What’s a check in agent??
i

The whole point is being missed here, whether you agree of the demand of the passenger wanting to be seated with his family or not, when you board the aircraft you agree that you will follow crew member instructions if you agree or not none of these instructions are unreasonable.
This guy flat out denied and if you watch the video in full he comes across as intimidating to the CM by raising his voice. The CM escalated to the PIC where then the AFP got involved where they also gave this guy a lawful direction where he denied after multiple warnings AFP officers they also escalated as this guy denied to follow their lawful directions.
All this guy had to do was follow the direction of the CM and none of this would of occurred and he would be in ML with his family that it was so important for him to sit with, now he is on the other side of the country wasting money on hotels. I hope he gets the full extent of the law thrown at him and never to fly a QF group AC again. We can’t have this behavior occurring on board AC.

And do you believe that story to be accurate? If so you aren’t using your brain to overcome your emotions, you’re just identifying a story that fits with your idea that things are no good now days, and rolling with it. Apply some critical thinking to that story. It’s complete rubbish.
No they don’t. Why do you think that’s the case? I’ve operated about 4000 sectors out of major Australian ports in the last 15 years and have had Police to the aircraft twice. Both well deserved, one booze and ego, the other mental health.
If it could have been handled better my guess is that the improvements are to be made after the AFP entered the scene. That said, I don’t want to judge them without knowing the full story.

they got away with it at launch because the limits applicable to the weight and balance envelope contained substantial buffers to accommodate that system rather than an index effect for each kg in each seat based on passenger weight. Please learn something about weight and balance before making such a statement.

No. I’ve actually witnessed it several times and had to put the brakes on re calling the police. If you’re sitting on the flight deck or CC you don’t see everything that goes on in the gate or at check in. There is a more eager tendency to call than there was in the past. My judgement is that the training and the leadership has declined. My brain functions fine thanks and I don’t need a lecture about things I’ve witnessed with my own eyes.

All the FA had to do was recognise that it didn't really matter if both the swappers were happy and the passenger would be in ML with his family instead of back spending a load of money on hotels etc. etc.

See, anyone can make an argument that makes sense to their own point of view!

Fair enough. Just because you don't hear of it does not mean it is not happening. Unfortunately, I disagree with your comment on Quantas CC's being professional above what is now the norm. From 1990 to 2000 I noticed a very obvious decline in CC's manners and attitude and up until today has not changed. Don't get me wrong I have come across some fantastic people and understand that dealing with the ice cream licking public is no picnic (very memorable one on a Dash 8 with 28 odd passengers. Greeted everyone, children included, by name and continued to do so while checking and serving, with extraordinary proficiency, professionalism and engagement. My children being, quite young, were astounded that this person knew them)

My point of view is you follow the rules, this guy did not.

A myth often repeated.

Do some research on DVI teams. Victims are never identified by the seat they are sitting in for all the obvious reasons.
​​​​​​​Also remember that in the developing country that is Australia, airlines have no idea WHO is traveling on their aircraft.

Decades flying in a big country to the north and I’ve seen whole aircraft been taken over by passengers in protest of delays , police turn up and shrug saying it’s your problem . Never seen cops remove a passenger unless arrested for stealing only in Australia do we taser for wanting to swap seats ?

In this instance the seating issue shouldn't have made it to the aircraft, traveling as a family he should have had it sorted at checkin, checking in at a kiosk doesn't permit seating coordination, it's pot luck. Traveling as a family of five we leave seating till we put the bags through, staff have always managed a row plus two across the aisle or row in front/behind. Don't know if having frequent flyer cards helps, or the fact we are always early. Checking in late is obviously going to seriously curtail your options.

You risk being nibbled to death by ducks. If you let one passenger dictate where they'll sit and how they'll behave then you'll be dealing with, potentially, 20 then 30 and then a whole plane load of pax who want to decide how the operation is going to be run.

Society has changed. More flying, fewer frills, more passengers, greater sense of entitlement. You'd have to be blind not see the changes in societal behaviours since the internet was invented.

They're the person that checks people in with bags or those that can't manage to operate the check in kiosk.

Again, I'm not an idiot, I know flying has changed but that's not what I was talking about. There are ways to deal with things and ways not to. I wasn't there for the whole thing but I suspect the approach was possibly a bit more officious than it needed to be.

Spot on Megan. It's not rocket science.

I'd go one step further and say Facebook not the internet. Everything seemed normal until about 2009ish then it all just went off the rails in terms of social interaction/decorum.

So how did the cabin crew even become aware of these two swapping seats? I've seen passengers move to empty seats before take off, I've seen passengers swap seats during boarding or before take off. I've never seen the cabin crew come and tell them to move back, even if they saw them do it. I thought maybe the guy just took that seat and the assigned passenger complained to the crew when he found the guy in it, but in I see in the video the swap seemed to be mutual. Irrespective of the "failed to obey the instructions of the crew" angle, how the hell did it spiral out of control in the first place? There's more to this, and the reasons could be ugly.

Weight and balance on a jet when two males change seats - give me a break! Jet passengers are not weighed - standard weights are used.

He was tasered for failing to follow a direction from the coppers, not for wanting to swap seats.

It was his inability to follow directions in the first place that led to the cops turning up.

His argument over his entitlement to swap seats is an entirely seperate issue, the two should not be confused.

I would guess it could of been a 321 with multiple head counts incorrect then CC going to the manifest to rectify. it was picked up when they were looking for a female name and ther was a male name in the seat.
Or they just could have seen him do it.

