Bristol Britannia details

[forget]

......... " he braked well " The true meaning of course is known only to those who moved the lever.

OK. I know I'll regret this - but I'll bite.

[brakedwell]

I've had a look at the Britannia info. Thanks very much. I's a shame someone did not have the sense to keep at least one fully intact. I wonder how many of todays aviation types read your pen name and interpret it as " he braked well " The true meaning of course is known only to those who moved the lever. Best.
828a.

XM496 is complete and well looked after by a dedicated team of ex RAF Brit engineers at Kemble. When the need arises it can be taxied with all four engines running.
PS. I never moved that lever, but I asked for it to be moved many times over a period of ten years!

[Herod]

Come on, Brakedwell, put us all out of our misery. I believe there were settings of "Brake Dwell" and "Superfine" on the props, but I don't understand the significance. I was also led to believe that some confusion over their selection may have been a factor in the overrun at Khormaksar, photos of which I posted earlier on in this thread. No prejudgements, I was only a helicopter pilot at the time (the shadow of the Wessex can be seen on the wing in one of the photos).

[brakedwell]

The reverse procedure involved the Flight Engineer pulling back a reverse arming lever until it dropped into a detent position. This allowed the propellor pitch to pass through three pitch locks and produce reverse thrust. The standard landing briefing by the pilots used to be something like: After touchdown I will call for Superfine, Brakedwell and then Reverse as ordered.

The Khormaksar overrun was caused by the RAL not being in it's full detent position, thus producing forward thrust instead of reverse when the power was increased to slow them down, until it was too late to stop at the end of the runway. I seem to remember the captain had just been promoted to the LHS and the F/E was new on type

Were you on 78 Sqn? I left 105 Sqn in August 1966 for the Brit fleet. During my time in Aden I was lumbered with a Board of Enquiry for the 78 Sqn Wessex which, due to a loss of power, dropped the underslung Beaver it had just rescued from a Radfan wadi where the army pilot had force landed with engine problems. I was very very relieved when they opened up the suspect Wessex engine (sealed by the plod) and found severe sand induced damage along the full length of the compressor.

[Herod]

Yes, 78, right up until the final minute; midnight 30.11.67. Check your PMs

[Emeraldgreen52]

Britannias and British Eagle

Hi
I joined the site because i an classified as a wannabe, but have loved Aviation since the early 50s, Age give away here. But father was in the Army and our first flight was to Malaya in 1956 and returned in 1958. Flight due to the Malayan Emergancy. Familys still went and we were in Jahore Baru. Dont know the aircraft on the return but my farther still alive at 69 said it was a Avro York from Stanstead on the out going flight. Freddie Lakers business on charter to the Forces i think?. The Bristol Brits i went on and remember so well was outgoing from Stanstead to Singapore via Brindisi and down to Kuwait and over to Columbo as it was then known. We had a problem on the out going flight from kuwait which was about July August 1966 and taking off in the early morning we did the hold brakes on and run up engines for a chase down the runway but the out starboard engine was awash with fuel i think and it was all flames from the exhaust so even after V1 um rotate! and at least 30ft off the deck we put down and and reversed props like mad, but we ended up off the runway. We stayed overnight in a Hotel while another engine was flown out. I dong know the Call sign for this sorry but we do have a photo in black and white from a Box Browni Camara wigh i think G-AOVA parked after we had a go aroung because of a rain storm. Also a picture of my sister and brothers going up the steps.
The return was on a LLoyds registered Brit G-AOVT in 1968.
I have a copy of the internal flight infomation given out by the Captain( two pages) with the flight path shown all the way from the Middle East.
What nice memories. The British Eagle Terminal was in Knightbridge London

Best wishes to all

Wish i had my time over again as would be a Pilot.

[b377]

MERV32249213

Can I refer you to my Propellor thread in Tech forum I've posted a few querries on the Britannia. ( and the CD6/7 B377)

I was once told that the chracteristic sound of the Britannia was due to the engines coming in and out of sync thus producing that fading sound of Britannias flying above in the distance.

Some really nice photos in this thread ..

First time I've read anyone calling a Britannia a slow & bl..dy AWEFUL airplane.

[brakedwell]

I was once told that the chracteristic sound of the Britannia was due to the engines coming in and out of sync thus producing that fading sound of Britannias flying above in the distance.

That's a new one to me. I found the prop sync worked well.

[tonytech2]

The Brit hydraulics ran at 4000 psi which was strange to an American. In spite of this, any time we worked on the hydraulics we had to be careful to do a thorough bleed job to get the air out. Had several flight returns because the gear wouldn't come up after hydraulic work. It was airbound and needed bleeding.

Any truth to the tall tale of a Brit making a "tippy-toe" landing with the truck unrotated?

[pjac]

Crews only requested the prop to be held, during it's engine start-if there was a wind present that caused the prop to rotate in the opposite direction, after the prop-brake was released. The prop (if unrestrained and the wind was strong enough), could pick up a considerable rotation speed in the wrong direction and then cause considerable bearing load and adverse effects of gas temps over the turbine-before rotating in the intended direction. The procedure was to hold a blade between finger and thumb until the turbine began to drive the prop shaft-there was no "Clunk" as suggested by some further on, in this article, the clunk was the prop brake disengaging. The blade then moved ever so gently out of the holder's finger/thumb.

