Air Cadet Gliding pix in the 80s (pre glass)
T31 v T21
One had a 'trip' in the 31 and a 'ride' in the 21.
In practice the 31 did all the hard work (in all weathers) and the 21 was reserved for 'nice days' with plenty of helpers,and only really earned its keep when AE flying was tasked.
The real worry was getting caught out on the field if a line squall came through,and not having enough bods to festoon on it (plus a couple in the cockpit holding the spoilers out).
You only had to see a 21 on its back once to make you sure the conditions were very 'secure' to drag it out in the future.
In practice the 31 did all the hard work (in all weathers) and the 21 was reserved for 'nice days' with plenty of helpers,and only really earned its keep when AE flying was tasked.
The real worry was getting caught out on the field if a line squall came through,and not having enough bods to festoon on it (plus a couple in the cockpit holding the spoilers out).
You only had to see a 21 on its back once to make you sure the conditions were very 'secure' to drag it out in the future.
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T31 VT21
Hi Pobjoy, yes, looking in my 3822 I see that most flights in the T31 were in the order of 3 to 5 mins, leaving one on arriving back on terra firma in one piece thinking 'did I just go somewhere'! I seem to remember that 800ft off a launch at kenley was good. I'll pm you for a chat, my 'rise' from servicing Rallye Clubs at Air Touring (Biggin Hill) to 747's is too long,boreing and off thread. Sorry to hear that Eric Lawrence is no longer with us, I last saw him when I was at Air Touring Services in 1971, he turned up there one day to go flying.
Thanks Astir8 for the info on getting hold of a T31....not sure if I could afford the trailer at the moment!
Thanks Astir8 for the info on getting hold of a T31....not sure if I could afford the trailer at the moment!
SOP at Halton for proficiency cadets was first 3 flights (local landmark famil, primary effects, further effects) on the Sedburgh then if the cadet wasn't too big, you converted to the Mk3 for the rest of the syllabus including your 3 solos. Larger cadets stayed on the barge. Average flight times were about 5 min for Sedburgh and 3-4 min for Mk3.
Last edited by chevvron; 28th Jan 2013 at 20:05.
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An increasing percentage of the T21 fleet is being fitted with centre of gravity release hooks which make winch launching much more pleasant (one hand not two or four!) and launch heights about 50% better. Would you believe over 2000 feet has been achieved at Weston on the Green?
Spring trimmers also being steadily fitted and you'd be amazed what an improvement to the handling a strip of tape along the aileron hinge line makes.
They never told you that in the ATC!
See
T.21 Restoration - Key Publishing Ltd Aviation Forums
for an ongoing and epic T21 restoration in Holland
Spring trimmers also being steadily fitted and you'd be amazed what an improvement to the handling a strip of tape along the aileron hinge line makes.
They never told you that in the ATC!
See
T.21 Restoration - Key Publishing Ltd Aviation Forums
for an ongoing and epic T21 restoration in Holland
Last edited by astir 8; 29th Jan 2013 at 10:36.
Solo at RAF Hornchurch 1960
I was a member of 291 (Chelsea & Westminster) Squadron ATC based in Regency St, London SW1. CO was Flt Lt. McKenzie-Lowe, who was ex CO of Kenley Gliding School.
I achieved my A & B at RAF Hornchurch. (HCH)
My first air experience flight was a soaring flight of 25 minutes in a Sedburgh, thermalling over the Ford motor works at Dagenham. Subsequently, I was not impressed by 3 minute circuits in the Cadet Mk3!
I remember the ATC gliders dong left hand circuits, the RAFGSA doing right hand circuits, with a static balloon in the centre of the airfield for parachute training, all operating simultaneously. Solo cadets coped with this.
Unfortunately - no pics.
Controls
Instruments
Spoilers
Trim
Release
Straps
CISTRS
I achieved my A & B at RAF Hornchurch. (HCH)
My first air experience flight was a soaring flight of 25 minutes in a Sedburgh, thermalling over the Ford motor works at Dagenham. Subsequently, I was not impressed by 3 minute circuits in the Cadet Mk3!
I remember the ATC gliders dong left hand circuits, the RAFGSA doing right hand circuits, with a static balloon in the centre of the airfield for parachute training, all operating simultaneously. Solo cadets coped with this.
Unfortunately - no pics.
Controls
Instruments
Spoilers
Trim
Release
Straps
CISTRS
Hornchurch solo 1960
A sad reminder of 'what was'
Hornchurch Gone
Fords "
Mk111 "
T21 "
At least 291 lives on.
Hornchurch Gone
Fords "
Mk111 "
T21 "
At least 291 lives on.
Last edited by POBJOY; 13th Feb 2013 at 01:53.
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Hemswell 1969-71
I have many fond memories of sub-3 minute flights at Hemswell and Spitalgate.
At Hemswell the grass strip used was parallel to the tarmac runway, and had a field of standing cereal crop on the under-run. One instructor's favourite wheeze was to approach a bit hot and flare into the crop which made an awfully scary noise as it battered the nose, then burst out and pop the spoilers again to land. The ATC student usually climbed out with a fit of sneezing.
Even as a callow 14 year-old I remember being a bit worried that any old New Holland bailer abandoned by the farmer would 1) Not be visible, & 2) Be a bit solid
Picture is June 69 and what I remember as golden wavy wheat across the peri-track behind looks like grass. I have mislaid the rest of the pics.
I suspect that this glider was day-glo and silver dope, although I recall at the time that day-glo printed as plain red on photo paper.
