR land?
What's your final opinion about 2 pods replacing 4 pods airliners inside and outside EDTO?
Ray_Y is offline  
Old 17th Jul 2020, 07:36
  #38 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: europe
Posts: 9
World’s largest operator confirmed today that they are retiring their entire fleet of 31 744s with immediate effect. A sad day for the Queen of the Skies.
gear lever is offline  
Old 17th Jul 2020, 07:38
  #39 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Hampshire
Posts: 31
Very sad indeed;

"British Airways has said it will retire all of its Boeing 747s as it suffers from the sharp travel downturn.

The UK airline is the world's largest operator of the jumbo jets, with 31 in the fleet.

"It is with great sadness that we can confirm we are proposing to retire our entire 747 fleet with immediate effect," a BA spokesman told the BBC.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-53426886

Auxtank is offline  
Old 17th Jul 2020, 07:41
  #40 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: U.K.
Posts: 11
Originally Posted by gear lever View Post
World’s largest operator confirmed today that they are retiring their entire fleet of 31 744s with immediate effect. A sad day for the Queen of the Skies.
Atlas Air still operate around 45 747s in different variants compared to BAs 31.
PinOnTheRight is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.