[pjac]

At the risk of being a pain-I'd like to modify the brief/call given for landing-It would be ofttimes, "Superfine", "Brake Dwell Inners", "Brake Dwell Outers", Reverse -as required. Depending on the runway length, this could vary from moderate to full reverse.

[Emeraldgreen52]

Brits in Singapore

Hi Just a line to say i do think that the pic of G-ARKA in the Moonsoon rain could well be the one we flew in about August 1966 on our way out from Stanstead. I have a black and white picture of it at Colombo but its a bit far off to see the Reg No. ( Pixels are made from a Box Brownie Camara.) We came back in a Lloyds registered Brit because British Eagle was Closed down in late 1988 if i am about right?

I was so pleased that G_ANCF Charlie Foxtrot is back in British Eagle Livery and sat at Liverpool Speeke Airdrome not far from the Old Holtel which is now owned by the Marriot Hotel Group.

Regards from Andrew

[828a]

Brake Dwell

pjac:

I am a little confused by your comments about the use of brake dwell and your statement referring to "Brake Dwell" inners and "Brake Dwell" outers. As far as I recall when the single "Brake Dwell" lever was moved from its inflight forward position to the fully rearward position it caused all four engines to go into "Brake Dwell". Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain to me the origin of how one could select inners or outers as required. It did not happen on the Britannia 102!!

828a

[brakedwell]

I spent ten years flying RAF and Civil Britannias and can confirm that Brake dwell could only be selected simultaneously on all four propellors. Reverse could be used on individual engines.
The landing briefing was: I will call for Superfine, Brake dwell and REVERSE AS ORDERED. ie. Inners or outers.

[Emeraldgreen52]

Brits in Singapore and trouping

Re Hunting Clan.

I have now seen at least three or four Brits that were more than likely used from Stanstead in the ealy 60s for Trouping and think that they were G-AOVT G-AOVA G-AOVS and possibly G-ARKA.
I wish there was a data base of passengers that could be accessed just like the ships one from Lloyds registers.
I will be going to Liverpool to see Charlie Foxtrot in British Eagle Livery as soon as i am able.
I will research Hunting Clan and see what i come up with.

Regards Andrew.

Ps i have 763 logged hours on Flight Sim FX2004. Nearest to real flying with actual Control from Vatsim controllers on line from flight planning to correct procedures for take off and IFR control and landing approach procedures etc.

[Varipitch]

JAck Malloch's 44 Operation

Indeed you are right. Jack had a GREAT operation with the Forty Four TR-LVO
I should know-I was on it.
Anyone wanting to know more-try the CL44 Association-or any one of the 200 strong Association.

[Postfade]

Thought I'd throw up another couple...both these at doing the 'Changi slip' I guess, although the second shot is Paya Lebar, Singapore.



XM490 taxies in with a thunderstorm behind. 1963.



The batsman in 'best whites' implies a VIP flight perhaps. This was late 63 or early 64 when Changi's western dispersal was being re-surfaced. The Brits and the Comet XR399 behind were working into Paya Lebar.

David Taylor.

[prospector]

828a

" One of their Chipmunks botched a landing on the grass strip that was positioned between Rw02 and the main taxiway just as we were on the taxiway alongside where it happened. ( we were at max take off weight bound for Hongkong ). The resultant Chipmunk recovery and overshoot could very well have caused a collision and it all happened just as the before take off checklist was being read. "

Is it possible you have a date for that flight that this incident happened?

Hopefully not in Dec 59 or Jan 60, was operating the chipmunk VR-SDW from the Singapore Aero Club in those months with a brand new PPL, and gave myself a few frights taking on X wind landings, not really appreciating how fast the wind could spring up in front of approaching thunder heads.

[India Four Two]

Brittania Prop Checklist

In 1968, I had a flight-deck ride on a Brittania from Lyneham to Akrotiri and return. I remember there was a part of the pre-takeoff checklist called "Locks and Stops(?)". The FE explained all to me after the flight, but I've forgotten the details. Can one of you experts refresh my memory?

My seat was in what used to be the Signaller's station and I remember during the flight, I moved to the FE's seat while he used the Signaller's table to eat his meals. I was cautioned very strongly by the Co-pilot not to pass any drinks to the pilots over the central console, in case of a spillage causing a major electrical problem and also:

"Don't touch those four buttons."
"Why?"
"Because they feather the props!"

[828a]

Royal Singapore Flying Club Chipmunk overshoot:

prospector:

It wasn't you so you can rest easy. The incident occurred about February 1962. I did not note anything about it in my log book because we had to submit it to the Chief Pilot for checking and authenticating twice a year and what occurred was best forgotton. I did some interesting Chipmunk flying with the Royal Singapore Flying Club about the time you were there, it was payroll dropping into isolated rubber plantations necessary because of the threat of insurgents ambushing payroll armoured cars carrying cash by road for paying the wages of the rubber tappers. It was all good fun, the Britannia one day and the Chipmunk the next. Regards

828a