At Hemswell the grass strip used was parallel to the tarmac runway, and had a field of standing cereal crop on the under-run. One instructor's favourite wheeze was to approach a bit hot and flare into the crop which made an awfully scary noise as it battered the nose, then burst out and pop the spoilers again to land. The ATC student usually climbed out with a fit of sneezing.
Even as a callow 14 year-old I remember being a bit worried that any old New Holland bailer abandoned by the farmer would 1) Not be visible, & 2) Be a bit solid
Picture is June 69 and what I remember as golden wavy wheat across the peri-track behind looks like grass. I have mislaid the rest of the pics.
I suspect that this glider was day-glo and silver dope, although I recall at the time that day-glo printed as plain red on photo paper.
CISTRS
This will revive some memories CISTRS!
When I was in Australia getting checked out in a Twin Astir I was asked by the checking pilot why I was thermalling in 4 up! They would not bother until it was at least 10 up!
My response was that I learnt to thermal in 2 down because that was better than 10 down!!
When I was in Australia getting checked out in a Twin Astir I was asked by the checking pilot why I was thermalling in 4 up! They would not bother until it was at least 10 up!
My response was that I learnt to thermal in 2 down because that was better than 10 down!!
Last edited by Frelon; 13th Feb 2013 at 11:33.
This will revive some memories CISTRS!
Thanks. Certainly brings back the memories....
15 years after going solo at Hornchurch, and after getting a PPL at Sportair Flying Club (Biggin Hill) on a Fournier RF-5, I became one of Gerry Fuller's crew as a Civilian Instructor at 618 VGS West Malling. I was very pleased to see that the aircraft were unchanged.
We used to spot giant mushrooms on the airfield during the flights.
I agree - gliding in UK makes you very good at scratching in minimal lift.
Sport air Flying Club
Yes, I flew for a while at Sportair. Great sports flying club, I enjoyed flying the RF4s, at £4.50 an hour, could not be beaten at the time. I think I was the only member of the club to actually switch the engine off to try thermalling them! I found out that they were not very good (unless you had a stonking thermal - rare in southern UK) and they needed lots of sky in which to dive the aircraft to get the prop turning fast enough to restart the engine!
I would have loved to fly their SFS Milan (RF4 with 15 metre wings) but it was not available to the club members.
Never mind, I could still fly the fretwork fighters at 615 Kenley free of charge
I would have loved to fly their SFS Milan (RF4 with 15 metre wings) but it was not available to the club members.
Never mind, I could still fly the fretwork fighters at 615 Kenley free of charge
My response was that I learnt to thermal in 2 down because that was better than 10 down!!
But thats one reason why gliding gives a better foundation to future pilots, just as bike riding does for drivers.
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Book on RAF Syerston
How do you get a copy of this book.
Having flown from there on many occasions, the history of the station particuarily the Gliding would be most interesting.
Having flown from there on many occasions, the history of the station particuarily the Gliding would be most interesting.
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As I'm in my mid-40's I'm obviously a young upstart compared to some of my contemporaries on here!
SISTRS must have been the forerunner to CB SIT CB which adorned every control panel of 618's aircraft in the early 80's when I did my BGT on a MkIII at West Malling.
From memory, and probably in the wrong order:
Controls
Ballast
Straps
Instruments
Trim
Canopy
Brakes
I later went on to be a staff cadet, CI and supernumerary officer at 618 and loved every minute of it. The camaraderie and firm friendships made there have endured to this day.
Arkwright
SISTRS must have been the forerunner to CB SIT CB which adorned every control panel of 618's aircraft in the early 80's when I did my BGT on a MkIII at West Malling.
From memory, and probably in the wrong order:
Controls
Ballast
Straps
Instruments
Trim
Canopy
Brakes
I later went on to be a staff cadet, CI and supernumerary officer at 618 and loved every minute of it. The camaraderie and firm friendships made there have endured to this day.
Arkwright
Last edited by Arkwright; 18th Feb 2013 at 09:34.
Cockpit Checks in Air Cadet (and other) Gliders
When I started in 1959, it was CISTRS!
Controls, Instruments, Spoilers (although we did not have them 'till later), Trim, Release and Straps.
At some later stage there appeared to be a move towards becoming aligned with the BGA system - initially CBSITCB, Controls, Ballast, Straps, Instruments, Trim, Canopy and Brakes, then latterly CBSIFTCB, by adding Flaps.
Not too sure whether this occurred before the move to GRP, but suspect it did because the little Dymo Tape embossed aide memoirs on the instrument panels of the Mk111 and T21 disappeared over time.
Seems that CBSIFTCB has stood the test of time, now with E for Eventualities added.
No doubt the cadets of today have to read their cockpit checks from a published list! Perhaps one of the youngsters will be along soon to enlighten us
Controls, Instruments, Spoilers (although we did not have them 'till later), Trim, Release and Straps.
At some later stage there appeared to be a move towards becoming aligned with the BGA system - initially CBSITCB, Controls, Ballast, Straps, Instruments, Trim, Canopy and Brakes, then latterly CBSIFTCB, by adding Flaps.
Not too sure whether this occurred before the move to GRP, but suspect it did because the little Dymo Tape embossed aide memoirs on the instrument panels of the Mk111 and T21 disappeared over time.
Seems that CBSIFTCB has stood the test of time, now with E for Eventualities added.
No doubt the cadets of today have to read their cockpit checks from a published list! Perhaps one of the youngsters will be along soon to enlighten us
CBCITCB 1963 at Lasham