Jackaroo
Yes, I believe so...........
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I dont remember Pat Shea Simmonds having a beard.However I was at the same Prep School as his Kids Robert and George,Charlie having gone elsewhere.I did my Flying Scholarship in 1962/63 at Wiltshire School of Flying under the Instruction of John Heaton ,the one eared CFI,who used to freewheel Jackaroos and any John Isaacs Aeroplanes over the lower Hangar Roof dropping floor bags on those below.There were magic old WW2 Instructors with names like "Sprocket" Spencer Smith,"Ramsay"Smith,and the redoubtable Bill Leary,whose wife "Tickle" ran the cafe,plus others I cant remember or flew with.Having learnt to fly I used to return some weekends and fly the Parachute Club,under a tall blonde haired Yank known as "Aces",in a Jackaroo with the side doors removed.The static lines were attached to metal bulkeads inside the cockpit,and the Instructor sat beside me with 2 studes in the back.It took over 30 minutes to get above 5000ft,then a throttle off spiral descent to land before the chutists-this used to regularly blow the exhaust gaskets."ZT" was all black in those days and rested engineless in the hangar owned by Charles Boddington.Also "APAM used to rest in the hangar unflown.The Zion Koenig was there as well as about 3 or 4 Proctors.The Jackaroos I flew in 1963 were :- G-AOEX<OAP<OIX<OIW<OIR<OAJ.In 64 they were temporarilly grounded after one spun in over Chilbolton,and the ASI had to be moved from left side of cockpit to far right,so that the Instructor could see it from behind.The Stude was killed and the large Dutch Instructor survived,as I recall.The Army Flying Club from Old Sarum,used to shoot Pheasants over Inkpenn Ridge from a Jackaroo ,with the Cockpit sides off, with Land Rover and Dogs on the ground-I seem to remember it was a Major Peter Kent in charge,but great fun was had in these now nearly extinct aeroplanes!!I think Pat Shea Simmonds helped design and test fly them for the Airfield Owner and Boss,Sqn Ldr Doran Webb.Other characters were Ken Voss who also parachuted and owned a very nice Emeraude as did Luella Selka who also drove a dove grey MGA and often offered a lift to us kids into Andover!!!!Other Instructors were Ted Clowes who then flew at Wallop,as did Joe Ruprecht(Ex WW2 Polish Ace).Various DogFights were staged near Shaftesbury,to encourage their Tiger Moth to get airborne.Poor Ted later flew out to sea in a FRADU Hunter never to be seen again in the late 70s.Very happy and Fun days!!!!!!
One final memory was that "ZT" had a Chipmunk Gipsy 10/2 fitted and metal prop,which both Boddingtons used for Air Racing,but never flew during the time I was there,and the engine had been removed.Also a Magister was in bits in one of the nissen huts.
One final memory was that "ZT" had a Chipmunk Gipsy 10/2 fitted and metal prop,which both Boddingtons used for Air Racing,but never flew during the time I was there,and the engine had been removed.Also a Magister was in bits in one of the nissen huts.
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As a slight aside, I used to sit around with my mother in the late 50's early 60's whilst my "Uncle" Jim attempted to obtain his PPL on the Jackaroo. I can remember at one stage there being three Mosquito's parked by the control tower, which if memory serves me had been sold/were being sold to Jordan. I think that I have some photo's somewhere and must have a dig and delve.
Paxing All Over The World
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Thank you for all the information and I'm glad that the topic was of interest. The gentleman in question was Ron Prizeman and his funeral was today. Here is one paragraph from a tribute that one of his sons read, that may amuse:
You can imagine his pride and excitement when, in the 1980s during a family trip to an airfield, one of the few Jackeroos unexpectedly landed. "I want to shake that pilot's hand" Dad said. You can imagine his dismay when the pilot managed to taxi it into a gatepost, smashing the wing. "Do you still want to shake his hand?" I asked mischievously. "I want to punch his nose" was the reply.
Gnome de PPRuNe
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Pax, I was going to ask. Bless him and RIP.
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Delving into my old paperwork,I see Thruxton was under "Western Air Training" in 1962,becoming Wiltshire School of Flying later in 63.I think Denis Neville still owns one of the only Jackaroos left in the UK??Most were converted back to Tiger Moth Spec.With regards to the 3 Mosquitos,there were in the 80s 3 burnt out wrecks still,just about identifiable by their Centre Sections and U/C mounts still in the long grass just north of the now Grain store old Hangar.Maybe removed after the Race Circuit was developed,but these were never sold and burnt in situ.Very Sad!!!??Of course the Jackaroo was always known as the "Thruxton Jackaroo".
My very first powered flight (not counting passenger flying) was a joyride in a Jackaroo at Thruxton; 60 minutes of total bliss and I can still remember every minute of it, although not exactly when, or who the pilot was. Probably in 1960/61. I had a gliding Silver C (Lasham), but this was exciting and different. It launched me into a career in the aviation industry now fast approaching its, and/or my end.
I blame that b****y Jackaroo for the fact that I spent last Tuesday in a large room in Germany, with 175 other victims, undergoing death by Powerpoint as low-quality European officials turn aviation safety into an ever-tightening spiral of over-complicated, self-defeating bureaucracy, each Regulation produced to correct the errors of its predecessors, and each one more badly thought through, and more badly drafted than the last.
PS Please ignore the above, sorry for the drift. I'll have a strong drink now to make it better.
I blame that b****y Jackaroo for the fact that I spent last Tuesday in a large room in Germany, with 175 other victims, undergoing death by Powerpoint as low-quality European officials turn aviation safety into an ever-tightening spiral of over-complicated, self-defeating bureaucracy, each Regulation produced to correct the errors of its predecessors, and each one more badly thought through, and more badly drafted than the last.