So then they ask where should you be sitting and he points to where the female is and they go "Are you Jane Doe?" and she says yes , well that makes the head count ok because we know she is on board, so move along nothing to see here. Jane Doe is on the aircraft. What if the wife was sitting in the swapped seat. If they were doing the head count and saw a female in the seat would they have queried who she was? I bet not. Then, horror of horrors, the aircraft would have departed with someone in the wrong seat!!!
So not seeing him do it results in the aircraft departing and flying to it's destination safely, with no screaming match or tasering prior to departure, but seeing him do it results in a screaming match and a tasering? You have to ask if making the fuss is worth it. Does it really matter what seat you sit in as long as you are actually on the aircraft? It's not like they do an ID check on everyone to ensure the seating matches the manifest each and every time before departure.
If they had asked the cabin crew if they could swap and been given permission, especially in the hustle and bustle of boarding, is that ever noted anywhere? Is the change radioed or ACARS back to base so that the all important paperwork is kept up to date. My a*se it ever would be.
As for the vital "paperwork", there is no need for anyone on board to even prove they are who they claim to be anyway. There is no requirement to show ID buying the ticket, checking in, getting on board, or after seating to confirm that the right people are in the right seat (apparently a vital safety consideration!). So what does it really matter who sits where? If the head count (that's if they even do one) matches the expected number they're closing the door and going. They wouldn't have a clue who is actually on board or who is sitting where. It's all just assumptions.

Wrong again.

I believe their system works on 3 aircraft zones and not on the individual seat. So a person can be anywhere in a particular zone (front or back) yet have no effect on the weight and balance calculations.

Please get your facts right before making false statements. Seems obvious here who doesn't know about weight and balance.

So if he had swapped seats without asking after take off would they have turned the plane around and had the police meet them on the tarmac?

Actually it's been going off the rails since the end of the first world war when people discovered those in authority were mostly incompetent.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that, inferring from the "personalities" I can see in the video, quite probably.

How very Australian.
There is a minor seating issue, CC can't be bothered to make the effort to help so the pax sorts it out for himself with a another. Uh Oh, he didn't count on the hurt EGO did he, so let the escalation begin. Oh, and the cops were just waiting to bring out their thuggery.

I noticed CC (and police?) instructing passengers quite firmly not to film. Anyone know the legal position regarding this?

Day Jar Voo, so tell us pray tell how you would handle this belligerent and defiant individual?? While you are at you might like to enlighten us why it is “very Australian”.

I often found back when I was an airline Capitano that on the ground it was fairly easy to diffuse a situation by the Captain just being present.

Pax who had paid for emergency exit but had crutches, pax paid for xyz but some other issue, pax etc…..

I would never compromise the CSM’s position but merely assist. Often at times just standing in the galley when issues, amazing how quickly passengers would change their tune with CC when Captain came out.

Of course I have no idea what happened in this instance, however it is amazing that a situation can get to the taser point.

Not every pilot has the confidence to step out the flight deck (yes only on the ground), but as I said, personally I saw the change in pax behaviour several times by doing this.

If on private property one needs permission to film. It used to be written in the fine print in the in flight magazine but I think they gave up.
Public areas are fair game. Notice our ever friendly media will film in a public terminal but not inside a privately owned aircraft.
There is a caveat if you believe an offence is being committed.

Is the interior of an aircraft providing public transport considered private property, I would say yes. different rules apply for public and private property? Public is OK, private property the owner dictates the rules.

https://lawpath.com.au/blog/legal-film-public-places

He got what he asked for.
Shut up, listen and stop arguing.
If sitting in a cramped tin can stresses you too
much, you will have to look for a different mode of transportation.

”Get the police and I will go.”
Well, he didn’t,
didn’t shut up,
didn’t listen - behaves like a dog - and is treated like one.

Get him off the plane and get everyone else to where they want to go!

Totally agree, though the times are changing. Some of the newer breed need their safe spaces and would probably feel threatened by having to deal with anything remotely confrontational.

So many uneducated/unwashed /know it all DHs on this forum nowadays, oh the joys of the internet.
I sit here staring in disbelief at some of the idiot comments on here, particularly by non transport category pilots/SLF.
Old mate booked seats that weren't together, probably to get a good deal, end of frigging story. Wether or not you hate Jetstar this is not their fault. They weren't sending old mate off to the Russian front for 20 years, just asking him to sit in his allocated seat for a few hours, possibly within earshot of his beloved new born child.
Faaark some people really need to get the F over themselves

There is no doubt, private property. A train or terminal is public. Some catches though, for example you are in your front garden mowing the lawn in your bikini and I drive past and snap a photo. That is legal as there is no expectation of privacy even though you are on private property as I can see you from a public road.

So in summary, by the letter of the law if crew ask you to stop filming and you don’t then you have failed to follow a lawful instruction and can be removed from the aircraft. Good luck with that.

It’s all in the how right? If I quietly ask the CM if I can swap if the other passenger agrees and make a point of being polite and respectful it would probably be successful. This tool behaved like a child.

What he said.
Recently spent 3 months travelling around Europe on trains, aircraft and ferries. Bought tickets, often printed with a seat number, over which I had no control.
Found seat, sat down, made the most of the scenery.or food (such as it was), got to destination at the same time as the other hundreds on board. Job done, no one disrupting the system with seat swaps.
​​​​This guy could have just complied.and maybe later could have had a whinge on a review site like TripAdvisor.
​​​​​​Instead, what's the bet when he called in the cops he was hoping to play the victim/race card and it backfired?

One time I was travelling SYD-SIN on SQ. I went to take my seat and a guy was there (economy) who said he would like to sit next to his wife.
The seat he offered me was in Business. We both cleared it with the Purser and I had a very comfortable flight. The crew were amazed he was happy to sit in economy and give up a good seat. I expect it was company travel and had to pay for his wife.

Im guessing you’re not married ?

They should bill this idiot for the cost of the electricity used to charge the taser.