PS Please ignore the above, sorry for the drift. I'll have a strong drink now to make it better.
1. Why Jackaroo?
With De Havilland Australia producing the Drover (named after the Australian equivalent of a cowboy), and Jackaroo inferring a small or junior worker, the inference is that it would be something smaller and cheaper to run.
"During a dual practice forced landing on the aerodrome, the aircraft suddenly stalled while turning at a height of about 500 ft. It entered a spin and this continued until the aircraft hit the ground. There was no fire. The student pilot was sitting in the left hand front seat, and the instructor was sitting behind him; because of this, the instructor was unable to see the airspeed indicator, which was in front of the student. Furthermore, when the instructor attempted to take control, the student pilot could not understand him when he said "Let go, I have control", because no intercom was fitted. The student did not let go of the controls, but continued with his efforts to recover from the spin, until the aircraft hit the ground. The report on this accident was published by HMSO as CAP 233."
The location here is identified as Thruxton aerodrome, though of course that's not far from Chilbolton There may be some confusion with the accident that destroyed another Jackaroo, G-APAI, also in April 1964 (on the 8th), which did occur at Chilbolton.
The report also shows both the student and instructor surviving, albeit with serious injuries.
Paxing All Over The World
Thread Starter
Prizeman's family told me that the idea for the Jackaroo came from an instructing airfield where they wanted to make it more economical than using the 2-seater Moth.
It was only later that the crop conversion was made. However, the word 'jackaroo' to indicate someone in training would be appropriate and could be how the name came about.
It was only later that the crop conversion was made. However, the word 'jackaroo' to indicate someone in training would be appropriate and could be how the name came about.
The two group leaders, who were PPL holders, bought a Jackaroo without reference to the rest of us and the instructor withdrew as the conversion made instruction impossible in his opinion, since there were no instruments for the instructor - and his view forward to the right was compromised. It seems he was all too right, but happily he didn't flight test the problems he foresaw.
Last edited by Allan Lupton; 28th Nov 2015 at 15:48. Reason: spolling
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I find it interesting that whereas the Jackaroo seems to be regarded as a complete dog, the Fox Moth with the same engine and theoretical 3 pax capacity was highly regarded as an efficient aircraft. Different times I guess.
G-APAP was at Upavon when I was stationed there. On occasions G-APAM would also be available. I will not disagree with earlier comments but AP definitely was the tug in residence in my time. I left Upavon in March 73. I have it in one of my logbooks too.
Mechta,
I know the origin of the word Jackaroo (and its non-PC version, Jillaroo
)
What I was wondering was how an Australian name was chosen for a British aircraft?
I know the origin of the word Jackaroo (and its non-PC version, Jillaroo
)What I was wondering was how an Australian name was chosen for a British aircraft?
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I42,
Yes, I'd always wondered about that myself.
A couple of explanations offered on here so far cause me to go - 'hmm', but that's about it.
If the intention was to market it to Outback station owners, then that clearly failed.
I stand to be corrected, but they didn't sell out here at all.
Such a machine may have had a chance in the thirties but definitely not in the fifties.
As for 'Jackaroo' hoping to align itself with the very dubious success of the DHA Drover, well...
Admittedly, they had in common a De Havilland heritage, relatively simple rugged airframes and used the bulletproof Gipsy Majors for noise.
They were both marginal performers as well, so there may be something to it.
.
Yes, I'd always wondered about that myself.
A couple of explanations offered on here so far cause me to go - 'hmm', but that's about it.
If the intention was to market it to Outback station owners, then that clearly failed.
I stand to be corrected, but they didn't sell out here at all.
Such a machine may have had a chance in the thirties but definitely not in the fifties.
As for 'Jackaroo' hoping to align itself with the very dubious success of the DHA Drover, well...
Admittedly, they had in common a De Havilland heritage, relatively simple rugged airframes and used the bulletproof Gipsy Majors for noise.
They were both marginal performers as well, so there may be something to it.
.
Last edited by Stanwell; 29th Nov 2015 at 14:42.
Such a machine may have had a chance in the thirties but definitely not in the fifties.
I had wondered about the Drover connection too.
Perhaps they were hoping to tag on the coat tails of that other, very successful British aircraft with an Australian name!
GGR155
Hi GGR. That would by 1972 have been the Wyvern Army Gliding Club, which moved from Netheravon to Upavon in 1972, bringing PAP with them after RAFGSA Moonrakers closed down at the end of 1971. Ralph Jones would have dropped in to do repair assessment and air tests in PAM. By then he was mostly using it to commute Thruxton/Compton Abbas (which he ran with John Thorne). The 'commute' down the A30 was done almost irrespective of weather - don't ask me how I know...
G-APAP was at Upavon when I was stationed there. On occasions G-APAM would also be available. I will not disagree with earlier comments but AP definitely was the tug in residence in my time. I left Upavon in March 73. I have it in one of my logbooks too.
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
Perhaps they were hoping to tag on the coat tails of that other, very successful British aircraft with an Australian name!
I always thought that the Jackaroo was an Australian modification for the Tiger Moth, and the Thruxton was the Canadian modification was the tandem enclosed cockpit.
I didn't think the Blackburn Billabong was THAT successful.
Try the next letter of the alphabet!
Stationair,
The Canadian Tiger Moth was only ever known as the DH 82c. Canopy, gear legs further forward, heater (?), electric starter (?) and an unspung tailwheel. A member of my gliding club rebuilt one with open cockpits. I suppose you could call it a DH 82ca:
Last edited by India Four Two; 1st Dec 2015 at 09:14.